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For anyone interested in the Fast App discussion from this article, I highly recommend this video from Defunct Land -- https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9yjZpBq1X

For anyone interested in the Fast App discussion from this article, I highly recommend this video from Defunct Land -- https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9yjZpBq1XBE https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9yjZpBq1XBE The video not only does a deep dive into fast pass, but also does a statistical model break down to reveal that the modern implementation of fast pass is actually not what you might expect and serves to increase wait times for rides!

jedberg 5y ago
Great video! For those wondering, it goes into queuing theory and complex systems theory and how they apply to wait times at theme parks, but honestly a lot of it could be applicable to an engineering tuning their load balancer or their app, or how to process a waitlist for your startup, or many other applications of queuing theory to an engineer.
- xtracto 5y ago
  I was thrilled to see the agent based models they glanced at, and the extensive micro simulation they performed to duplicate the patterns seen in the parks. It's been a while since I did research in those areas, but brought me a smile seeing them in a 100% practical application.
MBCook 5y ago
Warning: almost 2 hours. That said it’s a FANTASTIC video. Basically a documentary on the history of FastPass and it’s variations, and how they shape people’s experience at Disney parks. Well worth a watch for the HN crowd.
- jrs235 5y ago
  I concur! Just finished watching it at 1.5x speed.
cinntaile 5y ago
How does Fast Pass in Disneyland work? The video is a bit long. I have used something similar at another (not Disney) park and it allowed me to skip queues all the time, even on the same rides and there was no pre-booking requirement. I think it was by far the best experience in a theme park I have ever had. Not so much for the people without it of course, for them it made the queues longer.
- jedberg 5y ago
  They way it worked is you could only hold one at a time. You'd go to the ride (or pull up the app) and make your reservation, and they would give you a return time, usually an hour or so later, but sometimes many hours later. You'd show up at that time and skip some of the line. Then you could get another fastpass. So you had to optimize your pass getting since you could only hold one at a time. You'd have to know which ones would fill up and get those first, and then get the less popular ones later in the day.
  - MBCook 5y ago
    Right. Basically it put you in an invisible virtual line that you “stood waiting” in u til your assigned time. The benefit was while you were “waiting” you could go to the shops or a less popular ride or do something else.
  - koheripbal 5y ago
    This is not the current implementation. Today you get 3 fastpasses, not one at time.
    - mikecoles 5y ago
      Today you get 0 fastpasses.
ekhaliul 5y ago
Visited Disneyland last Friday and once I started watching first 5min of this video I could not stop... It really highlights how complex this issue is. I feel the main problem is that it collides now with original idea of bringing experience to all and modern economics that require constant expansion. It is interesting that they have tried price per ride in 70s. I think the flaw was that A-E ticket system was fixed and could not adopt to change in demand or behavior. Perhaps it is time for a futures stock exchange to fine tune price/demand.
telesilla 5y ago
Not joking. Everyone raving about this video is spot on, its really interesting and full of great information.
satellite2 5y ago
Just watched it, it's a great video and I highly recommend it. But the central question was almost reached many times but never explicitly stated. It's rather simple though. Assuming 30k people are coming into the parc and want to do attraction A that can only process 15k people in a day, then at least 50% of the visitors won't make the cut. The question is how do you select those that do? On the first system you select them via their motivation to wait a long line. Which is extraodinarily wasteful as they could be doing underutilized attractions in the meantime. But it seems the more fair system as virtual queue don't cost anything they will be sold out immediately after opening and people are selected on their knowledge of the system. Finally with the 3rd system, the perks one, people are selected with their wallet size. In some way it's a similar dilemma as proof of work vs proof of stake in crypto. But in the specific case of queue I think it's wrong to just lament that this is it and just go with the wasteful one because it's fair. I'm pretty sure an incentive structure could be found to have only virtual queues in parcs while selecting visitors on core motivations. Maybe some token system in which the visitors would be given a finite number of tokens to spend on attractions with some auction system?
- Beldin 5y ago
  Alternative system: the virtual queue is for free; every 15 minutes, there are only a limited amount of virtual queue tickets available for a specific 15 minute slot significantly later (eg. +2hr) in the day. If that also goes to capacity, your capacity is too low for the amount of folks you let in. Increase capacity on this ride, increase attractiveness of other rides with more capacity, build new rides, or create other things eating up time other than rides.
  - mcphage 5y ago
    > Increase capacity on this ride, increase attractiveness of other rides with more capacity, build new rides, or create other things eating up time other than rides. All things that Disney is also working on simultaneously.

