9 ms·

Agree- I have been largely disappointed by USB-C. It's been okay as a smaller USB-A replacement for flash drives and mice, but in general the lesson of USB-C is

Agree- I have been largely disappointed by USB-C. It's been okay as a smaller USB-A replacement for flash drives and mice, but in general the lesson of USB-C is: just because it fits, doesn't mean it works. My personal favorite annoyance is how chargers and cables are advertised with the wattage they support, but it's really the voltage and current that matters. If you have a device that wants 20W as 9V/2.22A , your 30W charger may not support that specific combination and will charge much slower than a 20W charger that does. Edit: Yes, I went to middle school and know that power is voltage times current. My point is: having an equal or higher wattage USB-C charger is not sufficient.

nerfhammer 5y ago
> chargers and cables are advertised with the wattage they support, but it's really the voltage and current that matters. watts = volts * current
- kccqzy 5y ago
  GP's point is that although chargers are labeled with wattage, they can't output any combination of volts and currents as long as they multiply to the stated wattage. Can you take a normal 100W charger and ask it to output 100V and 1A? It can't. The Apple 29W charger supports two configurations only: 14.5V × 2A, or 5.2V × 2.4A The Apple 30W charger supports these four instead: 20V × 1.5A, 15V × 2A, 9V × 3A, 5V × 3A Do you see a problem here?
junon 5y ago
> chargers and cables are advertised with the wattage they support, but it's really the voltage and current that matters. Wattage is what you get when you multiply amps and volts. You just said the equivalent of "It's not about the ice cream, but about the ice and the cream". Also, it arguably does have everything to do with volts - if you put the too much voltage into a device, most likely you're going to damage the device, its surroundings, or yourself (i.e. in a house fire).
- awill 5y ago
  I think what OP is saying is a cable might support 30W at 5V * 6A, but not 10V * 3A.
  - junon 5y ago
    They're not interchangeable. USB-C has power negotiation, but that doesn't mean the devices support those voltages. You still need to understand the voltage ratings on both ends of a cable.
    - parineum 5y ago
      I found this comment that explains it well: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28911240 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28911240
    - anamexis 5y ago
      That is precisely the point of the original comment that you responded to.
    - javawizard 5y ago
      That's exactly what OP is saying - chargers are commonly advertised as being able to supply a particular wattage, but that particular wattage is only attainable if the device being charged supports the maximum voltage the charger is capable of delivering. OP is complaining that that leaves the true wattage of a given device/charger pair unknowable from the charger's packaging alone without further information as to what voltages and at what currents it can supply on request from the device. It's certainly a valid frustration.
      - junon 5y ago
        This makes more sense and isn't how I parsed the original comment.
  - jsjohnst 5y ago
    The reverse situation would be the case (cable supports 3A, but not 6A). For the range of voltages supported by USB-PD, the cable only cares about amperage. Copper wire doesn’t care much if it’s 5V, 50V, or 250V, it’ll carry it the same. However, if the size of the wire isn’t correct for the amperage, it’ll over heat and potentially catch fire. It’s the end device that cares about voltage and amperage both as the voltage steppers inside have to be ready to handle providing the right voltage to the chips and the amperage has to be right to handle the load.
dekhn 5y ago
I've been pretty impressed with USB-C. I've managed to add a GPU to a NUC and train/infer with tensorflow, no problems. Plug a computer into a monitor and power and keyboard/mouse at the same time, while also using same cable to pass through charge two lightning devices... I find it much harder to break a USB-C port then a micro USB port on all phones I've owned.
- nuker 5y ago
  > Plug a computer into a monitor … and get only 30Hz on 4k ;)
  - rhysmorgan 5y ago
    You can totally get 4K 60Hz, so long as the USB-C port supports DisplayPort 1.4a Alt-Mode. (which raises one of the problems with USB-C - it's impossible to tell how what features it supports)
    - mrspuratic 5y ago
      USB is meronymic morass. alt-mode was the "killer feature" for me, alt-mode MST with a bus-powered splitter to drive dual DP (or HDMI) QHD external screens from a single USB-C port. This makes a regular laptop a viable desktop replacement for me. Support for multiple external displays makes the billing, though these have 1x HDMI + 3x TB4 ports to play with.
- bb88 5y ago
