4 ms·

>whole screen content is controlled by the app. That is not the purpose of full screen mode. If that were the case, then notifications and menu bars would be a

>whole screen content is controlled by the app. That is not the purpose of full screen mode. If that were the case, then notifications and menu bars would be able to be disabled by the app. They're not. They need to be disabled or muted by the user at the OS level.

_ph_ 5y ago
About which OS are you talking? On MacOS and Linux, a program can go to full screen mode without any user interaction. The last time I saw a powerpoint presentation on Windows, it also didn't have a menu bar or task bar in presentation model. So what are you talking about?
- dkonofalski 5y ago
  Let's say you're giving a PowerPoint and an app crashes in the background (for whatever reason). PowerPoint cannot prevent an OS alert from popping up on the screen. macOS has functions to hide the menu bar in full-screen apps but it does not have functions to stop other OS chrome from appearing.
  - _ph_ 5y ago
    Yes, there are circumstances where the OS is overriding the full screen mode of an application. Usually only in the case of very significant events or user interaction - like moving your mouse to the screen top will show the menu bar on Mac OS. But all of this isn't shown permanentely on top of the full screen app and only triggered by special events.
    - dkonofalski 5y ago
      That's not the point. The point is that it can happen during a performance unless you're using a dedicated piece of I/O hardware. They give you 100% control over what gets outputted. Just because people were ok with what the OS displayed before doesn't mean that that it couldn't.
      - _ph_ 5y ago
        We are talking about different things. Yes, you cannot 100% prevent a dialog to appear without custom hardware. And of course, even with custom hardware, the OS could decide to disable it to stop output to it. But this isn't the point. So far, there were full screen modes and the OS would honor those under regular circumstances. When I run a Linux VM on a Mac, I can see the whole Linux desktop full screen. I don't want MacOS draw colored dots on top of my Linux VM. People probably don't want yellow dots on their PowerPoint presentation.
        dkonofalski 5y ago
        No, we're not. The only difference in what we're talking about is that you were ok with the exact same thing as now because you liked/agreed with what the OS was putting on the screen. Whether it was because it was rare or uncommon is completely besides the point. This whole thread is about people who are saying that the dot makes the display "unusable". If that was the case, then any other OS chrome would also make it unusable.
        _ph_ 5y ago
        No, that is wrong. So far the OS didn't display anything permanentely on top of a full screen app. It was only as a reaction to user input and exceptional situations. Especially (under MacOS), when the full screen app was runninning on a secondary screen. I can only hope/assume, I misunderstood the article or this is just a bug.
        dkonofalski 5y ago
        No, it's not wrong. That's what I said. It still doesn't do anything permanently. It only does it if you're using audio input actively. That's a reaction to user input. You're enabling a recording device and that's what triggers this OS chrome. Whether you agree with that is irrelevant since full-screen mode has always allowed OS chrome.
        5y ago
  - yjftsjthsd-h 5y ago
    Isn't that Do Not Disturb mode?
_ph_ 5y ago
As a p.s. to my last comment: I just tried a silly Gtk based tetris I had written some ago under MacOS: hit the green maximize button and it goes completely full screen. The only thing you still see is the mouse pointer - I am sure there is an API to make that invisible too, if one wanted to hide the mouse pointer. I have never ever owened a computer where an application could not controle the whole screen. Yes, there are situations, where the OS supersedes the full screen apps input, but usually they are based on user interactions or notifications (which can be disabled).
- dkonofalski 5y ago
  >I have never ever owened a computer where an application could not controle the whole screen. Yes you have. Every OS has chrome that cannot be disabled in full-screen. You may not regularly experience that, but it does. Imagine you're playing a video game and Windows Update throws an error. That will be displayed over your full-screen game window. It doesn't even have to be originated by the OS. As long as the OS is provided with an extended display, it has the ability to put things on top of whatever your app displays. It may not happen often but it does happen. That's the primary reason why dedicate I/O hardware exists.
  - _ph_ 5y ago
    As I wrote in the answer to your other comment, I have never claimed, that there aren't events that can cause the OS to supersede a fullscreen app. But by default, the OS does not display additional information on top of a full screen app. And perhaps we should discuss the same thing only in one thread.
marcosdumay 5y ago
Hum... What goes or doesn't go into a full screen app should be controlled by the user at the OS, with no involvement of the app. That still doesn't change the fact that the point in making an app full screen is to give it control of the entire screen (or an entire virtual one of your choosing).

