3 ms·

Covid is not just like the flu, yes. If you have no immunity covid is about 10x more likely to kill you. But, once you're vaccinated, the risk from covid is lo

by jefftk 5y ago

Covid is not just like the flu, yes. If you have no immunity covid is about 10x more likely to kill you. But, once you're vaccinated, the risk from covid is lower than the flu.

varelse 5y ago
Right up until our strong pool of unvaccinated folk provide the evolutionary opportunity to infect the vaccinated pool. Why that seems to be exactly what's happening right now with omicron. But since fatality rates are decoupled from virulence rates as long as you survive long enough to spread the thing, we're all stuck waiting another couple months to sort this out. I'm 100% on team life finds a way (tm). I don't need you to think that way but I'm going to continue thinking that way and we'll see how that goes.
- jefftk 5y ago
  The vaccines are highly protective against hospitalization and death. As someone vaccinated (and boosted) against covid, I would much rather be infected with covid than the flu. As for life finding a way, I do think we should expect to continue to see additional waves of covid, mutation and infection, but I'm not sure why you would expect that to lead to a high risk of death?
  - varelse 5y ago
    The vaccines are great (And I'm boosted)! We agree on that. But I hope we agree that anti-vaxxers suck. And they are providing a pool for the virus to evolve past the vaccines (as Omicron seems to do). As for the risk of death. I know people who prefer normality with a ~0.5-1.0% additional chance of random death over continued isolation. I get that. I prefer isolation to that myself but I won't impose my views on anyone else. Why can't we just politely accept both sorts have to coexist? Go back to normality if you wish, be my guest even, except where we have to mix upon where you put on a mask or GTFO. Why is this unreasonable? Because apparently this is crazytalk to some.
    - nradov 5y ago
      While I encourage everyone eligible to get vaccinated, the current thinking is that new variants are most likely to evolve in immunocompromised patients who have persistent infections. Vaccines aren't very effective for patients with malfunctioning immune systems. https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/covid-variants-may-arise-in-people-with-compromised-immune-systems/ https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/covid-variants-ma... https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMsb2104756 https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMsb2104756
    - unmole 5y ago
      Unvaccinated people will eventually catch the virus and in the overwhelming majority of the cases recover and develop potent and robust immunity against future infection.
      - varelse 5y ago
        For about 5-7 months or until a new variant emerges but let's not talk about that, right? I enthusiastically support your right to play Russian roulette with pretty good odds if only you support my right not to play. After all if you die and I live that's more social security benefits for me. I'm less worried about dying of the thing than I am of an indefinite and impossible to cure case of long covid and all the horrible things that come with it. People have literally killed themselves over it. But your body your choices and all that. Just remember that goes both ways.
        unmole 5y ago
        > For about 5-7 months or until a new variant emerges Neutralizing antibody titres remain stable even 13 months post infection[0]. This isn't an upper limit, it's just that there's no data beyond this. And despite whatever you might have heard, reinfection remains extremely rare across all variants. All data points to immunity acquired after an infection being more potent and robust than that imparted by vaccines. I'm not unvaccinated, I'm not American and I don't work for Google. I don't have a dog in this particular fight. But if you decide to spread FUD and misinformation on your way to find new scapegoats, expect to be called out for it. 0: https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s11606-021-07057-0 https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s11606-021-07057-0
stjohnswarts 5y ago
That may have been true a week ago, with omicron we don't know that yet. Hence google delaying. Jan 10 seems a little optimistic though. i'm not sure why they were even going to bother right before Christmas break anyway, at least in mostly Christian Western countries that slow down the last couple of weeks of december anyway.

by jefftk 5y ago

Covid is not just like the flu, yes. If you have no immunity covid is about 10x more likely to kill you. But, once you're vaccinated, the risk from covid is lower than the flu.

varelse 5y ago

Right up until our strong pool of unvaccinated folk provide the evolutionary opportunity to infect the vaccinated pool. Why that seems to be exactly what's happening right now with omicron. But since fatality rates are decoupled from virulence rates as long as you survive long enough to spread the thing, we're all stuck waiting another couple months to sort this out. I'm 100% on team life finds a way (tm). I don't need you to think that way but I'm going to continue thinking that way and we'll see how that goes.

jefftk 5y ago
The vaccines are highly protective against hospitalization and death. As someone vaccinated (and boosted) against covid, I would much rather be infected with covid than the flu. As for life finding a way, I do think we should expect to continue to see additional waves of covid, mutation and infection, but I'm not sure why you would expect that to lead to a high risk of death?
- varelse 5y ago
  The vaccines are great (And I'm boosted)! We agree on that. But I hope we agree that anti-vaxxers suck. And they are providing a pool for the virus to evolve past the vaccines (as Omicron seems to do). As for the risk of death. I know people who prefer normality with a ~0.5-1.0% additional chance of random death over continued isolation. I get that. I prefer isolation to that myself but I won't impose my views on anyone else. Why can't we just politely accept both sorts have to coexist? Go back to normality if you wish, be my guest even, except where we have to mix upon where you put on a mask or GTFO. Why is this unreasonable? Because apparently this is crazytalk to some.
  - nradov 5y ago
    While I encourage everyone eligible to get vaccinated, the current thinking is that new variants are most likely to evolve in immunocompromised patients who have persistent infections. Vaccines aren't very effective for patients with malfunctioning immune systems. https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/covid-variants-may-arise-in-people-with-compromised-immune-systems/ https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/covid-variants-ma... https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMsb2104756 https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMsb2104756
  - unmole 5y ago
    Unvaccinated people will eventually catch the virus and in the overwhelming majority of the cases recover and develop potent and robust immunity against future infection.
    - varelse 5y ago
      For about 5-7 months or until a new variant emerges but let's not talk about that, right? I enthusiastically support your right to play Russian roulette with pretty good odds if only you support my right not to play. After all if you die and I live that's more social security benefits for me. I'm less worried about dying of the thing than I am of an indefinite and impossible to cure case of long covid and all the horrible things that come with it. People have literally killed themselves over it. But your body your choices and all that. Just remember that goes both ways.
      - unmole 5y ago
        > For about 5-7 months or until a new variant emerges Neutralizing antibody titres remain stable even 13 months post infection[0]. This isn't an upper limit, it's just that there's no data beyond this. And despite whatever you might have heard, reinfection remains extremely rare across all variants. All data points to immunity acquired after an infection being more potent and robust than that imparted by vaccines. I'm not unvaccinated, I'm not American and I don't work for Google. I don't have a dog in this particular fight. But if you decide to spread FUD and misinformation on your way to find new scapegoats, expect to be called out for it. 0: https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s11606-021-07057-0 https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s11606-021-07057-0

stjohnswarts 5y ago

That may have been true a week ago, with omicron we don't know that yet. Hence google delaying. Jan 10 seems a little optimistic though. i'm not sure why they were even going to bother right before Christmas break anyway, at least in mostly Christian Western countries that slow down the last couple of weeks of december anyway.