  I've had headphones die because the connector came loose after around 500 insertion cycles. Several companies in China make a "mag safe"-style connector for micro usb that is really nice. Some of them only provide power/ground. Others provide the full 4-wire spec. I have a pair of Sony Headphones that annoyingly shut off the wireless when you charge them. So I didn't really care if it had the full four wire spec. There's some out there for USB-C, but I wouldn't trust them for high-speed data transfer.
  - 5y ago
r00fus 5y ago
> Agree- I have been largely disappointed by USB-C. It's been okay as a smaller USB-A replacement for flash drives and mice, but in general the lesson of USB-C is: just because it fits, doesn't mean it works. I think USB-C works fine (h/t Benson Leung) but the implementation is problematic. Partly because of the complexity of everything they've tried to shove in, also partly because USB-A still exists and is the biggest competitor USB-C needs to overcome. Give it 5 more years and we'll look at USB-A like serial ports. Till then, USB-A is legion.
- vanilla_nut 5y ago
  Given that we're already 5+ years into Apple's USB-C revolution, I'm not so confident that this is going to happen. I'm going to keep using my USB-A peripherals for a long time, and more importantly, mice, yubikeys, keyboards, and a whole lot of other things are still largely sold with USB-A. Some of those have replaceable cables... but it's still a lot of effort to move away from that. Furthermore, ditching all of those USB-A accessories and cables that still work fine just feels wasteful. If the only thing you're throwing them away for is compatibility, and not some feature that's actually improving them, even more of a waste. It's just churn to push more tech company profits.
  - bobthepanda 5y ago
    USB-A also became so widespread that they became wall plugs in their own right, so at least those will stick around a lot longer unless people start hiring electricians to change their plugs.
    - diebeforei485 5y ago
      USB-A is alright for charging small electronics. It's 5V and somewhere between 0.5A and 2.1A (1A is very common). I have charging cables (with USB-A on the power side) in multiple places around the house, using the 5V/1A adapters that shipped with iPhones over the years. This works fine, though it is slower than the "fast charging" we've grown to expect these days. The device end of these cables are miniUSB (bicycle lights), microUSB (external battery pack), USB-C (my partner's noise cancelling headphones), and many of them are Lightning (Airpods, Airpods Max, iPhones, iPads, Apple TV Remote).
FractalParadigm 5y ago
What I personally hate is how cable type/speeds aren't usually advertised. I've got a dozen or so USB-C 2.0 cables that feel useless for anything but power, and only a couple 3.0 cables that continually get lost and need replacing. The connector itself is fantastic, USB-A and USB-B have needed replacing for a long time (especially since 3.0), but the implementation has been a disaster by any measurable margin.
throw0101a 5y ago
> Agree- I have been largely disappointed by USB-C. Also: the cockamamy version/naming convention(s) of the latest USB revisions.
philliphaydon 5y ago
I'm dissappointed in USB in general, we have standards but it seems few follow standards. For example, I recently bought my wife an Asus ROG Falchion keyboard. Really tiny one with Zhuyin input. So the connection is USB-C, but if you connect ANY USB-C cable to the keyboard, it wont charge. Even the USB-C <> USB-C cable that comes with iPad Pro doesn't charge it. So far of the ~20 cables I own that I've tried, the only cable that will charge it is the Asus provided cable...
- can16358p 5y ago
  Same with my Momentum 3 headset. It charges over any USB-C cable "that can also carry data". If the cable is power-only (and surprizingly, many are power-only, including Apple's cables that come with iPad/MacBook) it won't charge even though I just need to charge my headset and (obviously) no data transfer. It's stupid, but it is unfortunatelly the way it is.
  - philliphaydon 5y ago
    Oh! I wonder if it will work with my Wii cable then! I haven’t tried that! It never occured to me that most of my cables are power only. Thanks!
    - can16358p 5y ago
      Yup, check if it can also carry data. If it can, it's probably that. Cheers!
chx 5y ago
> If you have a device that wants 20W as 9V/2.22A , your 30W charger may not support that specific combination and will charge much slower than a 20W charger that does. Such a charger would be not specifications compliant. Don't blame the specs for what the manufacturers did with it. Oh and don't get me wrong: there are a lot of problems with USB C mostly with the complete impossibility of knowing what the heck a USB C port is actually capable of. Is it Thunderbolt capable? if not, DisplayPort alternate mode capable? Can you charge the device over it? If yes, what's the maximum wattage. This will ease finally because Microsoft will require PCIe tunneling on all C ports for the device to be Windows 11 certified so there won't really be different USB 4 ports -- except for charging wattage... https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/windows-hardware/test/hlk/testref/7d627bf0-25f3-4564-b554-b2a3450e2bcf https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/windows-hardware/test/hlk/t...