_ph_ 5y ago

About which OS are you talking? On MacOS and Linux, a program can go to full screen mode without any user interaction. The last time I saw a powerpoint presentation on Windows, it also didn't have a menu bar or task bar in presentation model. So what are you talking about?

dkonofalski 5y ago
Let's say you're giving a PowerPoint and an app crashes in the background (for whatever reason). PowerPoint cannot prevent an OS alert from popping up on the screen. macOS has functions to hide the menu bar in full-screen apps but it does not have functions to stop other OS chrome from appearing.
- _ph_ 5y ago
  Yes, there are circumstances where the OS is overriding the full screen mode of an application. Usually only in the case of very significant events or user interaction - like moving your mouse to the screen top will show the menu bar on Mac OS. But all of this isn't shown permanentely on top of the full screen app and only triggered by special events.
  - dkonofalski 5y ago
    That's not the point. The point is that it can happen during a performance unless you're using a dedicated piece of I/O hardware. They give you 100% control over what gets outputted. Just because people were ok with what the OS displayed before doesn't mean that that it couldn't.
    - _ph_ 5y ago
      We are talking about different things. Yes, you cannot 100% prevent a dialog to appear without custom hardware. And of course, even with custom hardware, the OS could decide to disable it to stop output to it. But this isn't the point. So far, there were full screen modes and the OS would honor those under regular circumstances. When I run a Linux VM on a Mac, I can see the whole Linux desktop full screen. I don't want MacOS draw colored dots on top of my Linux VM. People probably don't want yellow dots on their PowerPoint presentation.
      - dkonofalski 5y ago
        No, we're not. The only difference in what we're talking about is that you were ok with the exact same thing as now because you liked/agreed with what the OS was putting on the screen. Whether it was because it was rare or uncommon is completely besides the point. This whole thread is about people who are saying that the dot makes the display "unusable". If that was the case, then any other OS chrome would also make it unusable.
        _ph_ 5y ago
        No, that is wrong. So far the OS didn't display anything permanentely on top of a full screen app. It was only as a reaction to user input and exceptional situations. Especially (under MacOS), when the full screen app was runninning on a secondary screen. I can only hope/assume, I misunderstood the article or this is just a bug.
        dkonofalski 5y ago
        No, it's not wrong. That's what I said. It still doesn't do anything permanently. It only does it if you're using audio input actively. That's a reaction to user input. You're enabling a recording device and that's what triggers this OS chrome. Whether you agree with that is irrelevant since full-screen mode has always allowed OS chrome.
        5y ago
- yjftsjthsd-h 5y ago
  Isn't that Do Not Disturb mode?

_ph_ 5y ago

As a p.s. to my last comment: I just tried a silly Gtk based tetris I had written some ago under MacOS: hit the green maximize button and it goes completely full screen. The only thing you still see is the mouse pointer - I am sure there is an API to make that invisible too, if one wanted to hide the mouse pointer. I have never ever owened a computer where an application could not controle the whole screen. Yes, there are situations, where the OS supersedes the full screen apps input, but usually they are based on user interactions or notifications (which can be disabled).

dkonofalski 5y ago
>I have never ever owened a computer where an application could not controle the whole screen. Yes you have. Every OS has chrome that cannot be disabled in full-screen. You may not regularly experience that, but it does. Imagine you're playing a video game and Windows Update throws an error. That will be displayed over your full-screen game window. It doesn't even have to be originated by the OS. As long as the OS is provided with an extended display, it has the ability to put things on top of whatever your app displays. It may not happen often but it does happen. That's the primary reason why dedicate I/O hardware exists.
- _ph_ 5y ago
  As I wrote in the answer to your other comment, I have never claimed, that there aren't events that can cause the OS to supersede a fullscreen app. But by default, the OS does not display additional information on top of a full screen app. And perhaps we should discuss the same thing only in one thread.

marcosdumay 5y ago

Hum... What goes or doesn't go into a full screen app should be controlled by the user at the OS, with no involvement of the app. That still doesn't change the fact that the point in making an app full screen is to give it control of the entire screen (or an entire virtual one of your choosing).