5 ms·

Although I have no love for Google, claims like this that lack proof or evidence ought to be viewed with great skepticism.

quitit 5y ago
Generally clever people don't lie about this kind of stuff: they have too much to lose and do not want the notoriety and libel case that would follow. All claims deserve to be followed up - and should this be false then the person will get what's coming to them. This problem with repairs appears to happen frequently enough to not be discounted off the cuff.
- lotsofpulp 5y ago
  > and should this be false then the person will get what's coming to them. How?
  - quitit 5y ago
    If it’s a lie, it’s defamation (libel).
    - lotsofpulp 5y ago
      I cannot remember the last time someone got prosecuted or sued for libel for falsely accusing a business of something. It happens numerous times every day. I would be willing to bet nothing happens to this person if their claim turns out to be false.
      - quitit 5y ago
        You can't remember, therefore it doesn't happen. Magical thinking there.
        lotsofpulp 5y ago
        I know that the US has a very high bar for defamation claims. It is common knowledge that you can make things up in yelp reviews or twitter or wherever with no big consequences. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_defamation_law https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_defamation_law
        jfrunyon 5y ago
        Please provide evidence of it happening on a regular basis.
- jfrunyon 5y ago
  People lie about this kind of stuff all the time. Every day. And no, there's usually no penalty for it because proving that something didn't happen is even more difficult than proving that something did happen. And even when the person freely admits that they lied there's still usually no penalty.
systemvoltage 5y ago
It's important to question the validity of it at the same time taking it seriously. I found odd that the victim is talking about class action lawsuit and accussing a man of "mansplaining" her (it could just have been a woman saying it). This is just toxic twitter behavior that takes innocuous comments from people and putting it in the bin of sexism, racism, or something that is accusatory in nature to gain a false sense of moral superiority over others.
- otterley 5y ago
  I did notice some victim-blaming, which isn't right. But I do think that if you're going to accuse someone of serious malfeasance that might be a criminal act, a little more than a naked accusatory Tweet thread is needed.
  - deleted 5y ago
    [deleted]
- giltron 5y ago
  The exact comment was "Or maybe reset your phone before giving it to others (for any purpose)?" If my phone was account was hacked and someone said this to me directly, I would take it as a personal shot. Not sure why you are trying to detract of the alleged incident by trying to claim the victim is being "toxic".
  - systemvoltage 5y ago
    > "Or maybe reset your phone before giving it to others (for any purpose)?" Yeah that's not a nice thing to say as well. But I don't sense any sexist aspect in there. Personal shots can be ignored instead of adding more fuel to the fire. > Not sure why you are trying to detract of the alleged incident by trying to claim the victim is being "toxic". I don't think I was, just pointing out a couple of odd aspects of people going off on Twitter without proof. I did say we should take this seriously but also expect hard proof to back up their claims.
lvs 5y ago
If you follow the types of anecdotes posted on reddit of the trials and tribulations of Fi users seeking customer support for device replacement, empty phone shipments, etc., this report comes as absolutely no surprise. They are contracting out all these customer-facing services to the lowest bidder, in typical Google style.
- otterley 5y ago
  Sure, but that's not malfeasance or criminal trespass; that's just bad service.
  - giltron 5y ago
    The parent never said "criminal" charges against Google. Thats not just bad service. If the third party is an official agent of Google, then Google can be liable (monetary penalties). Now, proving that in practice is a question for the civil courts. Now, if I was looking for a new Android device and I saw all these reports, I would definitely think twice before purchasing a Google Pixel.
- LorenPechtel 5y ago
  But when you contract it out to the lowest bidder you get less careful background checking and less monitoring for abuse.
jeroenhd 5y ago
I see no reason to doubt her story. When someone says "something bad happened to me" then "I don't think it did, prove it" is quite rude in my opinion. On the other hand, I also see no direct connection to Google. The victim also said in the comment chain: > also to be clear I have been on Google support and Pixel support dozens of time all week BEFORE the hack happened, asking them to investigate why my phone marked delivered by FedEx 'disappeared' at the warehouse. At any time someone could have offered me any security advice?! This could just as easily be a delivery driver or warehouse worker stealing the phone and putting fake info on the website. I don't think Google's workers would be dumb enough to do this to their customers' phones, my suspicion is that it went wrong somewhere in the supply chain. Either way, Google is responsible for their warranty and return policy. If the delivery driver stole her phone or if someone broke into the delivery warehouse, that's on Google picking bad logistics partners. If the repair company Google partners with is doing this, the problem is with Google. If someone over at Google itself is doing this than that's an even bigger problem. Either way, I hope the victim can get the help she needs and that Google finds the problem and prevents it from happening to anyone else. Not that I have high hopes for Google's support team taking this seriously…
- otterley 5y ago
  To be clear, I'm not accusing the poster of being a liar. But remember that companies are made of people, and it's not fair to accuse them of doing something nefarious, or perhaps even criminal, without at least a modicum of evidence. Social media is a powerful tool for generating both influence and motivation; we are not well-served by stirring up angry mobs over naked accusations, especially over something that might even be a misunderstanding.
  - cute_boi 5y ago
    Companies tries to do many thing to hide crimes and its not the first time. Apple, probably in 2016, tried to hide their malice when they paid millions to their own tech who posted a customer's nude on Facebook. And why do you need modicum when she has already mentioned fedex related thing and she is not the first one to find such issues?

