7 ms·

“Illegal” Moscow state university network built by students (2002-2013)

165 points by lathiat 5y ago

martimarkov 5y ago
I’m from Bulgaria and I don’t remember it 100% but I think most internet networks in the early days were built in some Gassion like that. Cables just hanging on trees and switch as well. As for the article… there is a big part of me being extremely jealous for not being able to get that experience. :/
Nextgrid 5y ago
Note that this hacked-together network can provide more bandwidth than what a significant majority has in most countries in 2021.
lmilcin 5y ago
I have been one of admins of a legal but student-operated network in a dorm with about 250 rooms. It was around 2000-2001 and it was 10BASE2 (with BNC connector). It was hell and heaven. On one side we had free, unrestricted couple hundred megabits per second when the rest of the country was dreaming about having a modem. On the other hand there were 5 lines of BNC cable each spanning one entire floor with about 50 rooms connected. Clueless students mishandling their T connector would regularly got significant portion of the dorm without network access. Once had a situation where one of the rooms would regularly be responsible for network disconnections. I binary-searched the spot so I knew it must be inside the room but the room was always closed when this happened and nobody responded. It took some time but I figured it out. The guy had sex with his girlfriend on a bed that rested on the BNC to BNC coupler.
isitdopamine 5y ago
Wonderful write up! This part hit on me > Getting on the roof was illegal, of course, and required a bit of climbing walls. But who cared? Delivering an internet connection to our friends and other students was much more important It’s not the point of the linked post, but it made me think about the value of friendship. Nearly everything in life is transactional, even romantic relationships can be quite transactional, but these people were risking their lives climbing walls just to see their friends have Internet. And of course also for the intellectual challenge of providing Internet to the building! Probably friendship is the purest human feeling there is.
forgotmypw17 5y ago
https://archive.md/sIt0K https://archive.md/sIt0K
betaby 5y ago
Various spontaneous networks were build at Belorussian universities (БГУ, БГУИР) as well in ~1997-2002. In about 2002 they were rebuild and legalized to some degree.
0des 5y ago
This is thrilling to see and read, but a few paragraphs and photos in I get a sad nagging feeling knowing that today this type of thing would likely get us complicated or put in trouble in so many different ways (USA). I keep thinking "how dangerous it is to have photo evidence of this", and it overrides the part of my brain thinking "this is a story for the ages, and I'm glad there is photo evidence of this".
- TeeMassive 5y ago
  Pretty much what happened to Aaron Swartz.
  - totalZero 5y ago
    Perhaps it's a bit flippant to make this not-obviously-true assertion without attaching any reasoning.
    - TeeMassive 5y ago
      Your comment is noted
- goodpoint 5y ago
  > or put in trouble in so many different ways (USA) Building a network puts you in trouble? Cooperation, technical skills and social competence is what universities are meant to teach. It's bad that an university could punish students for that... and quite appalling that people accept this state of affairs.
  - ev1 5y ago
    Most universities already punish you for attaching anything to their network that isn't an end user device. I know a switch or router in my old dorm will result in a near instant switchport disable, even with DHCP off.
    - 0des 5y ago
ulisaneo 5y ago
This kind of articles always reminds me how conservative I've become. There are chances where I could have built something like this, but I didn't and now I regret that.
catlikesshrimp 5y ago
[flagged]
vzaliva 5y ago
1. It sad that one of the country top universities could not provide Internet access in the dorms. but not suprising. 2. I see a lot of fire hazard in the photos
- xattt 5y ago
  Russian culture is fairly tolerant for visual clutter and generally doesn’t care about aesthetics. This might be related to the “worn-down” psyche of the people who endured a lot of cultural upheaval that was not in their favour. Think about a time where you were under pressure and the general state of your desk/room/home. There is a lot of relief when something just works (i.e. this network). This may be a stretch but consideration for dangers that are remote and hard-to-imagine (i.e. fire safety) typically doesn’t happen in Russia, a la Maslow’s Hierachy of Needs, because the in-between needs aren’t taken care of.
- londons_explore 5y ago
  Concrete buildings don't really burn well. That means one doesn't have to be as careful with other fire safety stuff as even a major fire normally won't affect more than one room.
  - marcosdumay 5y ago
    Well, depending on what's inside the building, the concrete doesn't make a lot of difference. That said, I don't see all that fire hazard. The cables certainly aren't.
    - londons_explore 5y ago
      You're right - you need self-closing fire doors too. That then contains the fire, usually for long enough that it'll burn itself out before the rest of the building is damaged.
bobsmooth 5y ago
The picture of cables hanging between windows is both beautiful and nightmarish.
jcun4128 5y ago
Wonder they didn't consider wireless or can't penetrate the concrete? Regarding mesh. Could also be lack of materials.
- LeoPanthera 5y ago
  802.11b was in its very early stages of adoption in 2002. The Apple Airport only came out in 1999.
  - xattt 5y ago
    FYI the OG WRT54G came out in December 2002.
  - eripaha 5y ago
    my first intenet connection was WLAN based. 10mbits unmettered monster. This happened in 2001 in Espoo Finland. I think it cost like 20€/month. Used some standard Orinoco usb wlan adapter. Only down side was that if it was snowing the link would die.
tehjoker 5y ago
Seems like the network was really obvious. If the University had wanted to stop it they would have gotten a guy with a cherry picker to just cut the crazy cables on the outside of the building. I wonder what the situation was that they tolerated this enough without providing their own network? Lots of props to the guys that built this thing!
- wmf 5y ago
  I assume the university didn't have the budget to provide a dorm network so they didn't object much to the students building their own.
  - tehjoker 5y ago
    This makes sense on the surface, but why then continually mess with the student network instead of working out a way for them to do it in a partnership? That said, the way it actually ended up being provided probably built a lot of solidarity among the students, but at the same time prevented fair access to people outside the service range.
walterbell 5y ago
Important history. The real network was the human network :) A decade-long scientific study.
masteruvpuppetz 5y ago
1) what's with Russia and naked chics? Even a post about modest internet has one :) 2) The wires kinda resemble Cable net that used to (still does I think) provided internet across cities in Pakistan 20 years ago
- baybal2 5y ago
  What amuses me is that Pakistan now has universal GePON, better than most of America, and Europe, but they can't still put cable channels
- BelenusMordred 5y ago
  > naked She's not wearing a top, for many on Earth that's not considered naked, this is hardly a "Russian" thing, most of Europe has no such prudish hang ups. America on the other hand considers it on par with extreme violence being shown on tv. Just a cultural issue I guess.

