4 ms·

At least in Germany, having to cancel by sending a letter (or, amusingly, sometimes a fax works) is still common.

by wheels 5y ago

sorokod 5y ago
Was cancelling my cell provider and was required to send a fax - hello Vodafone.de
- littlecranky67 5y ago
  Cancellation by mail is always fine, no company can opt out of it in a legal way. You don't even need to get the address right, you can mail it to any subsidiary of the company - it is the companys responsibility to correctly route it internally. You can even directly address it to the CEO and at "persönlich" to it. My favorite.
  - pantulis 5y ago
    You would need proof of receipt and proof of content in case contract termination does not happen, though.
    - littlecranky67 5y ago
      In theory yes, in practice I had multiple disputes over contract termination and in 100% of those cases the counterparty with happy with the photo. And also compare it to any "phone calls" where you basically have nothing as a proof (dunno about your jurisdiction, but in Germany it is illegal to record phone calls without prior consent and also would require technical means to do so). Also, if you ever worked in a large corporation, they have a lot of means to track incoming mail ("Posteingangsbuch") and for an enterprise to try to pretend not to have received a letter would require maldoing by a lot of employees (who usually are not commited to giving false statements in court for their employer).
hnbad 5y ago
This is true for traditional "contracts", e.g. phone, apartments, gyms, etc, but these generally also involve paperwork when signing up (though in some of these cases you can sign up online and then have the confirmation mailed to you). This is definitely not the case for websites or apps and I'm pretty sure what the NYT is doing wouldn't amuse German consumer protection agencies.
joeberon 5y ago
Germany operates on way more paper systems than the US though
Faaak 5y ago
In general I write an e-mail saying "please don't make us waste more time by requiring me to send a letter and please revoke my current subscription". Works somewhat
- wheels 5y ago
  There are third party services that handle cancellation (e.g. Aboalarm) that are more reliable, and don't require any more time. I honestly just have an online fax account where I can upload a PDF to send a fax for like 20 cents, and that almost always works. It's still a dark pattern though.
imtringued 5y ago
Stupidly enough, you have to cancel SEPA direct debit mandates with a written document to the merchant.
whazor 5y ago
In The Netherlands there are companies that will fill in, print, and send cancellation letters for you as a service. They rank very high in Google search.

At least in Germany, having to cancel by sending a letter (or, amusingly, sometimes a fax works) is still common.

by wheels 5y ago

At least in Germany, having to cancel by sending a letter (or, amusingly, sometimes a fax works) is still common.

sorokod 5y ago

Was cancelling my cell provider and was required to send a fax - hello Vodafone.de

littlecranky67 5y ago
Cancellation by mail is always fine, no company can opt out of it in a legal way. You don't even need to get the address right, you can mail it to any subsidiary of the company - it is the companys responsibility to correctly route it internally. You can even directly address it to the CEO and at "persönlich" to it. My favorite.
- pantulis 5y ago
  You would need proof of receipt and proof of content in case contract termination does not happen, though.
  - littlecranky67 5y ago
    In theory yes, in practice I had multiple disputes over contract termination and in 100% of those cases the counterparty with happy with the photo. And also compare it to any "phone calls" where you basically have nothing as a proof (dunno about your jurisdiction, but in Germany it is illegal to record phone calls without prior consent and also would require technical means to do so). Also, if you ever worked in a large corporation, they have a lot of means to track incoming mail ("Posteingangsbuch") and for an enterprise to try to pretend not to have received a letter would require maldoing by a lot of employees (who usually are not commited to giving false statements in court for their employer).

hnbad 5y ago

This is true for traditional "contracts", e.g. phone, apartments, gyms, etc, but these generally also involve paperwork when signing up (though in some of these cases you can sign up online and then have the confirmation mailed to you). This is definitely not the case for websites or apps and I'm pretty sure what the NYT is doing wouldn't amuse German consumer protection agencies.

joeberon 5y ago

Germany operates on way more paper systems than the US though

Faaak 5y ago

In general I write an e-mail saying "please don't make us waste more time by requiring me to send a letter and please revoke my current subscription". Works somewhat

wheels 5y ago
There are third party services that handle cancellation (e.g. Aboalarm) that are more reliable, and don't require any more time. I honestly just have an online fax account where I can upload a PDF to send a fax for like 20 cents, and that almost always works. It's still a dark pattern though.

imtringued 5y ago

Stupidly enough, you have to cancel SEPA direct debit mandates with a written document to the merchant.

whazor 5y ago

In The Netherlands there are companies that will fill in, print, and send cancellation letters for you as a service. They rank very high in Google search.