6 ms·

I'm not sure the taxpayers will pay for that if you are unvaccinated. This pill is for "high-risk patients who took the antiviral within three days of symptom

by bhaak 5y ago

I'm not sure the taxpayers will pay for that if you are unvaccinated. This pill is for "high-risk patients who took the antiviral within three days of symptom onset". The vaccination even seems to be a bit more effective than this pill?

johnisgood 5y ago
But I am not vaccinated for health reasons. When are we going to start differentiating? Were I not a freelancer, I would have lost my job because I am not vaccinated, for health reasons. It is a pretty shitty thing to do to people.
- chki 5y ago
  I'm sorry if this is inappropriate but what health reasons prevent you from getting vaccinated?
  - ceejayoz 5y ago
  - Msw242 5y ago
    There are allergies to vaccines (not to the dose, but to everything else that is in the concoction that enables it to work). Also, immunocompromised people often can't take vaccines. Usually you can get a doctor's note explaining this, and you can participate in daily life normally (like going to school or college, which rightfully require vaccinations). I don't know if policy around the COVID vaccine is different... But I'd be surprised if it were?
    - CydeWeys 5y ago
      > Also, immunocompromised people often can't take vaccines. Nope. Immunocompromised people need extra doses of the vaccine, and even then it doesn't work as well. This is one of those false talking points that antivaxxers love to spread.
      - Msw242 5y ago
        With over 300mm Americans, there is no one treatment plan for the entire country. Not every physician is recommending every single one of their patients get this or any other vaccine. There are public policy implications for serving those people.
      - mlyle 5y ago
        It's just conflating/confused: * Immunocompromised people have poor efficacy with the vaccine even with boosters, like my dad who has SLL. * Other people who have autoimmune and inflammatory conditions are often immunocompromised (because of taking low dose chemotherapy, etc, to manage their conditions). Also, recommending a vaccine for these people is complicated, because vaccines can kick up immune and inflammatory responses and make their conditions worse. Most are still better off with the vaccine but I can understand both providers and patients being hesitant.
        CydeWeys 5y ago
        In all these cases, though, the immunocompromised person who is not greatly benefiting from the vaccine is at much greater risk of dying from COVID. The sane response for them is to be very very careful about any potential exposure, NOT to get exempted from the vaccine requirement and then go do insanely risky face-to-face activities that otherwise would have a vaccine mandate. My friend is immunocompromised from chemotherapy, has had (I believe) at least 4 COVID shots by now, and just had to go to the hospital for monoclonal antibodies after catching COVID. Not getting vaccinated, then getting a vaccine waiver instead of the vaccine, then going and doing in-person stuff that would've otherwise required the vaccine would've been practically suicidal for her.
        mlyle 5y ago
        > In all these cases, In the second case, the person choosing the vaccine has a high risk of, say, a debilitating RA flareup and an uncertain amount of protection given their immunocompromised status. I can totally understand why some in this position choose not to. They probably should, but this is not as clear-cut of a decision as for those of us with normal immune capability. No one knows the exact efficacy they can expect nor the amount of risk of side effect they are shouldering. > NOT to get exempted from the vaccine requirement and then go do insanely risky face-to-face activities that otherwise would have a vaccine mandate. Yah, I don't think anyone advocated for quite that-- just some middle ground where they can choose to assume some risk. A lot of us hoped that perhaps population immunity could do the work of shielding these people, but it looks like that ship has sailed.
    - greyface- 5y ago