jedberg 5y ago

Great video! For those wondering, it goes into queuing theory and complex systems theory and how they apply to wait times at theme parks, but honestly a lot of it could be applicable to an engineering tuning their load balancer or their app, or how to process a waitlist for your startup, or many other applications of queuing theory to an engineer.

xtracto 5y ago
I was thrilled to see the agent based models they glanced at, and the extensive micro simulation they performed to duplicate the patterns seen in the parks. It's been a while since I did research in those areas, but brought me a smile seeing them in a 100% practical application.

MBCook 5y ago

Warning: almost 2 hours. That said it’s a FANTASTIC video. Basically a documentary on the history of FastPass and it’s variations, and how they shape people’s experience at Disney parks. Well worth a watch for the HN crowd.

jrs235 5y ago
I concur! Just finished watching it at 1.5x speed.

cinntaile 5y ago

How does Fast Pass in Disneyland work? The video is a bit long. I have used something similar at another (not Disney) park and it allowed me to skip queues all the time, even on the same rides and there was no pre-booking requirement. I think it was by far the best experience in a theme park I have ever had. Not so much for the people without it of course, for them it made the queues longer.

jedberg 5y ago
They way it worked is you could only hold one at a time. You'd go to the ride (or pull up the app) and make your reservation, and they would give you a return time, usually an hour or so later, but sometimes many hours later. You'd show up at that time and skip some of the line. Then you could get another fastpass. So you had to optimize your pass getting since you could only hold one at a time. You'd have to know which ones would fill up and get those first, and then get the less popular ones later in the day.
- MBCook 5y ago
  Right. Basically it put you in an invisible virtual line that you “stood waiting” in u til your assigned time. The benefit was while you were “waiting” you could go to the shops or a less popular ride or do something else.
- koheripbal 5y ago
  This is not the current implementation. Today you get 3 fastpasses, not one at time.
  - mikecoles 5y ago
    Today you get 0 fastpasses.

ekhaliul 5y ago

Visited Disneyland last Friday and once I started watching first 5min of this video I could not stop... It really highlights how complex this issue is. I feel the main problem is that it collides now with original idea of bringing experience to all and modern economics that require constant expansion. It is interesting that they have tried price per ride in 70s. I think the flaw was that A-E ticket system was fixed and could not adopt to change in demand or behavior. Perhaps it is time for a futures stock exchange to fine tune price/demand.

telesilla 5y ago

Not joking. Everyone raving about this video is spot on, its really interesting and full of great information.

satellite2 5y ago

Just watched it, it's a great video and I highly recommend it. But the central question was almost reached many times but never explicitly stated. It's rather simple though. Assuming 30k people are coming into the parc and want to do attraction A that can only process 15k people in a day, then at least 50% of the visitors won't make the cut. The question is how do you select those that do? On the first system you select them via their motivation to wait a long line. Which is extraodinarily wasteful as they could be doing underutilized attractions in the meantime. But it seems the more fair system as virtual queue don't cost anything they will be sold out immediately after opening and people are selected on their knowledge of the system. Finally with the 3rd system, the perks one, people are selected with their wallet size. In some way it's a similar dilemma as proof of work vs proof of stake in crypto. But in the specific case of queue I think it's wrong to just lament that this is it and just go with the wasteful one because it's fair. I'm pretty sure an incentive structure could be found to have only virtual queues in parcs while selecting visitors on core motivations. Maybe some token system in which the visitors would be given a finite number of tokens to spend on attractions with some auction system?

Beldin 5y ago
Alternative system: the virtual queue is for free; every 15 minutes, there are only a limited amount of virtual queue tickets available for a specific 15 minute slot significantly later (eg. +2hr) in the day. If that also goes to capacity, your capacity is too low for the amount of folks you let in. Increase capacity on this ride, increase attractiveness of other rides with more capacity, build new rides, or create other things eating up time other than rides.
- mcphage 5y ago
  > Increase capacity on this ride, increase attractiveness of other rides with more capacity, build new rides, or create other things eating up time other than rides. All things that Disney is also working on simultaneously.