quitit 5y ago

Generally clever people don't lie about this kind of stuff: they have too much to lose and do not want the notoriety and libel case that would follow. All claims deserve to be followed up - and should this be false then the person will get what's coming to them. This problem with repairs appears to happen frequently enough to not be discounted off the cuff.

lotsofpulp 5y ago
> and should this be false then the person will get what's coming to them. How?
- quitit 5y ago
  If it’s a lie, it’s defamation (libel).
  - lotsofpulp 5y ago
    I cannot remember the last time someone got prosecuted or sued for libel for falsely accusing a business of something. It happens numerous times every day. I would be willing to bet nothing happens to this person if their claim turns out to be false.
    - quitit 5y ago
      You can't remember, therefore it doesn't happen. Magical thinking there.
      - lotsofpulp 5y ago
        I know that the US has a very high bar for defamation claims. It is common knowledge that you can make things up in yelp reviews or twitter or wherever with no big consequences. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_defamation_law https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_defamation_law
      - jfrunyon 5y ago
        Please provide evidence of it happening on a regular basis.
jfrunyon 5y ago
People lie about this kind of stuff all the time. Every day. And no, there's usually no penalty for it because proving that something didn't happen is even more difficult than proving that something did happen. And even when the person freely admits that they lied there's still usually no penalty.

systemvoltage 5y ago

It's important to question the validity of it at the same time taking it seriously. I found odd that the victim is talking about class action lawsuit and accussing a man of "mansplaining" her (it could just have been a woman saying it). This is just toxic twitter behavior that takes innocuous comments from people and putting it in the bin of sexism, racism, or something that is accusatory in nature to gain a false sense of moral superiority over others.

otterley 5y ago
I did notice some victim-blaming, which isn't right. But I do think that if you're going to accuse someone of serious malfeasance that might be a criminal act, a little more than a naked accusatory Tweet thread is needed.
- deleted 5y ago
  [deleted]
giltron 5y ago
The exact comment was "Or maybe reset your phone before giving it to others (for any purpose)?" If my phone was account was hacked and someone said this to me directly, I would take it as a personal shot. Not sure why you are trying to detract of the alleged incident by trying to claim the victim is being "toxic".
- systemvoltage 5y ago
  > "Or maybe reset your phone before giving it to others (for any purpose)?" Yeah that's not a nice thing to say as well. But I don't sense any sexist aspect in there. Personal shots can be ignored instead of adding more fuel to the fire. > Not sure why you are trying to detract of the alleged incident by trying to claim the victim is being "toxic". I don't think I was, just pointing out a couple of odd aspects of people going off on Twitter without proof. I did say we should take this seriously but also expect hard proof to back up their claims.

lvs 5y ago

If you follow the types of anecdotes posted on reddit of the trials and tribulations of Fi users seeking customer support for device replacement, empty phone shipments, etc., this report comes as absolutely no surprise. They are contracting out all these customer-facing services to the lowest bidder, in typical Google style.

otterley 5y ago
Sure, but that's not malfeasance or criminal trespass; that's just bad service.
- giltron 5y ago
  The parent never said "criminal" charges against Google. Thats not just bad service. If the third party is an official agent of Google, then Google can be liable (monetary penalties). Now, proving that in practice is a question for the civil courts. Now, if I was looking for a new Android device and I saw all these reports, I would definitely think twice before purchasing a Google Pixel.
LorenPechtel 5y ago
But when you contract it out to the lowest bidder you get less careful background checking and less monitoring for abuse.

jeroenhd 5y ago

I see no reason to doubt her story. When someone says "something bad happened to me" then "I don't think it did, prove it" is quite rude in my opinion. On the other hand, I also see no direct connection to Google. The victim also said in the comment chain: > also to be clear I have been on Google support and Pixel support dozens of time all week BEFORE the hack happened, asking them to investigate why my phone marked delivered by FedEx 'disappeared' at the warehouse. At any time someone could have offered me any security advice?! This could just as easily be a delivery driver or warehouse worker stealing the phone and putting fake info on the website. I don't think Google's workers would be dumb enough to do this to their customers' phones, my suspicion is that it went wrong somewhere in the supply chain. Either way, Google is responsible for their warranty and return policy. If the delivery driver stole her phone or if someone broke into the delivery warehouse, that's on Google picking bad logistics partners. If the repair company Google partners with is doing this, the problem is with Google. If someone over at Google itself is doing this than that's an even bigger problem. Either way, I hope the victim can get the help she needs and that Google finds the problem and prevents it from happening to anyone else. Not that I have high hopes for Google's support team taking this seriously…

otterley 5y ago
To be clear, I'm not accusing the poster of being a liar. But remember that companies are made of people, and it's not fair to accuse them of doing something nefarious, or perhaps even criminal, without at least a modicum of evidence. Social media is a powerful tool for generating both influence and motivation; we are not well-served by stirring up angry mobs over naked accusations, especially over something that might even be a misunderstanding.
- cute_boi 5y ago
  Companies tries to do many thing to hide crimes and its not the first time. Apple, probably in 2016, tried to hide their malice when they paid millions to their own tech who posted a customer's nude on Facebook. And why do you need modicum when she has already mentioned fedex related thing and she is not the first one to find such issues?