      > There are allergies to vaccines (not to the dose, but to everything else that is in the concoction that enables it to work). There are multiple vaccine formulations available, and they largely do not overlap in terms of potential allergy triggers. If you're allergic to a component of the mRNA vaccines, that does not preclude you from taking an adenovirus vaccine, or vice versa. https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/vaccines/recommendations/specific-groups/allergies.html https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/vaccines/recommend...
  - treeman79 5y ago
    I have a severe reaction to almost all medications. I already had covid twice. Once before vaccines were ready. Second time was only annoying. So yea. I have no interest in it. Though if I hadn’t had covid already I would definitely get vaccine. Being told I “must” get it is definitely provoking a “hell no” reaction on top of everything.
    - 14u2c 5y ago
      > So yea. I have no interest in it. Though if I hadn’t had covid already I would definitely get vaccine. Well I guess the mandate is working, because based on this response you are an individual that I would prefer not to be exposed to in the workplace without the mandated testing. This is not a judgement of personal worth, just an observation that you are not behaving rationally. Top down policies such as the mandate are helpful for the whole in the these situations.
      - treeman79 5y ago
      - deleted 5y ago
        [deleted]
- solarkraft 5y ago
  There's always an exception for people who can't be vaccinated. They're a big reason everyone else needs to be vaccinated, after all.
  - dnautics 5y ago
    IIRC Vaccination seems to do a poor job of preventing person-to-person transmission of delta (and likely, even less, omicron). If you are currently getting vaccinated, you should be doing it for selfish reasons, and you should not count on it to protect, say, a vulnerable or unvaccinated person you live with.
    - Msw242 5y ago
      It's not perfect, but the vaccinated people shed way less virus, and are contagious for a much shorter window of time. Also, it makes you less likely to take a bed in the ICU, preserving that bed for grandma's stroke
      - mlyle 5y ago
        > It's not perfect, but the vaccinated people shed way less virus, and are contagious for a much shorter window of time. And are significantly less likely to get infected in the first place. My dad has SLL, which some of the worst breakthrough cases have been in. He's vaccinated (with likely poor efficacy). His children and grandchildren are vaccinated. We're careful with our overall level of exposure and wear a mask around him even in situations where this seems paranoid. Us being vaccinated is one of the many layers (and one of the most effective, pre-Omicron) in protecting my dad.
      - refurb 5y ago
        The Lancet data suggests the effect is pretty small in terms of transmission. And the fact that countries like Singapore with 95%+ of eligible vaccinated, strict distancing measures still had a ton of cases demonstrates that in the real world.
- sudosysgen 5y ago
  At least where I live, if you cannot get vaccinated for health reasons you will be considered as if you were vaccinated.
  - johnisgood 5y ago
    That sounds good. Someone commented that my employer is supposed to consider the contraindication and whatnot, but it really is not the case, at least not as far as the law goes. My employer could consider it, but does not have to. I am going to the dentist and I need a negative PCR test every 48h, and it is expensive. :/
- Klinky 5y ago
  There is already a differentiation. Your employer would still need to accommodate your vaccine allergy/contradiction, so long as there is medical documentation backing your claim. You would then go into weekly testing protocol if you needed to be onsite[1]. If you're 100% remote you could even get out of doing the weekly testing[2]. 1. https://www.osha.gov/coronavirus/ets2/faqs#accordion-81470-collapse1 https://www.osha.gov/coronavirus/ets2/faqs#accordion-81470-c... 2. https://www.osha.gov/coronavirus/ets2/faqs#accordion-81493-collapse1 https://www.osha.gov/coronavirus/ets2/faqs#accordion-81493-c...
mlyle 5y ago
> I'm not sure the taxpayers will pay for that if you are unvaccinated. Just about no matter what it costs, it's cheaper than you dying in an ICU.

