5 ms·

This is absurd victim blaming. The problem is there is a door handle that is designed with a failure mode such that pulling the handle DOES NOT OPEN THE DOOR.

rabuse 5y ago
Exactly. Couldn't they just have some system where the door handles have a magnetic dead-switch, that reverts to manual operation when no power is applied?
- brokenmachine 5y ago
  The battery might not have enough juice to unlock the doors, but still not be completely dead. Of course with good design that shouldn't be a problem.
seanp2k2 5y ago
I agree; it's like all the rollaway accidents that happen now because of electronic shifters: https://www.safetyresearch.net/the-persistence-of-rollaway/ https://www.safetyresearch.net/the-persistence-of-rollaway/ Design matters, and bad designs can literally be deadly. Why auto mfgs feel the need to "innovate" with shifter designs is beyond me. The worst part is how every mfg seems to be implementing a different design of bad electronic shifters, from wheels and touchscreens to one-click-at-a-time joysticks to single-function pushbuttons for some gears with others on a scroll wheel. They've taken something and made it worse with no benefit to the user. At least with those auto-flushing toilets, the intention was good, even if the implementation is still somehow so awful decades later.
- aidenn0 5y ago
  I drove a rental with a rotary-dial shifter. That is the single most braindead UX thing I've seen in a car that doesn't involve a touch-screen. We've had PRND(L) levers as the standard for shifting in automatics for over 50 years now, and the dial offers no advantages that I can see.
  - derekp7 5y ago
    My Ford Fusion has one of those rotary dials. Didn't like it at first, but it is nice having that air space free (not able to accidentally knock it out of gear, more room for an extra cup holder). Also the cars with a physical gear shift lever still work by activating switches, there hasn't been mechanical linkage for years in a lot of models.
  - selimthegrim 5y ago
    Pray tell what make and model this was so I can run as fast as my legs can take me in the opposite direction if Hertz tries to palm one off on me
    - devilbunny 5y ago
      I rented a Ford Edge two months ago that had one. It was quite distracting. At the end of a week, I still hadn't internalized how it worked. I had to think about it every time. On my old Chevrolet Tahoe, I can tell what gear I just shifted into by feel (shifting into D, it has a slight tendency to overshoot the normal overdrive mode and end up locked into 3rd). And of course, this is essentially a nonissue on manual transmissions.
      - aidenn0 5y ago
        Most cars have a stop at D; e.g. for the ones where you pull the stem towards to to leave park, you can let the stem spring back at neutral and push it down until it stops at D, and for the ones with a button you can release the button at neutral. [edit] Honestly if the rotary dial had similar tactile feedback, it would probably be fine. No worse than when they moved it off of the tree as bench seats were retired for safety reasons.
        devilbunny 5y ago
        Like I said - it has such a stop, it's just old and a bit worn. It's column shift despite bucket seats.
  - 5y ago
- betwixthewires 5y ago
  It's not just auto manufacturers. It seems literally everything is being designed with a philosophy of "fuck the user" in mind. I cannot think of a single thing more complicated than a concrete block that functions better now than previous versions did 10 years ago, and I'm sure there are some things that work at least as good, but I can't think of any off the top of my head.
