4 ms·

Yes, but: why have these characteristics, especially the perspective-incorrect textures (which look terrible, and do not provide an efficiency advantage in the

by prvc 5y ago

Yes, but: why have these characteristics, especially the perspective-incorrect textures (which look terrible, and do not provide an efficiency advantage in the context of a "fantasy console")? Why not just write for the PS1 instead (if you must have these traits)?

pcwalton 5y ago
Because it's fun.
ant6n 5y ago
Developing against this seems much easier than making an actual ps1 game, if you want to get that retro look.
cheeseomlit 5y ago
There are plenty of people who find those characteristics aesthetically pleasing, I enjoy the affine texture mapping effect and vertex jitter when they're used effectively- depends on the game. For example in Silent hill these sort of effects enhance the eerie atmosphere, giving it a more warped and dream-like feel. As for developing directly for the PS1 there are many practical reasons not to, like ease of development and actually being able to release/sell your game on modern storefronts
- lloeki 5y ago
  In Ridge Racer the texture warping and geometry raster gave some heightened sense of raw speed. Later versions on subsequent platforms (or emulated ones that correct this technical fault) felt way too smooth and much less intense. e.g around 1:47, the tunnel walls go zigzag in a very obvious way but the effect is present in most textures, only more subtle https://youtu.be/WLJqWtnFkdY https://youtu.be/WLJqWtnFkdY
  - adamrezich 5y ago
    someone should make a racing game where the vertices get more "unstable" the faster you go...
corysama 5y ago
Why do it all? Brian Eno had an answer for that: https://www.goodreads.com/quotes/649039-whatever-you-now-find-weird-ugly-uncomfortable-and-nasty-about https://www.goodreads.com/quotes/649039-whatever-you-now-fin... I’ve considered doing this —digging out PS1 homebrew tools and targeting libRetro. I even worked on PS1 games just a bit a long time ago. Then I looked at actually doing it and, oh man, it’s a lot of work to get started! If I was a younger man with more free time I could pull it off. But, at the moment I need to keep my side projects smaller scope. As far as OP goes, setting up a renderer like this requires digging out some unusual techniques. But, they aren’t hard to implement once you figure them out. And, then you can go back to the speed and convenience of modern gamedev environments.
lostgame 5y ago
The PS1 is extremely limited in terms of hardware. This is about liking the aesthetic but being able to create without the limitations the PS1 put on us. The PS1 has 2MB RAM. The average consumer laptop these days has 8GB. My dev laptop has 16GB. And that's just RAM. Video memory, similarly; allows us a lot more physical space in our game areas while still retaining this aesthetic, if we choose - it allows more enemies, or objects on the screen...more complexity in AI, etc, etc. None of these have to do with the visual aesthetic, but are all previously creative restrictions we no longer have to deal with as creators. I'm a Homebrew dev for the SEGA Saturn, whose architecture is actually way more of a pain in the ass to dev for than the PS1 ever was - but I do it specifically for the challenge and joy of learning the ins and outs of the hardware. That being said - in no way would I want to take on a project specifically for that architecture, especially because; if the project is successful in any way - porting it to another platform would be a nightmare. Much better to use something like Unity, or - if you're a 'total control' kinda person, SDL, etc.
- 999900000999 5y ago
  I think it depends on what you want to do. I use Unity extensively and adding a PS1 filter to an existing game takes a 15$ asset. The only real downside is your stuck in the Unity verse. I would absolutely love for Godot to have a robust asset store ( yes paid assets , I've no problem paying for good code ). Let's hope Godot 4 is nice.
  - lostgame 5y ago
    Again, I stated use whatever toolchain you'd like - it's really the fact that we're not limited to 2MB RAM that matters. Unity just works for me. Whatever works for you is great. I have never once found the 'Unity-verse' to limit or hamper my creativity or ability to do anything I wanted, and; in fact, have found it more empowering than the dozens of other game IDE's I've worked with in 20+ years of game dev. Since Unity provides me with more than I could possibly need for myself; and I've been using it since I had it on my PowerMac G5 back when that was still a thing - I never foresee myself swapping IDE's for any reason. Especially with a backlog of 10+ years of projects backed up.
AnIdiotOnTheNet 5y ago
The aesthetic itself has value, not just for the nostalgia but because it can evoke a particularly creepy vibe when used correctly. The low-poly designs have a surreal and sometimes uncanny-valley quality to them, the texture warping is unsettling, the fog and dithering need no explanation. Highly recommend the Haunted PS1 Game Demo Disc 2021[0] if you're into horror, indie games, and the PS1 aesthetic. [0] https://hauntedps1.itch.io/demodisc2021 https://hauntedps1.itch.io/demodisc2021

by prvc 5y ago

pcwalton 5y ago

Because it's fun.

