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What's the career progression for streamers and eSports players, anyway? I feel like everyone that does this now is going to be tired of it in 5 years, and the
by jrockway 5y ago
What's the career progression for streamers and eSports players, anyway? I feel like everyone that does this now is going to be tired of it in 5 years, and then they're just 30 and without a college degree or job experience.
- thesuitonym 5y agoSame thing everyone does when they can no longer work in their current career space (or no longer want to): They do something else.
- bluedino 5y agoHopefully they invest their money and don't blow it on Ferraris and avocado toast.
- beamatronic 5y agoTheir money goes into GME and crypto
- floren 5y agoJeez, at least avocados are tasty...
- authed 5y agobetter investment then a Ferrari
- bbreier 5y agodepends on the Ferrari tbh
- munk-a 5y agoI can't tell if you're being sarcastic but cars are the definition of an absolutely terrible investment - they might beat out randomly hoping you'll land big on r/wallstreetbets but both are extremely poor investment decisions.
- short_sells_poo 5y agoOrdinary cars are a strongly depreciating asset. However, above a certain level this stops being true. I had the fortune to buy, use and subsequently sell a number of higher end cars (Ferrari, Lamborghini) and I made little to no loss on any of them. In fact, the Ferrari 458, which to this day I consider the best supercar to drive, appreciated during the year or so I had it.
- munk-a 5y agoIt sounds like the cars might have slightly more than broken even on cost for you which sounds like a terrible investment option when you've got everything from real estate to mutual funds that will generally outperform cars - and, much like stock picking, most of the models you purchased didn't significantly appreciate - just one ended up gaining in value. I suppose I was misinformed in that I thought that cars of all value ranges were pretty disastrous assets to hold - but it sounds like holding on to them for value appreciation still isn't a particularly good tactic.
- jakear 5y agoWhen you have enough cash on hand to buy one, chances are you already have investments in money-returning assets, and you're diversifying into entertainment-returning ones. No point making a bunch of money just to spend it all on making more money. If you can tie up a bundle of cash for a year, get a bunch of entertainment out of it, then liquidate for approximately the same amount, who is to complain?
- kinggfx1 5y agoI can't drive my Berkshire Hathaway shares around at 160 mph
- deleted 5y ago[deleted]
- verve_rat 5y agoI'm assuming they were making a comment about the value of classic cars. Some of them could absolutely be a good investment, if, (big, giant, planet sized) if you know what you are doing.
- criddell 5y agoDo you have the same questions for professional athletes in traditional sports?
- valleyer 5y agoWe have decades of examples of how this works out for pro athletes. The answer is that there's a range of outcomes: some have to find new careers after their playing days are over; others find ancillary work (coaching, scouting) in the sports industry; the very best make enough money that they don't need to work anymore. In many cases, the athletes have a college degree of at least some value. Professional video game streaming is relatively new. It's a valid question.
- xboxnolifes 5y agoIt's a valid question, but the answer is simple: nearly the same thing that sports players do when they stop being the player. They either coach, manage, promote their brand, or switch careers.
- xwdv 5y agoYes. A lot of professional athletes don’t really make much money. They get normal salaries and play for non major league teams or federations of some sort. Eventually though they will have to quit their sport due to wear and tear and no longer being at a peak level. And most will probably never really progress to a level where they can make some quick millions from a contract and then retire early. So what then?
- bsder 5y agoYes. I'm a proponent of the idea that your athletic scholarship at a Division I-A school should be for "sports degree" and that it should entitle you to come back prepaid for an "academic" 4 year degree when that track runs out. That would stop a lot of the idiocy we see around "student athletes".
- deleted 5y ago[deleted]
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- heavyset_go 5y agoSome of them make enough money to retire if streaming doesn't work out long-term.
- siruncledrew 5y agoIf someone is an esports player, it would be hard to stay a professional (in most action games at least) at age 30 simply due to natural wear on your hands and reaction times getting slower.