  - ClumsyPilot 5y ago
    My building had a dialing system replaced with one that uses a phone line to call a mobile of each resident. It can also only assing one number. Now I get the call at work if my wife orders pizza, or if i am out of the country. It also doesnt work at all if i am in tube, or when my building forgets to pay phone bill, or movike network craps out
    - betwixthewires 5y ago
      I'm glad to say I don't have any shit like this that I have to deal with. I've got a phone and a laptop and that's it. My car basically has a fuel controller and ABS controller in it. Aftermarket MP3 playing head unit with an aux jack. Whatever benefits the tech firms and salespeople sold you (not literally you, anyone reading) on all this shit, if you have this stuff in your life I guarantee you your life is more stressful than mine because of it. I'm to the point where I only buy used stuff period. Basically food and underwear have to be new. I don't think I've bought a brand new anything in over 5 years. I don't know if I ever will if this trend continues, proprietary single serve coffee pouches, internet connected stovetops, TVs that show ads separate from the broadcast, cars that track your movements and sell them to data brokers, touch screen everything, how many screens does a single person need?
      - indigo945 5y ago
        But in ten years, all the used stuff will also be fully-electronic vendor-locked garbage, just older and with the cloud services down, and hence unusable.
  - 5y ago
tw04 5y ago
But the handle DOES open the door. It’s just at your feet, quite clearly marked, instead of physically on the door. It’s specifically there so that if you are in an accident you can still release the door. It’s designed With the idea the car will see a road course and is far superior to a handle on the door. It’s sad he died but I found that handle in the first 5 minutes of owning my first corvette. It has a giant red picture of the door opening.
- Symbiote 5y ago
  When you're half dazed from a collision and the car is on fire, will your scared but unhurt 11 year old son know where this hidden lever is? I did, on a 1980s car, since it was the normal door handle.
  - tw04 5y ago
    Hidden? It’s directly below where the “oh shit” handle is on the door, you need to move your hand less than 6” to pull it. Calling it hidden is completely misrepresenting reality. If my 7 year old knows where it is and insists on using it to open the door, I hope your 11 year old can figure it out.
    - salawat 5y ago
      Principe of least surprise. Humans expect tools to be at arm height. Do not work against natural assumptions. If you increase cognitive load, that's that much more attention diverted in a state where attention is already maxed out or otherwise in shortage. It can be the difference between life and death.
    - Symbiote 5y ago
      From [1], I see it's a discreet, black lever with a small picture of a door opening. It perhaps is about 6" away, but in a space almost always obscured by ones legs. Emergency controls in vehicles with proper regulation look like this [2], so they can still be used in the dark, with smoke, etc. [1] https://hhcorvettenewsletter.wordpress.com/2016/08/03/dont-let-this-happen-to-you-or-your-loved-ones-in-your-corvette/ https://hhcorvettenewsletter.wordpress.com/2016/08/03/dont-l... [2] https://railgallery.wongm.com/gold-coast-light-rail/F122_9298.jpg.html https://railgallery.wongm.com/gold-coast-light-rail/F122_929...

