4 ms·

Too late to change name to "ublocklist"?

by pbreit 5y ago

Gigachad 5y ago
Why would they do that? The extension implements blacklisting domains.
- dgemm 5y ago
  Part of an industry wide effort to replace the term "blacklist" due to connotations.
  - dymk 5y ago
    GitHub and some other big companies put effort into this, but other than that, it’s a pet project for people with too much time on their hands. Give it a few years and nobody will remember what the big deal was.
  - badsoftware 5y ago
    I believe this is also a cultural/political effort to create problems where they don’t exist.
  - rightly 5y ago
    I am part of an industry wide efforts to add more of this term.
beervirus 5y ago
^^^ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wdxQnOgtzBI https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wdxQnOgtzBI
greenyoda 5y ago
"ublocklist" could easily get confused with "uBlock origin", a very widely used browser extension. Even "Ublacklist" could give the misleading impression that it's somehow related to uBlock or uMatrix.
deleted 5y ago
[deleted]
neilv 5y ago
Non-creative name: "SearchDenylist" Reasons: * I think of the "u" prefix in this narrow technology niche (browser-based filtering) as almost a trademark of the great project now called "uBlock Origin". * "Blacklist" isn't a term to be making new uses of in the US. (Given ongoing history of racial injustices, and how the terms "blacklist" and "whitelist" have been used in our field to designate "bad" and "good", respectively. Someone can try to argue the etymology, but we're beyond etymology in connotations of the terms now, and it's just insensitive to insist on saying "black" to mean "bad".)
- gameman144 5y ago
  So I'm not trying to start a flamewar or anything, genuinely curious to learn more about your view here. Is your viewpoint that "blacklist" is a racial term in itself, i.e. is used in a racial sense? I've never seen that, and my understanding is that's not the case historically, but call me out if I'm wrong and that's your point. Based on your comments on disregarding etymology, my understanding is that you're not making the first point. I'm reading your viewpoint more as: "we shouldn't use 'black' as an abstract connotation for 'bad' meanings in words", (presumably due to 'black' being also associated with a group that has a history of racially-motivated prejudice against it, but let me know if this last part is wrong). I'm also curious if your view is that no colors that have historically described groups should be used as negative descriptors, or is this specific to black people in English? For instance, is your view that phrases like "white bread" to describe boring people, or "brown noser" to describe suck-ups should go away as well? Additionally, should abstract phrases/words involving the term "black" should be done away with entirely, or that only ones with negative connotations should be avoided? For instance, is it okay for "black ties" to associate "black" with formality, or for "in the black" to be used for businesses that are very successful? I think I disagree that "blacklist" needs to be associated with black people any more than "white noise" noise needs to be associated with white people. The color black has a long association with a variety of different things, from death ("Black plague") to authority ("Black Rod"), from luxury ("Black Card") to villainy ("Black Hat"). One of the many associations of "black" is with a particular racial group, but that doesn't mean we have to attribute all the associations of that word with that racial group. It seems to me that if the word itself has no history of racial origin, isn't used today in scenarios of racial prejudice, and the association is not related to a racial group, it seems unnecessary to avoid it. Like I said, though, I'd definitely love to get a different perspective here.
agensaequivocum 5y ago
Please no.

Too late to change name to "ublocklist"?

by pbreit 5y ago

Too late to change name to "ublocklist"?

Gigachad 5y ago

Why would they do that? The extension implements blacklisting domains.

dgemm 5y ago
Part of an industry wide effort to replace the term "blacklist" due to connotations.
- dymk 5y ago
  GitHub and some other big companies put effort into this, but other than that, it’s a pet project for people with too much time on their hands. Give it a few years and nobody will remember what the big deal was.
- badsoftware 5y ago
  I believe this is also a cultural/political effort to create problems where they don’t exist.
- rightly 5y ago
  I am part of an industry wide efforts to add more of this term.

beervirus 5y ago

^^^ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wdxQnOgtzBI https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wdxQnOgtzBI

greenyoda 5y ago

"ublocklist" could easily get confused with "uBlock origin", a very widely used browser extension. Even "Ublacklist" could give the misleading impression that it's somehow related to uBlock or uMatrix.

deleted 5y ago

[deleted]

neilv 5y ago

Non-creative name: "SearchDenylist" Reasons: * I think of the "u" prefix in this narrow technology niche (browser-based filtering) as almost a trademark of the great project now called "uBlock Origin". * "Blacklist" isn't a term to be making new uses of in the US. (Given ongoing history of racial injustices, and how the terms "blacklist" and "whitelist" have been used in our field to designate "bad" and "good", respectively. Someone can try to argue the etymology, but we're beyond etymology in connotations of the terms now, and it's just insensitive to insist on saying "black" to mean "bad".)

gameman144 5y ago
So I'm not trying to start a flamewar or anything, genuinely curious to learn more about your view here. Is your viewpoint that "blacklist" is a racial term in itself, i.e. is used in a racial sense? I've never seen that, and my understanding is that's not the case historically, but call me out if I'm wrong and that's your point. Based on your comments on disregarding etymology, my understanding is that you're not making the first point. I'm reading your viewpoint more as: "we shouldn't use 'black' as an abstract connotation for 'bad' meanings in words", (presumably due to 'black' being also associated with a group that has a history of racially-motivated prejudice against it, but let me know if this last part is wrong). I'm also curious if your view is that no colors that have historically described groups should be used as negative descriptors, or is this specific to black people in English? For instance, is your view that phrases like "white bread" to describe boring people, or "brown noser" to describe suck-ups should go away as well? Additionally, should abstract phrases/words involving the term "black" should be done away with entirely, or that only ones with negative connotations should be avoided? For instance, is it okay for "black ties" to associate "black" with formality, or for "in the black" to be used for businesses that are very successful? I think I disagree that "blacklist" needs to be associated with black people any more than "white noise" noise needs to be associated with white people. The color black has a long association with a variety of different things, from death ("Black plague") to authority ("Black Rod"), from luxury ("Black Card") to villainy ("Black Hat"). One of the many associations of "black" is with a particular racial group, but that doesn't mean we have to attribute all the associations of that word with that racial group. It seems to me that if the word itself has no history of racial origin, isn't used today in scenarios of racial prejudice, and the association is not related to a racial group, it seems unnecessary to avoid it. Like I said, though, I'd definitely love to get a different perspective here.

agensaequivocum 5y ago

Please no.