165 points by lathiat 5y ago

I’m from Bulgaria and I don’t remember it 100% but I think most internet networks in the early days were built in some Gassion like that. Cables just hanging on trees and switch as well. As for the article… there is a big part of me being extremely jealous for not being able to get that experience. :/

Nextgrid 5y ago

Note that this hacked-together network can provide more bandwidth than what a significant majority has in most countries in 2021.

lmilcin 5y ago

I have been one of admins of a legal but student-operated network in a dorm with about 250 rooms. It was around 2000-2001 and it was 10BASE2 (with BNC connector). It was hell and heaven. On one side we had free, unrestricted couple hundred megabits per second when the rest of the country was dreaming about having a modem. On the other hand there were 5 lines of BNC cable each spanning one entire floor with about 50 rooms connected. Clueless students mishandling their T connector would regularly got significant portion of the dorm without network access. Once had a situation where one of the rooms would regularly be responsible for network disconnections. I binary-searched the spot so I knew it must be inside the room but the room was always closed when this happened and nobody responded. It took some time but I figured it out. The guy had sex with his girlfriend on a bed that rested on the BNC to BNC coupler.

isitdopamine 5y ago

Wonderful write up! This part hit on me > Getting on the roof was illegal, of course, and required a bit of climbing walls. But who cared? Delivering an internet connection to our friends and other students was much more important It’s not the point of the linked post, but it made me think about the value of friendship. Nearly everything in life is transactional, even romantic relationships can be quite transactional, but these people were risking their lives climbing walls just to see their friends have Internet. And of course also for the intellectual challenge of providing Internet to the building! Probably friendship is the purest human feeling there is.

forgotmypw17 5y ago

https://archive.md/sIt0K https://archive.md/sIt0K

betaby 5y ago

Various spontaneous networks were build at Belorussian universities (БГУ, БГУИР) as well in ~1997-2002. In about 2002 they were rebuild and legalized to some degree.

