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My take is opposite. Everybody with a bit of common sense would see such claims as problematic immediately and so they can dive deeper into the stuff. The probl

My take is opposite. Everybody with a bit of common sense would see such claims as problematic immediately and so they can dive deeper into the stuff. The problem is so much easier to explain if one uses the visual approach with proportional boxes for each age group. Single metric (projection) can distort a multi-dimensional data significantly, everyone knows that. But unfortunately people make the same mistake again all the time.

mcguire 5y ago
"But unfortunately people make the same mistake again all the time." Exactly what the previous comment said.
mattcwilson 5y ago
Agreed. No one needs to become an expert in every possible field. What we do need to do is educate people out of new forms of innumeracy and illiteracy, where they are falling prey to basic fallacies of statistics or rhetorical tricks like motte and bailey and cat couplings. People are generally familiar with logical fallacies like ad hominem, strawman arguments, or circular reasoning. New weapons of persuasion are getting crafted every day; we owe it to ourselves, each other, and the future humans to educate them on defense against the dark arts.
- tjpnz 5y ago
  Sounds good in theory but what about those who've fallen so hopelessly down the rabbit hole? I've pointed out the statistical flaws in the tweets and Instagram posts they send me, often there's an "aha" moment. But then they'll find another article from a questionable source or tweet from some "data scientist" misrepresenting data from John's Hopkins and the process begins all over again. Debunking the same nonsense over and over again is exhausting.
  - mattcwilson 5y ago
    I don’t have a ton of hope for some short-term (5-10 years) corrective out of the present state of affairs. What I do see happening in that timeframe is a recognition that these skills are foundational to online culture and discourse, and a push to inculcate them in forthcoming generations through education and private and public policy action. An immune response evolving to the environmental harms of Twitter, if you will. But yeah - that chap who keeps failing at science in your Insta is likely a lost cause.

mcguire 5y ago

"But unfortunately people make the same mistake again all the time." Exactly what the previous comment said.

mattcwilson 5y ago

Agreed. No one needs to become an expert in every possible field. What we do need to do is educate people out of new forms of innumeracy and illiteracy, where they are falling prey to basic fallacies of statistics or rhetorical tricks like motte and bailey and cat couplings. People are generally familiar with logical fallacies like ad hominem, strawman arguments, or circular reasoning. New weapons of persuasion are getting crafted every day; we owe it to ourselves, each other, and the future humans to educate them on defense against the dark arts.

tjpnz 5y ago
Sounds good in theory but what about those who've fallen so hopelessly down the rabbit hole? I've pointed out the statistical flaws in the tweets and Instagram posts they send me, often there's an "aha" moment. But then they'll find another article from a questionable source or tweet from some "data scientist" misrepresenting data from John's Hopkins and the process begins all over again. Debunking the same nonsense over and over again is exhausting.
- mattcwilson 5y ago
  I don’t have a ton of hope for some short-term (5-10 years) corrective out of the present state of affairs. What I do see happening in that timeframe is a recognition that these skills are foundational to online culture and discourse, and a push to inculcate them in forthcoming generations through education and private and public policy action. An immune response evolving to the environmental harms of Twitter, if you will. But yeah - that chap who keeps failing at science in your Insta is likely a lost cause.