3 ms·

If the EU fines Google $70 billion, which would obviously be an intentional assault on the US economy given the extraordinary scale, the only proper response wo

If the EU fines Google $70 billion, which would obviously be an intentional assault on the US economy given the extraordinary scale, the only proper response would be for the US Government to attempt to destroy a major EU corporation in measured retaliation. Airbus is worth a bit more than $70 billion, they'd be an ideal and very easy target to sabotage. What you're suggesting is economic war.

DeathArrow 5y ago
That's fine if Airbus does evil at the same scale as Google.
- keewee7 5y ago
  Airbus is an international arms dealer.
- adventured 5y ago
  Google isn't doing evil to warrant $70b fines. I reject your premise. A $70b fine would justify the excessive targeting of a major EU corporation in response. If the EU were to pretend that Google deserved an arbitrary $70b fine, then they could just as easily pretend US big tech broadly deserves several hundred billion USD in fines. It's pretty clear where that kind of insane behavior leads.
  - matheusmoreira 5y ago
    > Google isn't doing evil to warrant $70b fines. Proportionality doesn't work with companies that are disproportionally rich. The purpose of the fine is to get them to stop violating people's rights and it's clear that pitiful 2 billion dollar fines are not going to accomplish that objective. > It's pretty clear where that kind of insane behavior leads. It leads to Google no longer being a monopoly as well as being more respectful of people's privacy.
  - bryanrasmussen 5y ago
    >Google isn't doing evil to warrant $70b fines. Ok, how much should the EU be allowed to fine Google? How about $12b, that should be 10% of the money they have on hand as I understand it. I think getting fined 10% of your operating money might make you compliant to the law - or is the problem that Google should never be fined any amount that would cause them to become compliant to the law? on edit: put dollar sign in
  - krzyk 5y ago
    > It's pretty clear where that kind of insane behavior leads. A happier, less evil world.
kazen44 5y ago
you mean like what happened with bombadier? these large coorperations and the nations backing them is nothing new. Also, it is a strategic intrest of europe to protect airbus, especially considering it is the model in terms of being a multinational, truely european company[1], compared to a national one. [1]https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Societas_Europaea https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Societas_Europaea
breakfastduck 5y ago
Ok just let them continue to effectively use piddly fines to bribe governments, what a great alternative.
matheusmoreira 5y ago
Economic war? Why can't the US simply allow the corporations to face the consequences of their actions? They probably aren't even going to jail or anything. They're free to either pay or get out of the country that's imposing the fine. Why does Google get to exploit foreign citizens and violate their rights while under the protection of the US government? Huge fines are the only thing that will work. Corporations these days are richer than nations and these little 2 billion dollar fines do nothing.
- Hasu 5y ago
  > Why can't the US simply allow the corporations to face the consequences of their actions? They can and usually do. I don't think you'll see any US government action over this $2.8b fine. If the EU decided to try to fine Google out of existence, the US government would be displeased, as that is a direct attack on US interests (it hurts US GDP, tax revenue, employment rate, and US tech dominance), and can and would take action, whether to prevent the fine from happening, to prevent Google from going out of business, or in retribution to prevent the EU from doing anything similar in the future. > They're free to either pay or get out of the country that's imposing the fine. Yes, and the EU isn't dumb enough to fine Google enough that would make them consider pulling out of the EU, as that would do pretty significant damage to the EU economy and the willingness of foreign companies to do business in the EU. > Why does Google get to exploit foreign citizens and violate their rights while under the protection of the US government? The US government doesn't really care whether Google exploits foreign citizens or violates their rights, as the US government has no obligations to protect foreign citizens and their rights, and does plenty of exploitation and violation of its own to foreign citizens. As long as Google is a net benefit for US citizens and the US government, the US government has incentives to protect Google from foreign governments. None of this is unique to the US or Google, you could replace any country and major corporation and this all still holds true. > Huge fines are the only thing that will work. Huge fines are politically impossible, they can't work at all. > Corporations these days are richer than nations and these little 2 billion dollar fines do nothing. I don't think so, on either count. The richest corporations are richer than the poorest nations, but that's been true for a long time. The richest corporations are still an order of magnitude smaller than the richest countries, though. And a $2b fine doesn't do nothing, it may do less than you want, but it's still a lot of money that the corporation no longer has and would rather have not paid.
kiryin 5y ago
What do you think should be done? What methods are there, besides harsh economic sanctions, to control entities which break regulations and detriment free society? Clearly something needs to happen, something with impact. Pray to the invisible hand?
malermeister 5y ago
Why is having to follow the law "war" for US vulture capitalists? You come to our market, you play by our rules. We don't bend the law for capital interests quite as much as you do, either get used to it or get out.

