5 ms·

It's because there was no freewheel. A chain tensioner only works well when there is driving force applied in one direction, not the other. Put any force backwa

It's because there was no freewheel. A chain tensioner only works well when there is driving force applied in one direction, not the other. Put any force backward into the pedals (e.g. to slow down) and the tensioner will be forced to its most slack position (or broken off).

top_sigrid 5y ago
Ok, this makes perfectly sense and is actually quite easy to understand. Thanks from a mechanical noob.
mauvehaus 5y ago
The article describes it as four sprockets on a freehub. One would hope that cyclingtips.com would get that fairly material detail correct. It also mentions the rider having to pedal backwards to shift the chain among the sprockets. That would not be possible on a fixed hub without slowing to a stop and reversing. One suspects that would rather negate any benefits of this system over a flip-flop wheel.
- jzwinck 5y ago
  The freehub was not invented for another 30 years. But I see that the Cambio Corsa did have a freewheel (similar idea). I was wrong to think it used four fixed gears. So indeed it could have used a chain tensioner! Video showing it in action (skip to the middle): https://youtu.be/MQe0fLEQ2jY https://youtu.be/MQe0fLEQ2jY
  - Cockbrand 5y ago
    I think there's a mixup between two things here. A _freehub_ contains both the cassette body and the _freewheel_. The former has been invented in the 1930s and popularized by Shimano in the late 1970s [1], the latter has been around since the 19th century [2]. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freehub https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freehub [2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freewheel https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freewheel
  - ptha 5y ago
    Just a link skipping to the gear change: https://youtu.be/MQe0fLEQ2jY?t=165 https://youtu.be/MQe0fLEQ2jY?t=165
  - mauvehaus 5y ago
    Yeah, I kind of let that one slide since it makes no difference from the standpoint of somebody trying to change gears while simultaneously not dying :-) And let's be honest: it's entirely possible that the author has never changed a cassette or freewheel or seen a freewheel if they have. I'm almost 40, and I've only ever seen freewheels on pretty old 10 and 12 speeds (that's 2x5 and 2x6. Not a modern 1x drivetrain). And only because I volunteered at a place that fixes up bikes.
xattt 5y ago
At the risk of this turning into an episode of Connections with James Burke playing out in text, why was there no freewheel at that point in time yet?
- jacquesm 5y ago
  There was, the article mentions the cyclist having to pedal backwards in order to allow the chain slack to be taken up when gearing 'up' (smaller sprocket). That would be impossible without a freewheel, unless they mean to say 'exert some pressure backwards' rather than backwards pedaling, I don't see how a fixed linkage would be compatible with this system, it would behave terribly bad during a gear change because the system would always be under tension. Freewheels were in use in the tour since 1936 at least, and possibly even earlier: https://hizokucycles.bigcartel.com/single-speed-history https://hizokucycles.bigcartel.com/single-speed-history
analog31 5y ago
A cycling historian could clear up whether freewheels were allowed in racing during that time period. They were forbidden in the original Tour of France. Variable gearing already existed, in enclosed gear hubs, and remained a preferred choice for non competition cycling for at least into the earl 1970s.
- ubermonkey 5y ago
  Worldwide, enclosed-gear hubs are STILL vastly more popular than derailleur-style gearing implementations, btw. They're part of what we might call the divide between "cycling" and "riding a bicycle." The cycling hobby is mostly about go-fast or go-far for its own sake, but in much of the world a bicycle is just transportation. In those places, you trade away efficiency or speed or weight in favor of the "it just works forever" bulletproof-ness that the enclosed hub provides.
  - analog31 5y ago
    Indeed, my daily driver is a Sturmey Archer AW from 1963. But I must say, contemporary derailleur systems with indexed shifting work pretty darn well.
    - ubermonkey 5y ago
      They need maintenance that sealed-hub bikes can mostly do without, though. My road bike has SRAM eTap on it. It's beautiful, sleek, and shifts perfectly almost every time. BUT that performance starts to suffer if I let the drive train get dirty, especially if I let gunk accumulate on the jockey wheels. Your Sturmey can be ridden without such concerns. I mean, I'd never be able to keep up on my group rides on it, but for a general use bicycle it's probably superior.
      - analog31 5y ago
        I built a three speed road bike, and its downfall was riding with others due to the low ratio. When you're riding solo, you can ride at the right speed for a gear. But in a group, others are choosing your speed for you. Also, I like having a few more gears after mile 30 or 40.

