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I've spent time in Qatar. It was weird, as a western woman I felt completely alien. Not just because of the desert dust and the stark stark glassy steel city th

I've spent time in Qatar. It was weird, as a western woman I felt completely alien. Not just because of the desert dust and the stark stark glassy steel city that suddenly rises from it. Mostly we shuttled between a compound and fancy hotels, malls and yacht clubs. And my friends I was visiting were not even rich, just working regular expat jobs (in petro or gas of course, helicopter to work some days..). Those I know who stay there are going just a little mad. But slowly rich. Is it worth it?

kzrdude 5y ago
Mad in which way? The people I've heard about (professionally) who went to continue their career in Dubai, I couldn't really respect anymore. It's hard to understand choosing to work in that place.
- telesilla 5y ago
  Mad in the way I imagine any colonialist ex-pat going mad, as empires threaten each other around you and you put on a white shirt and suffer through the heat. The same that happens and has happened since merchants and wealth-seekers have isolated themselves so much from reality (protected by the butlers and maids and drivers and security guards, never setting a foot in a local's house, neither a rich nor poor one) that finally they go all in and become regime apologetics.
  - cmrdporcupine 5y ago
    Reminds me of Orwell's "Shooting An Elephant"
- chanc3e 5y ago
  People I know who’ve done it: • getting a drink (alcohol) is a major pain. Either underground, or some elite venue where rules don’t apply - and the jeopardy that goes with that. Really want to spill wine on a Prince? And there are a lot of princes. • feeling of underlying state level threat if you mess up • some workers are treated as literal slaves openly • getting your money home can be troublesome. Check out Dubai airport and abandoned super cars People who tend to fare better are very career focused and can ignore the above. Also if you or your partner are into the five star life. Edit: formatting
  - biztos 5y ago
    To be fair, wasn’t the fancy-car abandonment thing just a result of people taking on crazy debt in a country that still has debtors prison, and then bailing out when they were predictably close to that jeopardy? Seems like rational behavior from both sides in the end.
    - chanc3e 5y ago
      For sure. With a healthy percentage of “I have £100k and I can only bring £10k before I need to declare tax and my employer canned the project and my visa. Allow the car”
      - rosndo 5y ago
        Unless you mess up really badly, such a situation really doesn’t exist. If you had 100k, you’d presumably spend a few of them to get an investor visa. That would give you a plenty of time to find a foreign bank to accept your money.
  - aliswe 5y ago
    those who left their supercars at the airport didnt have any money to send home - they were virtually bankrupt. also, "there are a lot of princes" sure youre not mixing saudi with qatar here?
    - chanc3e 5y ago
      4000 Princes, over 10k members of the royal family, Saudi.
  - rosndo 5y ago
    > getting a drink (alcohol) is a major pain. Either underground, or some elite venue where rules don’t apply - and the jeopardy that goes with that. Really want to spill wine on a Prince? And there are a lot of princes. In Dubai you can get a drink just about anywhere. > getting your money home can be troublesome. Check out Dubai airport and abandoned super cars It’s really not difficult to transfer money out of Dubai. Those cars are abandoned by people who couldn’t make their payments and fled the country.
ethbr0 5y ago
This describes my time with expats in Venezuela pretty well (~2000?). At some point, you realize every place you visit is surrounded by 12' walls topped with razor wire. I guess you wilfully ignore the strangeness if you have to live there, but it was really disquieting to visit.
gerash 5y ago
Off topic but are expat and immigrant the same concept?
- windock 5y ago
  Expat is a Western immigrant in non-Western country
- rosndo 5y ago
  Expats are white immigrants. Not sure why kranke155 got flagged for saying this, it’s the truth.
- MaurizioPz 5y ago
  From what I understand (not native speaker) yes but from different points of view. You are an expat out of a country. You are an immigrant into a country. So usually you are both.
  - seanmcdirmid 5y ago
    You are confusing expat with emigrant.
- inawarminister 5y ago
  expat has the implications that you're only there for a while and will return home. The true concept for immigration would be emigrant (emigres) but this doesn't seem to have popular English usage nowadays.
- kranke155 5y ago
  Expat is when you’re white and wealthy. Black and brown people are immigrants
  - aliswe 5y ago
    tbh this isnt dubai terminology. all professionals call themselves expats.
- 5y ago
forkLding 5y ago
I was born to an expat family in neighbouring Bahrain, it was a similar experience. Overall, I would say it is worth it if you are poorer or looking to make money. It's a place where you can grow rich but later on your family leaves for a better place.