DeathArrow 5y ago

That's fine if Airbus does evil at the same scale as Google.

keewee7 5y ago
Airbus is an international arms dealer.
adventured 5y ago
Google isn't doing evil to warrant $70b fines. I reject your premise. A $70b fine would justify the excessive targeting of a major EU corporation in response. If the EU were to pretend that Google deserved an arbitrary $70b fine, then they could just as easily pretend US big tech broadly deserves several hundred billion USD in fines. It's pretty clear where that kind of insane behavior leads.
- matheusmoreira 5y ago
  > Google isn't doing evil to warrant $70b fines. Proportionality doesn't work with companies that are disproportionally rich. The purpose of the fine is to get them to stop violating people's rights and it's clear that pitiful 2 billion dollar fines are not going to accomplish that objective. > It's pretty clear where that kind of insane behavior leads. It leads to Google no longer being a monopoly as well as being more respectful of people's privacy.
- bryanrasmussen 5y ago
  >Google isn't doing evil to warrant $70b fines. Ok, how much should the EU be allowed to fine Google? How about $12b, that should be 10% of the money they have on hand as I understand it. I think getting fined 10% of your operating money might make you compliant to the law - or is the problem that Google should never be fined any amount that would cause them to become compliant to the law? on edit: put dollar sign in
- krzyk 5y ago
  > It's pretty clear where that kind of insane behavior leads. A happier, less evil world.

kazen44 5y ago

you mean like what happened with bombadier? these large coorperations and the nations backing them is nothing new. Also, it is a strategic intrest of europe to protect airbus, especially considering it is the model in terms of being a multinational, truely european company[1], compared to a national one. [1]https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Societas_Europaea https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Societas_Europaea

breakfastduck 5y ago

Ok just let them continue to effectively use piddly fines to bribe governments, what a great alternative.

matheusmoreira 5y ago

Economic war? Why can't the US simply allow the corporations to face the consequences of their actions? They probably aren't even going to jail or anything. They're free to either pay or get out of the country that's imposing the fine. Why does Google get to exploit foreign citizens and violate their rights while under the protection of the US government? Huge fines are the only thing that will work. Corporations these days are richer than nations and these little 2 billion dollar fines do nothing.

Hasu 5y ago
> Why can't the US simply allow the corporations to face the consequences of their actions? They can and usually do. I don't think you'll see any US government action over this $2.8b fine. If the EU decided to try to fine Google out of existence, the US government would be displeased, as that is a direct attack on US interests (it hurts US GDP, tax revenue, employment rate, and US tech dominance), and can and would take action, whether to prevent the fine from happening, to prevent Google from going out of business, or in retribution to prevent the EU from doing anything similar in the future. > They're free to either pay or get out of the country that's imposing the fine. Yes, and the EU isn't dumb enough to fine Google enough that would make them consider pulling out of the EU, as that would do pretty significant damage to the EU economy and the willingness of foreign companies to do business in the EU. > Why does Google get to exploit foreign citizens and violate their rights while under the protection of the US government? The US government doesn't really care whether Google exploits foreign citizens or violates their rights, as the US government has no obligations to protect foreign citizens and their rights, and does plenty of exploitation and violation of its own to foreign citizens. As long as Google is a net benefit for US citizens and the US government, the US government has incentives to protect Google from foreign governments. None of this is unique to the US or Google, you could replace any country and major corporation and this all still holds true. > Huge fines are the only thing that will work. Huge fines are politically impossible, they can't work at all. > Corporations these days are richer than nations and these little 2 billion dollar fines do nothing. I don't think so, on either count. The richest corporations are richer than the poorest nations, but that's been true for a long time. The richest corporations are still an order of magnitude smaller than the richest countries, though. And a $2b fine doesn't do nothing, it may do less than you want, but it's still a lot of money that the corporation no longer has and would rather have not paid.

kiryin 5y ago

What do you think should be done? What methods are there, besides harsh economic sanctions, to control entities which break regulations and detriment free society? Clearly something needs to happen, something with impact. Pray to the invisible hand?

malermeister 5y ago

Why is having to follow the law "war" for US vulture capitalists? You come to our market, you play by our rules. We don't bend the law for capital interests quite as much as you do, either get used to it or get out.