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This isn't some kids bullying another kid. These are adults representing a national government. This is a nation bullying someone inside the United States for e

This isn't some kids bullying another kid. These are adults representing a national government. This is a nation bullying someone inside the United States for exercising free speech. The message needs to be received in Beijing, not merely Indiana.

echelon 5y ago
Showing them a kindness that they wouldn't receive back home might break through to them, or it might not. The situation should definitely carry gravity and have consequences for repeat offenses. I think a bigger problem is two-fold: 1) Universities are addicted to Chinese student tuition funds, and they don't want to rock the boat. I doubt they care as much about the students themselves. My university totally half assed their program (eg. some Chinese students would have questions that went unanswered, professors tended to pay them less attention, etc.), and I felt so sorry for the students. 2) Chinese students tend to stick in groups together rather than be integrated and mixed amongst the other student populations. They're assigned the same dormitory blocks, do shopping/dining together, and they don't really get to experience America in the same way that other international students do. Not sure if this is due to design or negligence.
- cloverich 5y ago
  It is kind of interesting. At my college, we had large batches of students from (Mexican) migrant workers in our dorms. With very few exceptions the majority of two person dorms were 1:1 matching one of them with a second generation (and onwards) citizen. I thought it was a great way to expose all of us to both integration and diversity. It wasn't smooth for everyone of course, yet I thought it was a good balance of culturally jarring experiences, while still providing close proximity to people from the same background (e.g. several migrant worker kids in same hall still). I haven't really thought much about that since College but kind of assumed most places did something similar. (We also had specific classes that highlighted migrant worker issues / history).
JumpCrisscross 5y ago
> adults representing a national government Legally adults, perhaps, but I think we have a social consensus that most college students are kids. Their brains haven't fully developed. If they're coming out of a brainwashed environment, they may never have been explicitly told that this is wrong; they deserve a second chance. > message needs to be received in Beijing, not merely Indiana I agree. My vote would be for a new foreign-student visa ban on the children of CCP members until Beijing commits to quit being petulant. But hit Beijing, the people commanding spooks to harass the parents of a student in a different country telling historical stories that scare them.
- bubblethink 5y ago
  >Legally adults, perhaps, but I think we have a social consensus that most college students are kids. US universities are famously litigious and take a hard line stance when it suits them. See Aaron Swartz. So, I don't buy the 'they are still kids' line. That is, I don't condone it, but I don't agree that universities are motivated by this sort of reasoning.
  - woodruffw 5y ago
    > US universities are famously litigious and take a hard line stance when it suits them. See Aaron Swartz. MIT was not a party to the lawsuit against Aaron Swartz, nor was even JSTOR. It was brought entirely by the US Attorney for Massachusetts.
    - syshum 5y ago
      They claim that after the fact, after the bad press, I believe neither JSTOR or MIT
      - woodruffw 5y ago
        You don't have to believe them. You can look at the court records yourself, or any number of public case summaries[1]. To quote: > Opting not to pursue a civil lawsuit against him, JSTOR reached a settlement with him in the summer of 2011 in which Swartz turned over the downloaded data to them. It was never released to the public. Neither did MIT take any civil action against him. The lawsuit was a purely Justice initiative. [1]: https://fija.org/library-and-resources/library/law-and-legal-cases/aaron-swartz.html https://fija.org/library-and-resources/library/law-and-legal...
deleted 5y ago
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flenserboy 5y ago
Yes. One has to wonder just how many of these students are students, and not "students" — at Purdue & everywhere else.

echelon 5y ago

Showing them a kindness that they wouldn't receive back home might break through to them, or it might not. The situation should definitely carry gravity and have consequences for repeat offenses. I think a bigger problem is two-fold: 1) Universities are addicted to Chinese student tuition funds, and they don't want to rock the boat. I doubt they care as much about the students themselves. My university totally half assed their program (eg. some Chinese students would have questions that went unanswered, professors tended to pay them less attention, etc.), and I felt so sorry for the students. 2) Chinese students tend to stick in groups together rather than be integrated and mixed amongst the other student populations. They're assigned the same dormitory blocks, do shopping/dining together, and they don't really get to experience America in the same way that other international students do. Not sure if this is due to design or negligence.

cloverich 5y ago
It is kind of interesting. At my college, we had large batches of students from (Mexican) migrant workers in our dorms. With very few exceptions the majority of two person dorms were 1:1 matching one of them with a second generation (and onwards) citizen. I thought it was a great way to expose all of us to both integration and diversity. It wasn't smooth for everyone of course, yet I thought it was a good balance of culturally jarring experiences, while still providing close proximity to people from the same background (e.g. several migrant worker kids in same hall still). I haven't really thought much about that since College but kind of assumed most places did something similar. (We also had specific classes that highlighted migrant worker issues / history).

JumpCrisscross 5y ago

> adults representing a national government Legally adults, perhaps, but I think we have a social consensus that most college students are kids. Their brains haven't fully developed. If they're coming out of a brainwashed environment, they may never have been explicitly told that this is wrong; they deserve a second chance. > message needs to be received in Beijing, not merely Indiana I agree. My vote would be for a new foreign-student visa ban on the children of CCP members until Beijing commits to quit being petulant. But hit Beijing, the people commanding spooks to harass the parents of a student in a different country telling historical stories that scare them.

bubblethink 5y ago
>Legally adults, perhaps, but I think we have a social consensus that most college students are kids. US universities are famously litigious and take a hard line stance when it suits them. See Aaron Swartz. So, I don't buy the 'they are still kids' line. That is, I don't condone it, but I don't agree that universities are motivated by this sort of reasoning.
- woodruffw 5y ago
  > US universities are famously litigious and take a hard line stance when it suits them. See Aaron Swartz. MIT was not a party to the lawsuit against Aaron Swartz, nor was even JSTOR. It was brought entirely by the US Attorney for Massachusetts.
  - syshum 5y ago
    They claim that after the fact, after the bad press, I believe neither JSTOR or MIT
    - woodruffw 5y ago
      You don't have to believe them. You can look at the court records yourself, or any number of public case summaries[1]. To quote: > Opting not to pursue a civil lawsuit against him, JSTOR reached a settlement with him in the summer of 2011 in which Swartz turned over the downloaded data to them. It was never released to the public. Neither did MIT take any civil action against him. The lawsuit was a purely Justice initiative. [1]: https://fija.org/library-and-resources/library/law-and-legal-cases/aaron-swartz.html https://fija.org/library-and-resources/library/law-and-legal...

deleted 5y ago

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flenserboy 5y ago

Yes. One has to wonder just how many of these students are students, and not "students" — at Purdue & everywhere else.