5 ms·

Or we increase immigration to account for falling birthrates.

by jonny_eh 5y ago

LogonType10 5y ago
Please tell us what the "correct" birthrate is.
- wayanon 5y ago
  I think something like 2.1 births per woman for a stable population not incl migration in/out. In the U.K. it’s 1.65 but I’m not too bothered.
  - LogonType10 5y ago
    Do we want to have the same population forever? We're running out of drinking water.
    - cto_of_antifa 5y ago
      Good point. Maybe we could come up with a top-down approach to limit births for the objective of increasing our own quality of life
inawarminister 5y ago
And increase the brain drain on the developing world, yay!
- int_19h 5y ago
  It's individual persons in the developing world that make the choice to move or not. Why are you so keen to build barriers to prevent them from making that choice?
- AussieWog93 5y ago
  Brain Drain is just a theory, and a pretty contentious one at that. There's quite a bit of evidence to suggest that the positive effects of emigration can outweigh the negatives.
  - rini17 5y ago
    Can you source any examples please? What can outweigh intelligent people not improving life in home country but building career in 1st world?
    - AussieWog93 5y ago
      >Can you source any examples please? The Philippines is one that springs to mind. They have a massive industry over there training up nurses with the explicit intention of sending them overseas. The net result of this is a top class health care system. Cash remittances make up 10% of their GDP. This is in addition to a culture of overseas workers sending massive gift boxes back home once a year (often containing expensive things like smartphones and laptops for the younger generations' education). Plus you have the soft power and less tangible benefits (cultural exchange, etc.) The Government actually actively encourages people to emigrate, in fact, as it's a great way for the country to get ahead culturally and economically. They simply don't have the industry locally to support the high number of skilled and educated workers they produce. >What can outweigh intelligent people not improving life in home country but building career in 1st world? This statement carries with it a couple of assumptions: - People in a corrupt society will work hard to get an education when it doesn't give them an opportunity to make a better life overseas. - Educated people who remain in their corrupt, third-world countries of birth will have the opportunities to use their skills to improve their home country. - People in poor, but non-corrupt and growing economies that have the opportunity to stay and improve things will instead leave. I'm sure you can find multiple examples to shatter every one of those assumptions (Nigeria really sticks out for the second one).
      - rini17 5y ago
        You actually confirmed my assumptions about self-perpetuating corruption. Tell me who is going to actually improve that if most people with necessary skills and mindset leave? Sending back money alone won't do it. These people may personally have worse life if they stayed, not denying that. But what about global view? First world will eventually have to deal with resulting political turmoil.

Or we increase immigration to account for falling birthrates.

LogonType10 5y ago

Please tell us what the "correct" birthrate is.

wayanon 5y ago
I think something like 2.1 births per woman for a stable population not incl migration in/out. In the U.K. it’s 1.65 but I’m not too bothered.
- LogonType10 5y ago
  Do we want to have the same population forever? We're running out of drinking water.
  - cto_of_antifa 5y ago
    Good point. Maybe we could come up with a top-down approach to limit births for the objective of increasing our own quality of life

inawarminister 5y ago

And increase the brain drain on the developing world, yay!

int_19h 5y ago
It's individual persons in the developing world that make the choice to move or not. Why are you so keen to build barriers to prevent them from making that choice?
AussieWog93 5y ago
Brain Drain is just a theory, and a pretty contentious one at that. There's quite a bit of evidence to suggest that the positive effects of emigration can outweigh the negatives.
- rini17 5y ago
  Can you source any examples please? What can outweigh intelligent people not improving life in home country but building career in 1st world?
  - AussieWog93 5y ago
    >Can you source any examples please? The Philippines is one that springs to mind. They have a massive industry over there training up nurses with the explicit intention of sending them overseas. The net result of this is a top class health care system. Cash remittances make up 10% of their GDP. This is in addition to a culture of overseas workers sending massive gift boxes back home once a year (often containing expensive things like smartphones and laptops for the younger generations' education). Plus you have the soft power and less tangible benefits (cultural exchange, etc.) The Government actually actively encourages people to emigrate, in fact, as it's a great way for the country to get ahead culturally and economically. They simply don't have the industry locally to support the high number of skilled and educated workers they produce. >What can outweigh intelligent people not improving life in home country but building career in 1st world? This statement carries with it a couple of assumptions: - People in a corrupt society will work hard to get an education when it doesn't give them an opportunity to make a better life overseas. - Educated people who remain in their corrupt, third-world countries of birth will have the opportunities to use their skills to improve their home country. - People in poor, but non-corrupt and growing economies that have the opportunity to stay and improve things will instead leave. I'm sure you can find multiple examples to shatter every one of those assumptions (Nigeria really sticks out for the second one).
    - rini17 5y ago
      You actually confirmed my assumptions about self-perpetuating corruption. Tell me who is going to actually improve that if most people with necessary skills and mindset leave? Sending back money alone won't do it. These people may personally have worse life if they stayed, not denying that. But what about global view? First world will eventually have to deal with resulting political turmoil.