- tester756 5y agoIn CS:GO there were players around their 30s and were successful https://liquipedia.net/counterstrike/Virtus.pro https://liquipedia.net/counterstrike/Virtus.pro e.g >2016-07-30 1st S-Tier Offline ELEAGUE ELEAGUE Season 1 2 : 0 Fnatic $400,000
- mym1990 5y agoThis doesn't really make sense. Athletes in many sports are playing way past their 'prime' these days and they are wearing out much more than just their hands. Consistently good reaction times are a result of consistent training. Plenty of older baseball/tennis players have superhuman reaction times. I would see mental fatigue and boredom as being the major hurdle to playing esports on a professional level at an older age. No matter how fun it started as, 10+ years of looking at the same thing over and over has got to be soul sucking.
- KingMachiavelli 5y agoIn physical sports the barrier to entry is very high. Even if you have good reaction time, high strength, etc. you will still need 1000s of hours of practice from a very young age to excel. In e-sports there's millions of people practicing every day and the built in ranking system can filter that down to the current top 0.1%. At this point branching out into actual competitions is not nearly as difficult as getting noticed by a NBA, NFL, etc. recruiter. It does depend on the Game. CSGO players play a very limited number of maps so pure reaction time and hand-eye coordination is often the deciding factor. Strategy games like LoL and softer FPS games like Fortnite are less dependent on physical talent.
- mym1990 5y agoThe ranking system in physical and mental sports is essentially the same, it comes down to: 'can you beat or compete with X person consistently', and just for context...there were over a million high school football players participating in 2019, and this is mostly in organized play. If I want to get noticed in League, I have to grind a queue for ungodly amount of hours to get to a respectable ranking and then solicit myself to teams for proper team based competition...good luck with all that.
- NineStarPoint 5y agoThere are quite a few streamers who have been doing it for more than a decade at this point with no sign of slowing down. On the other hand, there are plenty of ways to sell the skill of building a large following to employers, and plenty of companies looking for people who are experts in social media/streaming platforms.
- RobRivera 5y agowhy does every endeavor require career progression? its [Current Year] can't people just enjoy something, take the money and invest it, then go to college, start a business, make a RE empire? Ask a few military vets, many legitimately just start at the bottom at the totem some place novel into their mid 30s.
- HeyLaughingBoy 5y agoRight? Can't you just enjoy being in a good place and stay there? Maybe I'm jaundiced because I just had to fill out my annual review self-assessment and skipped the "5-year plan" because I simply couldn't be bothered to lie about it.
- dejke 5y agoI think a decent few of them find positions in related fields like talent management or esports. They do probably develop pretty decent relationships in those industries.
- jedberg 5y agoThe same career path as a professional athlete. Some go into commentating, some go into sports management, and most retire broke and have to pick up a whole new career in their late 20s/early 30s.
- diognesofsinope 5y agoBingo -- they struggle through their 20s until they realize they need to pick a practical career in their early 30s.
- munk-a 5y agoTwitch streaming can be extremely practical if you're being sustainable about it. Assuming you're actually watching your income and expenses and being smart about when to hire on additional help you can make a pretty darn successful career. I'd point to T90[1] as an example of someone that isn't near the top 1% but has built an extremely sustainable business including paid moderators and content editors (for sending clips to YouTube). 1. https://liquipedia.net/ageofempires/T90Official/Broadcasts https://liquipedia.net/ageofempires/T90Official/Broadcasts
- solidasparagus 5y agoT90 was number 211 in the leaks. That is the top 0.003% of streamers.
- chmod775 5y agoMost people who have a twitch account are 'streamers'. I occasionally stream my desktop to show friends something - doesn't mean you should count me for that same list.
- solidasparagus 5y agoGo ahead and exclude 99% of the 9.2 million monthly active streamers - T90 is STILL in the top 1% of that group.
- xboxnolifes 5y agoSame thing people in sports do: - Continue - Retire - Start coaching - Start casting - Management (Organizing/growing content creators/groups) - Switch careers entirely Any of the giants should hopefully have been saving there money and have quite a bunch tucked away. Any of the smaller ones should have been doing something on the side, or at least have a plan B ready. Also, not sure why we're assuming no college degree here.