- Kliment 5y ago
  A charger does not have to support any particular voltage/current combination. If a device requests a specific config (9V/2A) but the charger only provides 12V/1.5A with 5V/1.5A fallback, then the best the two can negotiate is 5V at 1.5A. Even if the charger provides 9V/1.5A the device might be programmed to only accept 9V/2A with 5V fallback. This would be USB-compliant, but still frustrating to the user.
  - chx 5y ago
    First of all, I have answered to "If you have a device that wants 20W as 9V/2.22A , your 30W charger may not support that specific combination" saying that's not specs compliant. https://i.imgur.com/rkIJuMr.png https://i.imgur.com/rkIJuMr.png I highlighted the relevant part. These are the rules: https://i.imgur.com/b8q96tH.png https://i.imgur.com/b8q96tH.png So, to summarize: since a 30W charger must provide everything a lower wattage charger like a 20W charger does and 20W falls between 15 and 27 then yes it must support 9V 2.22A as well. If it doesn't then it's not compliant. Note the caption in the second image "an example of an adapter with a rating at 50W. The adapter is required to support 20V at 2.5A, 15V at 3A, 9V at 3A and 5V at 3A." > If a device requests a specific config (9V/2A) but the charger only provides 12V/1.5A with 5V/1.5A fallback Then it's not compliant. 15-27W is to be delivered via 9V. 12V is optional.
ksec 5y ago
Its time to tell the somewhat unpopular story again. ( Because USB-C Supporters hate it ) Trying to help a lawyer out and trying to explain why the $5.00 USB-C cable he'd bought from Amazon wasn't delivering 4K video to his expensive monitor AND powering his laptop too. Me: OK: so its a USB-C cable, but its not a high data rate USB-C cable. Him: But, its a USB-C Cable. Me: but, no, not all USB-C cables are high speed cables. And some of them can't do high speed and power delivery Him: but... its a USB-C cable: it plugs into the port. Me: Um... just because it plugs in, doesn't mean its going to work. You can have USB-C cables that are actually slower than the old USB ports. Him: but.... shouldn't it just work? And so on. For... 15? more minutes? maybe 30? I finally got him to buy a "proper" belkin USB-C cable . Which was bought from a company that should be anonymous, but lets just say that a "refurbished" cable was shipped, which, surprise, surprise ,didn't work, for ANYTHING. This basically sums up everything that is wrong with Tech thinking vs User Thinking.
- antifa 5y ago
  > This basically sums up everything that is wrong with Tech thinking vs User Thinking. Are the cables actually accurately describing themselves? I'm more concerned that products are obsfucating what corners they cut rather than that a lawyer should "know" the nuances of the USB-C industrial complex.
- robertlagrant 5y ago
  > This basically sums up everything that is wrong with Tech thinking vs User Thinking. This is a pretend dichotomy. It's not "people who think about tech vs people who think about people." It's "some parts are cheaper than others because they don't do as much."
- hbn 5y ago
  Maybe a road analogy would have helped him If you need to send 100 cars down a strip of road every 10 seconds, you can't use any road. You'd need one with lots of lanes But that said, I'm not defending USB-C. It's true, I've had to do more research on cables than ever before in my life since it started becoming the new """standard"""
- farisjarrah 5y ago
nicbou 5y ago
I'm honestly really happy with USB-C. My phone, laptop and tablet charge the same way. I bring one charger and two cables, so I can pack much lighter than before. Each device can serve as a power bank for the others. My monitor serves as a powered hub, so there's only one cable connecting everything to my laptop. I use the same charger for everything from my camping lantern to my computer. I don't have a big box of cables anymore, nor do I pack 5 different cables when I'm on the move. It's very convenient. It only becomes a problem when I leave my bubble. I usually travel without my adapters, so I can't borrow someone's mouse, or plug something into their TV. Then there's the issue with cables and chargers. I have thick cables and 100W chargers, so it's never a bother, but it's not a trivial thing for the average user to make sense of.
AtlasBarfed 5y ago
When USB was first being sold it was supposed to connect everything. Monitors, modems, network cards, peripherals. USB has been letting everyone down since 1998. I am floored at the ports. Floored. Apple LISTENED? Like, seriously, LISTENED to its customers? I thought HDMI would never come back.