rabuse 5y ago

Exactly. Couldn't they just have some system where the door handles have a magnetic dead-switch, that reverts to manual operation when no power is applied?

brokenmachine 5y ago
The battery might not have enough juice to unlock the doors, but still not be completely dead. Of course with good design that shouldn't be a problem.

seanp2k2 5y ago

I agree; it's like all the rollaway accidents that happen now because of electronic shifters: https://www.safetyresearch.net/the-persistence-of-rollaway/ https://www.safetyresearch.net/the-persistence-of-rollaway/ Design matters, and bad designs can literally be deadly. Why auto mfgs feel the need to "innovate" with shifter designs is beyond me. The worst part is how every mfg seems to be implementing a different design of bad electronic shifters, from wheels and touchscreens to one-click-at-a-time joysticks to single-function pushbuttons for some gears with others on a scroll wheel. They've taken something and made it worse with no benefit to the user. At least with those auto-flushing toilets, the intention was good, even if the implementation is still somehow so awful decades later.

aidenn0 5y ago
I drove a rental with a rotary-dial shifter. That is the single most braindead UX thing I've seen in a car that doesn't involve a touch-screen. We've had PRND(L) levers as the standard for shifting in automatics for over 50 years now, and the dial offers no advantages that I can see.
- derekp7 5y ago
  My Ford Fusion has one of those rotary dials. Didn't like it at first, but it is nice having that air space free (not able to accidentally knock it out of gear, more room for an extra cup holder). Also the cars with a physical gear shift lever still work by activating switches, there hasn't been mechanical linkage for years in a lot of models.
- selimthegrim 5y ago
  Pray tell what make and model this was so I can run as fast as my legs can take me in the opposite direction if Hertz tries to palm one off on me
  - devilbunny 5y ago
    I rented a Ford Edge two months ago that had one. It was quite distracting. At the end of a week, I still hadn't internalized how it worked. I had to think about it every time. On my old Chevrolet Tahoe, I can tell what gear I just shifted into by feel (shifting into D, it has a slight tendency to overshoot the normal overdrive mode and end up locked into 3rd). And of course, this is essentially a nonissue on manual transmissions.
    - aidenn0 5y ago
      Most cars have a stop at D; e.g. for the ones where you pull the stem towards to to leave park, you can let the stem spring back at neutral and push it down until it stops at D, and for the ones with a button you can release the button at neutral. [edit] Honestly if the rotary dial had similar tactile feedback, it would probably be fine. No worse than when they moved it off of the tree as bench seats were retired for safety reasons.
      - devilbunny 5y ago
        Like I said - it has such a stop, it's just old and a bit worn. It's column shift despite bucket seats.
- 5y ago
betwixthewires 5y ago
It's not just auto manufacturers. It seems literally everything is being designed with a philosophy of "fuck the user" in mind. I cannot think of a single thing more complicated than a concrete block that functions better now than previous versions did 10 years ago, and I'm sure there are some things that work at least as good, but I can't think of any off the top of my head.
- ClumsyPilot 5y ago
  My building had a dialing system replaced with one that uses a phone line to call a mobile of each resident. It can also only assing one number. Now I get the call at work if my wife orders pizza, or if i am out of the country. It also doesnt work at all if i am in tube, or when my building forgets to pay phone bill, or movike network craps out
  - betwixthewires 5y ago
    I'm glad to say I don't have any shit like this that I have to deal with. I've got a phone and a laptop and that's it. My car basically has a fuel controller and ABS controller in it. Aftermarket MP3 playing head unit with an aux jack. Whatever benefits the tech firms and salespeople sold you (not literally you, anyone reading) on all this shit, if you have this stuff in your life I guarantee you your life is more stressful than mine because of it. I'm to the point where I only buy used stuff period. Basically food and underwear have to be new. I don't think I've bought a brand new anything in over 5 years. I don't know if I ever will if this trend continues, proprietary single serve coffee pouches, internet connected stovetops, TVs that show ads separate from the broadcast, cars that track your movements and sell them to data brokers, touch screen everything, how many screens does a single person need?
    - indigo945 5y ago
      But in ten years, all the used stuff will also be fully-electronic vendor-locked garbage, just older and with the cloud services down, and hence unusable.
- 5y ago

tw04 5y ago

But the handle DOES open the door. It’s just at your feet, quite clearly marked, instead of physically on the door. It’s specifically there so that if you are in an accident you can still release the door. It’s designed With the idea the car will see a road course and is far superior to a handle on the door. It’s sad he died but I found that handle in the first 5 minutes of owning my first corvette. It has a giant red picture of the door opening.

Symbiote 5y ago
When you're half dazed from a collision and the car is on fire, will your scared but unhurt 11 year old son know where this hidden lever is? I did, on a 1980s car, since it was the normal door handle.
- tw04 5y ago
  Hidden? It’s directly below where the “oh shit” handle is on the door, you need to move your hand less than 6” to pull it. Calling it hidden is completely misrepresenting reality. If my 7 year old knows where it is and insists on using it to open the door, I hope your 11 year old can figure it out.
  - salawat 5y ago
    Principe of least surprise. Humans expect tools to be at arm height. Do not work against natural assumptions. If you increase cognitive load, that's that much more attention diverted in a state where attention is already maxed out or otherwise in shortage. It can be the difference between life and death.
  - Symbiote 5y ago
    From [1], I see it's a discreet, black lever with a small picture of a door opening. It perhaps is about 6" away, but in a space almost always obscured by ones legs. Emergency controls in vehicles with proper regulation look like this [2], so they can still be used in the dark, with smoke, etc. [1] https://hhcorvettenewsletter.wordpress.com/2016/08/03/dont-let-this-happen-to-you-or-your-loved-ones-in-your-corvette/ https://hhcorvettenewsletter.wordpress.com/2016/08/03/dont-l... [2] https://railgallery.wongm.com/gold-coast-light-rail/F122_9298.jpg.html https://railgallery.wongm.com/gold-coast-light-rail/F122_929...