kzrdude 5y ago

Mad in which way? The people I've heard about (professionally) who went to continue their career in Dubai, I couldn't really respect anymore. It's hard to understand choosing to work in that place.

telesilla 5y ago
Mad in the way I imagine any colonialist ex-pat going mad, as empires threaten each other around you and you put on a white shirt and suffer through the heat. The same that happens and has happened since merchants and wealth-seekers have isolated themselves so much from reality (protected by the butlers and maids and drivers and security guards, never setting a foot in a local's house, neither a rich nor poor one) that finally they go all in and become regime apologetics.
- cmrdporcupine 5y ago
  Reminds me of Orwell's "Shooting An Elephant"
chanc3e 5y ago
People I know who’ve done it: • getting a drink (alcohol) is a major pain. Either underground, or some elite venue where rules don’t apply - and the jeopardy that goes with that. Really want to spill wine on a Prince? And there are a lot of princes. • feeling of underlying state level threat if you mess up • some workers are treated as literal slaves openly • getting your money home can be troublesome. Check out Dubai airport and abandoned super cars People who tend to fare better are very career focused and can ignore the above. Also if you or your partner are into the five star life. Edit: formatting
- biztos 5y ago
  To be fair, wasn’t the fancy-car abandonment thing just a result of people taking on crazy debt in a country that still has debtors prison, and then bailing out when they were predictably close to that jeopardy? Seems like rational behavior from both sides in the end.
  - chanc3e 5y ago
    For sure. With a healthy percentage of “I have £100k and I can only bring £10k before I need to declare tax and my employer canned the project and my visa. Allow the car”
    - rosndo 5y ago
      Unless you mess up really badly, such a situation really doesn’t exist. If you had 100k, you’d presumably spend a few of them to get an investor visa. That would give you a plenty of time to find a foreign bank to accept your money.
- aliswe 5y ago
  those who left their supercars at the airport didnt have any money to send home - they were virtually bankrupt. also, "there are a lot of princes" sure youre not mixing saudi with qatar here?
  - chanc3e 5y ago
    4000 Princes, over 10k members of the royal family, Saudi.
- rosndo 5y ago
  > getting a drink (alcohol) is a major pain. Either underground, or some elite venue where rules don’t apply - and the jeopardy that goes with that. Really want to spill wine on a Prince? And there are a lot of princes. In Dubai you can get a drink just about anywhere. > getting your money home can be troublesome. Check out Dubai airport and abandoned super cars It’s really not difficult to transfer money out of Dubai. Those cars are abandoned by people who couldn’t make their payments and fled the country.

ethbr0 5y ago

This describes my time with expats in Venezuela pretty well (~2000?). At some point, you realize every place you visit is surrounded by 12' walls topped with razor wire. I guess you wilfully ignore the strangeness if you have to live there, but it was really disquieting to visit.

gerash 5y ago

Off topic but are expat and immigrant the same concept?

windock 5y ago
Expat is a Western immigrant in non-Western country
rosndo 5y ago
Expats are white immigrants. Not sure why kranke155 got flagged for saying this, it’s the truth.
MaurizioPz 5y ago
From what I understand (not native speaker) yes but from different points of view. You are an expat out of a country. You are an immigrant into a country. So usually you are both.
- seanmcdirmid 5y ago
  You are confusing expat with emigrant.
inawarminister 5y ago
expat has the implications that you're only there for a while and will return home. The true concept for immigration would be emigrant (emigres) but this doesn't seem to have popular English usage nowadays.
kranke155 5y ago
Expat is when you’re white and wealthy. Black and brown people are immigrants
- aliswe 5y ago
  tbh this isnt dubai terminology. all professionals call themselves expats.
5y ago

forkLding 5y ago

I was born to an expat family in neighbouring Bahrain, it was a similar experience. Overall, I would say it is worth it if you are poorer or looking to make money. It's a place where you can grow rich but later on your family leaves for a better place.