nerfhammer 5y ago

> chargers and cables are advertised with the wattage they support, but it's really the voltage and current that matters. watts = volts * current

kccqzy 5y ago
GP's point is that although chargers are labeled with wattage, they can't output any combination of volts and currents as long as they multiply to the stated wattage. Can you take a normal 100W charger and ask it to output 100V and 1A? It can't. The Apple 29W charger supports two configurations only: 14.5V × 2A, or 5.2V × 2.4A The Apple 30W charger supports these four instead: 20V × 1.5A, 15V × 2A, 9V × 3A, 5V × 3A Do you see a problem here?

junon 5y ago

> chargers and cables are advertised with the wattage they support, but it's really the voltage and current that matters. Wattage is what you get when you multiply amps and volts. You just said the equivalent of "It's not about the ice cream, but about the ice and the cream". Also, it arguably does have everything to do with volts - if you put the too much voltage into a device, most likely you're going to damage the device, its surroundings, or yourself (i.e. in a house fire).

awill 5y ago
I think what OP is saying is a cable might support 30W at 5V * 6A, but not 10V * 3A.
- junon 5y ago
  They're not interchangeable. USB-C has power negotiation, but that doesn't mean the devices support those voltages. You still need to understand the voltage ratings on both ends of a cable.
  - parineum 5y ago
    I found this comment that explains it well: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28911240 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28911240
  - anamexis 5y ago
    That is precisely the point of the original comment that you responded to.
  - javawizard 5y ago
    That's exactly what OP is saying - chargers are commonly advertised as being able to supply a particular wattage, but that particular wattage is only attainable if the device being charged supports the maximum voltage the charger is capable of delivering. OP is complaining that that leaves the true wattage of a given device/charger pair unknowable from the charger's packaging alone without further information as to what voltages and at what currents it can supply on request from the device. It's certainly a valid frustration.
    - junon 5y ago
      This makes more sense and isn't how I parsed the original comment.
- jsjohnst 5y ago
  The reverse situation would be the case (cable supports 3A, but not 6A). For the range of voltages supported by USB-PD, the cable only cares about amperage. Copper wire doesn’t care much if it’s 5V, 50V, or 250V, it’ll carry it the same. However, if the size of the wire isn’t correct for the amperage, it’ll over heat and potentially catch fire. It’s the end device that cares about voltage and amperage both as the voltage steppers inside have to be ready to handle providing the right voltage to the chips and the amperage has to be right to handle the load.