top_sigrid 5y ago

Ok, this makes perfectly sense and is actually quite easy to understand. Thanks from a mechanical noob.

mauvehaus 5y ago

The article describes it as four sprockets on a freehub. One would hope that cyclingtips.com would get that fairly material detail correct. It also mentions the rider having to pedal backwards to shift the chain among the sprockets. That would not be possible on a fixed hub without slowing to a stop and reversing. One suspects that would rather negate any benefits of this system over a flip-flop wheel.

jzwinck 5y ago
The freehub was not invented for another 30 years. But I see that the Cambio Corsa did have a freewheel (similar idea). I was wrong to think it used four fixed gears. So indeed it could have used a chain tensioner! Video showing it in action (skip to the middle): https://youtu.be/MQe0fLEQ2jY https://youtu.be/MQe0fLEQ2jY
- Cockbrand 5y ago
  I think there's a mixup between two things here. A _freehub_ contains both the cassette body and the _freewheel_. The former has been invented in the 1930s and popularized by Shimano in the late 1970s [1], the latter has been around since the 19th century [2]. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freehub https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freehub [2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freewheel https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freewheel
- ptha 5y ago
  Just a link skipping to the gear change: https://youtu.be/MQe0fLEQ2jY?t=165 https://youtu.be/MQe0fLEQ2jY?t=165
- mauvehaus 5y ago
  Yeah, I kind of let that one slide since it makes no difference from the standpoint of somebody trying to change gears while simultaneously not dying :-) And let's be honest: it's entirely possible that the author has never changed a cassette or freewheel or seen a freewheel if they have. I'm almost 40, and I've only ever seen freewheels on pretty old 10 and 12 speeds (that's 2x5 and 2x6. Not a modern 1x drivetrain). And only because I volunteered at a place that fixes up bikes.

xattt 5y ago

At the risk of this turning into an episode of Connections with James Burke playing out in text, why was there no freewheel at that point in time yet?

jacquesm 5y ago
There was, the article mentions the cyclist having to pedal backwards in order to allow the chain slack to be taken up when gearing 'up' (smaller sprocket). That would be impossible without a freewheel, unless they mean to say 'exert some pressure backwards' rather than backwards pedaling, I don't see how a fixed linkage would be compatible with this system, it would behave terribly bad during a gear change because the system would always be under tension. Freewheels were in use in the tour since 1936 at least, and possibly even earlier: https://hizokucycles.bigcartel.com/single-speed-history https://hizokucycles.bigcartel.com/single-speed-history

analog31 5y ago

A cycling historian could clear up whether freewheels were allowed in racing during that time period. They were forbidden in the original Tour of France. Variable gearing already existed, in enclosed gear hubs, and remained a preferred choice for non competition cycling for at least into the earl 1970s.

ubermonkey 5y ago
Worldwide, enclosed-gear hubs are STILL vastly more popular than derailleur-style gearing implementations, btw. They're part of what we might call the divide between "cycling" and "riding a bicycle." The cycling hobby is mostly about go-fast or go-far for its own sake, but in much of the world a bicycle is just transportation. In those places, you trade away efficiency or speed or weight in favor of the "it just works forever" bulletproof-ness that the enclosed hub provides.
- analog31 5y ago
  Indeed, my daily driver is a Sturmey Archer AW from 1963. But I must say, contemporary derailleur systems with indexed shifting work pretty darn well.
  - ubermonkey 5y ago
    They need maintenance that sealed-hub bikes can mostly do without, though. My road bike has SRAM eTap on it. It's beautiful, sleek, and shifts perfectly almost every time. BUT that performance starts to suffer if I let the drive train get dirty, especially if I let gunk accumulate on the jockey wheels. Your Sturmey can be ridden without such concerns. I mean, I'd never be able to keep up on my group rides on it, but for a general use bicycle it's probably superior.
    - analog31 5y ago
      I built a three speed road bike, and its downfall was riding with others due to the low ratio. When you're riding solo, you can ride at the right speed for a gear. But in a group, others are choosing your speed for you. Also, I like having a few more gears after mile 30 or 40.