ant6n 5y ago

Developing against this seems much easier than making an actual ps1 game, if you want to get that retro look.

cheeseomlit 5y ago

There are plenty of people who find those characteristics aesthetically pleasing, I enjoy the affine texture mapping effect and vertex jitter when they're used effectively- depends on the game. For example in Silent hill these sort of effects enhance the eerie atmosphere, giving it a more warped and dream-like feel. As for developing directly for the PS1 there are many practical reasons not to, like ease of development and actually being able to release/sell your game on modern storefronts

lloeki 5y ago
In Ridge Racer the texture warping and geometry raster gave some heightened sense of raw speed. Later versions on subsequent platforms (or emulated ones that correct this technical fault) felt way too smooth and much less intense. e.g around 1:47, the tunnel walls go zigzag in a very obvious way but the effect is present in most textures, only more subtle https://youtu.be/WLJqWtnFkdY https://youtu.be/WLJqWtnFkdY
- adamrezich 5y ago
  someone should make a racing game where the vertices get more "unstable" the faster you go...

corysama 5y ago

Why do it all? Brian Eno had an answer for that: https://www.goodreads.com/quotes/649039-whatever-you-now-find-weird-ugly-uncomfortable-and-nasty-about https://www.goodreads.com/quotes/649039-whatever-you-now-fin... I’ve considered doing this —digging out PS1 homebrew tools and targeting libRetro. I even worked on PS1 games just a bit a long time ago. Then I looked at actually doing it and, oh man, it’s a lot of work to get started! If I was a younger man with more free time I could pull it off. But, at the moment I need to keep my side projects smaller scope. As far as OP goes, setting up a renderer like this requires digging out some unusual techniques. But, they aren’t hard to implement once you figure them out. And, then you can go back to the speed and convenience of modern gamedev environments.

lostgame 5y ago

The PS1 is extremely limited in terms of hardware. This is about liking the aesthetic but being able to create without the limitations the PS1 put on us. The PS1 has 2MB RAM. The average consumer laptop these days has 8GB. My dev laptop has 16GB. And that's just RAM. Video memory, similarly; allows us a lot more physical space in our game areas while still retaining this aesthetic, if we choose - it allows more enemies, or objects on the screen...more complexity in AI, etc, etc. None of these have to do with the visual aesthetic, but are all previously creative restrictions we no longer have to deal with as creators. I'm a Homebrew dev for the SEGA Saturn, whose architecture is actually way more of a pain in the ass to dev for than the PS1 ever was - but I do it specifically for the challenge and joy of learning the ins and outs of the hardware. That being said - in no way would I want to take on a project specifically for that architecture, especially because; if the project is successful in any way - porting it to another platform would be a nightmare. Much better to use something like Unity, or - if you're a 'total control' kinda person, SDL, etc.

999900000999 5y ago
I think it depends on what you want to do. I use Unity extensively and adding a PS1 filter to an existing game takes a 15$ asset. The only real downside is your stuck in the Unity verse. I would absolutely love for Godot to have a robust asset store ( yes paid assets , I've no problem paying for good code ). Let's hope Godot 4 is nice.
- lostgame 5y ago
  Again, I stated use whatever toolchain you'd like - it's really the fact that we're not limited to 2MB RAM that matters. Unity just works for me. Whatever works for you is great. I have never once found the 'Unity-verse' to limit or hamper my creativity or ability to do anything I wanted, and; in fact, have found it more empowering than the dozens of other game IDE's I've worked with in 20+ years of game dev. Since Unity provides me with more than I could possibly need for myself; and I've been using it since I had it on my PowerMac G5 back when that was still a thing - I never foresee myself swapping IDE's for any reason. Especially with a backlog of 10+ years of projects backed up.

AnIdiotOnTheNet 5y ago

The aesthetic itself has value, not just for the nostalgia but because it can evoke a particularly creepy vibe when used correctly. The low-poly designs have a surreal and sometimes uncanny-valley quality to them, the texture warping is unsettling, the fog and dithering need no explanation. Highly recommend the Haunted PS1 Game Demo Disc 2021[0] if you're into horror, indie games, and the PS1 aesthetic. [0] https://hauntedps1.itch.io/demodisc2021 https://hauntedps1.itch.io/demodisc2021