0des 5y ago

This is thrilling to see and read, but a few paragraphs and photos in I get a sad nagging feeling knowing that today this type of thing would likely get us complicated or put in trouble in so many different ways (USA). I keep thinking "how dangerous it is to have photo evidence of this", and it overrides the part of my brain thinking "this is a story for the ages, and I'm glad there is photo evidence of this".

TeeMassive 5y ago
Pretty much what happened to Aaron Swartz.
- totalZero 5y ago
  Perhaps it's a bit flippant to make this not-obviously-true assertion without attaching any reasoning.
  - TeeMassive 5y ago
    Your comment is noted
goodpoint 5y ago
> or put in trouble in so many different ways (USA) Building a network puts you in trouble? Cooperation, technical skills and social competence is what universities are meant to teach. It's bad that an university could punish students for that... and quite appalling that people accept this state of affairs.
- ev1 5y ago
  Most universities already punish you for attaching anything to their network that isn't an end user device. I know a switch or router in my old dorm will result in a near instant switchport disable, even with DHCP off.
  - 0des 5y ago

ulisaneo 5y ago

This kind of articles always reminds me how conservative I've become. There are chances where I could have built something like this, but I didn't and now I regret that.

catlikesshrimp 5y ago

[flagged]

vzaliva 5y ago

1. It sad that one of the country top universities could not provide Internet access in the dorms. but not suprising. 2. I see a lot of fire hazard in the photos

xattt 5y ago
Russian culture is fairly tolerant for visual clutter and generally doesn’t care about aesthetics. This might be related to the “worn-down” psyche of the people who endured a lot of cultural upheaval that was not in their favour. Think about a time where you were under pressure and the general state of your desk/room/home. There is a lot of relief when something just works (i.e. this network). This may be a stretch but consideration for dangers that are remote and hard-to-imagine (i.e. fire safety) typically doesn’t happen in Russia, a la Maslow’s Hierachy of Needs, because the in-between needs aren’t taken care of.
londons_explore 5y ago
Concrete buildings don't really burn well. That means one doesn't have to be as careful with other fire safety stuff as even a major fire normally won't affect more than one room.
- marcosdumay 5y ago
  Well, depending on what's inside the building, the concrete doesn't make a lot of difference. That said, I don't see all that fire hazard. The cables certainly aren't.
  - londons_explore 5y ago
    You're right - you need self-closing fire doors too. That then contains the fire, usually for long enough that it'll burn itself out before the rest of the building is damaged.

bobsmooth 5y ago

The picture of cables hanging between windows is both beautiful and nightmarish.

jcun4128 5y ago

Wonder they didn't consider wireless or can't penetrate the concrete? Regarding mesh. Could also be lack of materials.

LeoPanthera 5y ago
802.11b was in its very early stages of adoption in 2002. The Apple Airport only came out in 1999.
- xattt 5y ago
  FYI the OG WRT54G came out in December 2002.
- eripaha 5y ago
  my first intenet connection was WLAN based. 10mbits unmettered monster. This happened in 2001 in Espoo Finland. I think it cost like 20€/month. Used some standard Orinoco usb wlan adapter. Only down side was that if it was snowing the link would die.

tehjoker 5y ago

Seems like the network was really obvious. If the University had wanted to stop it they would have gotten a guy with a cherry picker to just cut the crazy cables on the outside of the building. I wonder what the situation was that they tolerated this enough without providing their own network? Lots of props to the guys that built this thing!

wmf 5y ago
I assume the university didn't have the budget to provide a dorm network so they didn't object much to the students building their own.
- tehjoker 5y ago
  This makes sense on the surface, but why then continually mess with the student network instead of working out a way for them to do it in a partnership? That said, the way it actually ended up being provided probably built a lot of solidarity among the students, but at the same time prevented fair access to people outside the service range.

walterbell 5y ago

Important history. The real network was the human network :) A decade-long scientific study.

masteruvpuppetz 5y ago

1) what's with Russia and naked chics? Even a post about modest internet has one :) 2) The wires kinda resemble Cable net that used to (still does I think) provided internet across cities in Pakistan 20 years ago

baybal2 5y ago
What amuses me is that Pakistan now has universal GePON, better than most of America, and Europe, but they can't still put cable channels
BelenusMordred 5y ago
> naked She's not wearing a top, for many on Earth that's not considered naked, this is hardly a "Russian" thing, most of Europe has no such prudish hang ups. America on the other hand considers it on par with extreme violence being shown on tv. Just a cultural issue I guess.