by bhaak 5y ago

johnisgood 5y ago

But I am not vaccinated for health reasons. When are we going to start differentiating? Were I not a freelancer, I would have lost my job because I am not vaccinated, for health reasons. It is a pretty shitty thing to do to people.

chki 5y ago
I'm sorry if this is inappropriate but what health reasons prevent you from getting vaccinated?
- ceejayoz 5y ago
- Msw242 5y ago
  There are allergies to vaccines (not to the dose, but to everything else that is in the concoction that enables it to work). Also, immunocompromised people often can't take vaccines. Usually you can get a doctor's note explaining this, and you can participate in daily life normally (like going to school or college, which rightfully require vaccinations). I don't know if policy around the COVID vaccine is different... But I'd be surprised if it were?
  - CydeWeys 5y ago
    > Also, immunocompromised people often can't take vaccines. Nope. Immunocompromised people need extra doses of the vaccine, and even then it doesn't work as well. This is one of those false talking points that antivaxxers love to spread.
    - Msw242 5y ago
      With over 300mm Americans, there is no one treatment plan for the entire country. Not every physician is recommending every single one of their patients get this or any other vaccine. There are public policy implications for serving those people.
    - mlyle 5y ago
      It's just conflating/confused: * Immunocompromised people have poor efficacy with the vaccine even with boosters, like my dad who has SLL. * Other people who have autoimmune and inflammatory conditions are often immunocompromised (because of taking low dose chemotherapy, etc, to manage their conditions). Also, recommending a vaccine for these people is complicated, because vaccines can kick up immune and inflammatory responses and make their conditions worse. Most are still better off with the vaccine but I can understand both providers and patients being hesitant.
      - CydeWeys 5y ago
        In all these cases, though, the immunocompromised person who is not greatly benefiting from the vaccine is at much greater risk of dying from COVID. The sane response for them is to be very very careful about any potential exposure, NOT to get exempted from the vaccine requirement and then go do insanely risky face-to-face activities that otherwise would have a vaccine mandate. My friend is immunocompromised from chemotherapy, has had (I believe) at least 4 COVID shots by now, and just had to go to the hospital for monoclonal antibodies after catching COVID. Not getting vaccinated, then getting a vaccine waiver instead of the vaccine, then going and doing in-person stuff that would've otherwise required the vaccine would've been practically suicidal for her.
        mlyle 5y ago
        > In all these cases, In the second case, the person choosing the vaccine has a high risk of, say, a debilitating RA flareup and an uncertain amount of protection given their immunocompromised status. I can totally understand why some in this position choose not to. They probably should, but this is not as clear-cut of a decision as for those of us with normal immune capability. No one knows the exact efficacy they can expect nor the amount of risk of side effect they are shouldering. > NOT to get exempted from the vaccine requirement and then go do insanely risky face-to-face activities that otherwise would have a vaccine mandate. Yah, I don't think anyone advocated for quite that-- just some middle ground where they can choose to assume some risk. A lot of us hoped that perhaps population immunity could do the work of shielding these people, but it looks like that ship has sailed.
  - greyface- 5y ago
    > There are allergies to vaccines (not to the dose, but to everything else that is in the concoction that enables it to work). There are multiple vaccine formulations available, and they largely do not overlap in terms of potential allergy triggers. If you're allergic to a component of the mRNA vaccines, that does not preclude you from taking an adenovirus vaccine, or vice versa. https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/vaccines/recommendations/specific-groups/allergies.html https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/vaccines/recommend...
- treeman79 5y ago
  I have a severe reaction to almost all medications. I already had covid twice. Once before vaccines were ready. Second time was only annoying. So yea. I have no interest in it. Though if I hadn’t had covid already I would definitely get vaccine. Being told I “must” get it is definitely provoking a “hell no” reaction on top of everything.
  - 14u2c 5y ago
    > So yea. I have no interest in it. Though if I hadn’t had covid already I would definitely get vaccine. Well I guess the mandate is working, because based on this response you are an individual that I would prefer not to be exposed to in the workplace without the mandated testing. This is not a judgement of personal worth, just an observation that you are not behaving rationally. Top down policies such as the mandate are helpful for the whole in the these situations.
    - treeman79 5y ago
    - deleted 5y ago
      [deleted]
solarkraft 5y ago
There's always an exception for people who can't be vaccinated. They're a big reason everyone else needs to be vaccinated, after all.
- dnautics 5y ago
  IIRC Vaccination seems to do a poor job of preventing person-to-person transmission of delta (and likely, even less, omicron). If you are currently getting vaccinated, you should be doing it for selfish reasons, and you should not count on it to protect, say, a vulnerable or unvaccinated person you live with.
  - Msw242 5y ago
    It's not perfect, but the vaccinated people shed way less virus, and are contagious for a much shorter window of time. Also, it makes you less likely to take a bed in the ICU, preserving that bed for grandma's stroke
    - mlyle 5y ago
      > It's not perfect, but the vaccinated people shed way less virus, and are contagious for a much shorter window of time. And are significantly less likely to get infected in the first place. My dad has SLL, which some of the worst breakthrough cases have been in. He's vaccinated (with likely poor efficacy). His children and grandchildren are vaccinated. We're careful with our overall level of exposure and wear a mask around him even in situations where this seems paranoid. Us being vaccinated is one of the many layers (and one of the most effective, pre-Omicron) in protecting my dad.
    - refurb 5y ago
      The Lancet data suggests the effect is pretty small in terms of transmission. And the fact that countries like Singapore with 95%+ of eligible vaccinated, strict distancing measures still had a ton of cases demonstrates that in the real world.
sudosysgen 5y ago
At least where I live, if you cannot get vaccinated for health reasons you will be considered as if you were vaccinated.
- johnisgood 5y ago
  That sounds good. Someone commented that my employer is supposed to consider the contraindication and whatnot, but it really is not the case, at least not as far as the law goes. My employer could consider it, but does not have to. I am going to the dentist and I need a negative PCR test every 48h, and it is expensive. :/
Klinky 5y ago
There is already a differentiation. Your employer would still need to accommodate your vaccine allergy/contradiction, so long as there is medical documentation backing your claim. You would then go into weekly testing protocol if you needed to be onsite[1]. If you're 100% remote you could even get out of doing the weekly testing[2]. 1. https://www.osha.gov/coronavirus/ets2/faqs#accordion-81470-collapse1 https://www.osha.gov/coronavirus/ets2/faqs#accordion-81470-c... 2. https://www.osha.gov/coronavirus/ets2/faqs#accordion-81493-collapse1 https://www.osha.gov/coronavirus/ets2/faqs#accordion-81493-c...

mlyle 5y ago

> I'm not sure the taxpayers will pay for that if you are unvaccinated. Just about no matter what it costs, it's cheaper than you dying in an ICU.