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Why would paying more for teachers fix the issue? The best teachers will still prefer private school because kids are more displined. You end up paying more f

by ipaddr 5y ago

Why would paying more for teachers fix the issue? The best teachers will still prefer private school because kids are more displined. You end up paying more for the same or worse now you attract a new group who are in it for the money. Education starts at home and without a learning culture with displine these children are setup to fail.

mjevans 5y ago
Easier to understand: Hogwarts. Harry Potter was pried from that little dusty cupboard closet beneath the stairs and sent to somewhere to reach success. Send kids that don't have a good home life to someplace where the adults care and have the resources to see that they do succeed.
- seanmcdirmid 5y ago
  Boarding schools aren’t popular in the USA. Where they are used for poverty reasons (eg China), racism is easily involved (Uighur kids are more often shunted to boarding schools than Han kids in xinjiang). We also tried this with Native Americans in the 20th century and that turned out really bad.
  - mjevans 5y ago
    That turned out really bad because only the problem (political problem) kids went there, and they also were often privately run and had very lax oversight.
- remarkEon 5y ago
  "Hogwarts" reference aside, you are right that extremely structured environments (boarding schools are what I assume you are alluding to) can actually bring out the best in young bright people, especially young men, and it's unfortunate that we've basically done away with that in the United States as a way to educate children.
- YeGoblynQueenne 5y ago
  Harry Potter was a "chosen one" who was given special attention by his teachers. I don't think his teachers gave the same attention to other students, who didn't have a thunder-shaped scar in their brow and couldn't speak you-know-who's name without wincing. Rather, I think it was Hermione Granger that embodied the role model of the student from an underprivilged background who works hard to achieve academic success.
jim-jim-jim 5y ago
Anecdotal, but during my time as a teacher, the one variable that seemed to govern the success/failure of students was home life—especially whether or not the child had two loving parents. Poverty seems to be the common denominator in those unstable households. I think a broad and robust approach to our collective welfare can address the issue far better than "more money to education!" can.
- _AzMoo 5y ago
  It's not just anecdotal. https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S027656241200042X?via%3Dihub https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S02765... Just one example of many. Everybody's talking about the problems with schools, but the issue is the enormous gap in economic inequality that is just growing larger and larger. Parents who have to work 2-3 jobs to support their families don't have the time or energy to devote to supporting their children in their academic lives.
  - dorchadas 5y ago
    And often those same kids don't have time to dedicate to their studies, having to work after school to help support their family. Teaching at the rural school I grew up in really changed my perspective. I was very abnormal when growing up there, and all my friends were too (I can only think of one good friend who's parents were divorced, and her mom and remarried when she was fairly young), and I was super insulated from the realities of things there. Coming back as a teacher made me see how much worse it is, and it's a clear difference between the kids; even those kids whose parents want them to do well struggle if the parents can't be at home.

by ipaddr 5y ago

mjevans 5y ago

Easier to understand: Hogwarts. Harry Potter was pried from that little dusty cupboard closet beneath the stairs and sent to somewhere to reach success. Send kids that don't have a good home life to someplace where the adults care and have the resources to see that they do succeed.

seanmcdirmid 5y ago
Boarding schools aren’t popular in the USA. Where they are used for poverty reasons (eg China), racism is easily involved (Uighur kids are more often shunted to boarding schools than Han kids in xinjiang). We also tried this with Native Americans in the 20th century and that turned out really bad.
- mjevans 5y ago
  That turned out really bad because only the problem (political problem) kids went there, and they also were often privately run and had very lax oversight.
remarkEon 5y ago
"Hogwarts" reference aside, you are right that extremely structured environments (boarding schools are what I assume you are alluding to) can actually bring out the best in young bright people, especially young men, and it's unfortunate that we've basically done away with that in the United States as a way to educate children.
YeGoblynQueenne 5y ago
Harry Potter was a "chosen one" who was given special attention by his teachers. I don't think his teachers gave the same attention to other students, who didn't have a thunder-shaped scar in their brow and couldn't speak you-know-who's name without wincing. Rather, I think it was Hermione Granger that embodied the role model of the student from an underprivilged background who works hard to achieve academic success.

jim-jim-jim 5y ago

Anecdotal, but during my time as a teacher, the one variable that seemed to govern the success/failure of students was home life—especially whether or not the child had two loving parents. Poverty seems to be the common denominator in those unstable households. I think a broad and robust approach to our collective welfare can address the issue far better than "more money to education!" can.

_AzMoo 5y ago
It's not just anecdotal. https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S027656241200042X?via%3Dihub https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S02765... Just one example of many. Everybody's talking about the problems with schools, but the issue is the enormous gap in economic inequality that is just growing larger and larger. Parents who have to work 2-3 jobs to support their families don't have the time or energy to devote to supporting their children in their academic lives.
- dorchadas 5y ago
  And often those same kids don't have time to dedicate to their studies, having to work after school to help support their family. Teaching at the rural school I grew up in really changed my perspective. I was very abnormal when growing up there, and all my friends were too (I can only think of one good friend who's parents were divorced, and her mom and remarried when she was fairly young), and I was super insulated from the realities of things there. Coming back as a teacher made me see how much worse it is, and it's a clear difference between the kids; even those kids whose parents want them to do well struggle if the parents can't be at home.