- munk-a 5y agoOr that running a successful business for a decade doesn't count as experience that most businesses would be happy to hire on. Being a successful twitch streamer involves extremely good time management and a lot of hands on advertising. They've got a lot more proof of successful marketing than most PR folks you might look at hiring.
- somerando7 5y agoIf you're one of the top streamers, with decent financial literacy, you will easily make enough to retire by 30 if you started streaming at say 20.
- AutumnCurtain 5y agoNowadays there are financial planners focusing on content creators/streaming talent who will know the specifics of tax structures and advantages, etc. as well.
- jrockway 5y agoBut what if you're not one of the top streamers, and you just get 250 viewers a few times a week? I watch a lot of people like that. It seems to pay for room and board, but I worry about their future.
- thesuitonym 5y agoFor some people it's a career. For people with ~250 viewers a few times a week...they probably need another job.
- tastyfreeze 5y agoWhy is that a problem? Nobody cares for the millions of people that try to be professional athletes, musicians, artists or dancers that are barely making ends meet and ultimately move on to something else. This is just like any other endeavor. Many try, most fail, some succeed wildly. We don't need to feel bad for the people that try and fail. That is part of life and progressing as a person.
- che_shirecat 5y agoWhat's the alternative? Alot of these people are great entertainers and terrible <anything else>. If they weren't streaming they'd be working shifts at McDonalds. If anything they're doing the most advantageous thing they could be doing.
- vkou 5y ago> But what if you're not one of the top streamers, and you just get 250 viewers a few times a week? If you have 250 viewers a few times a week, you're not quitting your day job for it. If you are, you should probably reconsider.
- gkoberger 5y agoI know a few ex-YouTubers, and they're all doing just fine. Working in PR, marketing, agents for other creators, etc. Sure, they don't all have a degree... but they have a ton of connections and relevant experience.
- jareklupinski 5y agoask your colleagues :) i was pleasantly surprised one day to find I was working side-by-side with someone who was once a minor music celebrity they had pivoted in their 20-somethings after a decent payout, used it to finance their education, and are now just 'one of us' haha
- dnissley 5y agoReminds me of Travis Morrison, lead singer of the indie band The Dismemberment Plan who were popular in the 90s/early 2000s. After his retirement from music he became a web developer who at one point worked for the washington post and huffington post. His girlfriend (now wife) describes the experience of being with someone who was once somewhat famous in this article [0] -- There were moments of extreme cognitive dissonance when I saw him up there. He’s a wild and expert showman on stage. As I’d watch him do things like play the keyboard by smashing it with his forehead, spit water all over the audience or writhe convulsively on the ground, I would think, “I can’t believe this is the same man who likes to go to bed at 10 o’clock and sweetly brings me coffee in bed every morning.” [0] - https://slate.com/human-interest/2012/07/travis-morrison-and-the-dismemberment-plan-what-its-like-to-marry-a-rock-star.html https://slate.com/human-interest/2012/07/travis-morrison-and...
- golemiprague 5y agoWhat's the big deal starting at age 30? you still got another 30 years to work at least, if not more. You just study some profession and start working in the field.
- alistairSH 5y agoHe’s on pace to earn more then $3 million before he turns 30. He doesn’t much of a plan to live reasonably for many years.
- colinmhayes 5y agoHe said in this article he's already earned $5 million.
- alistairSH 5y ago2.5 for Twitch so far was listed earlier in the articles. Either way, my point stands, he can retire if wants.
- matwood 5y agoI know an ex-WoW professional player. He didn't make a ton of money. After it was over he went back to school, and is now a very talented software engineer. Doing anything at a high level tends to cultivate skills that translate to other areas. General skills like focus and discipline come to mind.
- analogdreams 5y agofrom the article it doesn't sound like this guy needs/wants a lot. what he needs is a financial advisor to properly look after that money and he should be set should he just walk away in a few years.
- sneak 5y agoYou could ask the same of any developer in their 30s or 40s, most of whom earn less per year than the subject of TFA, and who similarly will have trouble finding work in their field in 10-20 years (if the ageism doesn't go away).
- pugworthy 5y agoWill Frampton (aka QuickyBaby) who streams mostly World of Tanks has a PhD and is 33.