dekhn 5y ago

I've been pretty impressed with USB-C. I've managed to add a GPU to a NUC and train/infer with tensorflow, no problems. Plug a computer into a monitor and power and keyboard/mouse at the same time, while also using same cable to pass through charge two lightning devices... I find it much harder to break a USB-C port then a micro USB port on all phones I've owned.

nuker 5y ago
> Plug a computer into a monitor … and get only 30Hz on 4k ;)
- rhysmorgan 5y ago
  You can totally get 4K 60Hz, so long as the USB-C port supports DisplayPort 1.4a Alt-Mode. (which raises one of the problems with USB-C - it's impossible to tell how what features it supports)
  - mrspuratic 5y ago
    USB is meronymic morass. alt-mode was the "killer feature" for me, alt-mode MST with a bus-powered splitter to drive dual DP (or HDMI) QHD external screens from a single USB-C port. This makes a regular laptop a viable desktop replacement for me. Support for multiple external displays makes the billing, though these have 1x HDMI + 3x TB4 ports to play with.
bb88 5y ago
I've had headphones die because the connector came loose after around 500 insertion cycles. Several companies in China make a "mag safe"-style connector for micro usb that is really nice. Some of them only provide power/ground. Others provide the full 4-wire spec. I have a pair of Sony Headphones that annoyingly shut off the wireless when you charge them. So I didn't really care if it had the full four wire spec. There's some out there for USB-C, but I wouldn't trust them for high-speed data transfer.
- 5y ago

r00fus 5y ago

> Agree- I have been largely disappointed by USB-C. It's been okay as a smaller USB-A replacement for flash drives and mice, but in general the lesson of USB-C is: just because it fits, doesn't mean it works. I think USB-C works fine (h/t Benson Leung) but the implementation is problematic. Partly because of the complexity of everything they've tried to shove in, also partly because USB-A still exists and is the biggest competitor USB-C needs to overcome. Give it 5 more years and we'll look at USB-A like serial ports. Till then, USB-A is legion.

vanilla_nut 5y ago
Given that we're already 5+ years into Apple's USB-C revolution, I'm not so confident that this is going to happen. I'm going to keep using my USB-A peripherals for a long time, and more importantly, mice, yubikeys, keyboards, and a whole lot of other things are still largely sold with USB-A. Some of those have replaceable cables... but it's still a lot of effort to move away from that. Furthermore, ditching all of those USB-A accessories and cables that still work fine just feels wasteful. If the only thing you're throwing them away for is compatibility, and not some feature that's actually improving them, even more of a waste. It's just churn to push more tech company profits.
- bobthepanda 5y ago
  USB-A also became so widespread that they became wall plugs in their own right, so at least those will stick around a lot longer unless people start hiring electricians to change their plugs.
  - diebeforei485 5y ago
    USB-A is alright for charging small electronics. It's 5V and somewhere between 0.5A and 2.1A (1A is very common). I have charging cables (with USB-A on the power side) in multiple places around the house, using the 5V/1A adapters that shipped with iPhones over the years. This works fine, though it is slower than the "fast charging" we've grown to expect these days. The device end of these cables are miniUSB (bicycle lights), microUSB (external battery pack), USB-C (my partner's noise cancelling headphones), and many of them are Lightning (Airpods, Airpods Max, iPhones, iPads, Apple TV Remote).

FractalParadigm 5y ago

What I personally hate is how cable type/speeds aren't usually advertised. I've got a dozen or so USB-C 2.0 cables that feel useless for anything but power, and only a couple 3.0 cables that continually get lost and need replacing. The connector itself is fantastic, USB-A and USB-B have needed replacing for a long time (especially since 3.0), but the implementation has been a disaster by any measurable margin.

throw0101a 5y ago

> Agree- I have been largely disappointed by USB-C. Also: the cockamamy version/naming convention(s) of the latest USB revisions.

philliphaydon 5y ago

I'm dissappointed in USB in general, we have standards but it seems few follow standards. For example, I recently bought my wife an Asus ROG Falchion keyboard. Really tiny one with Zhuyin input. So the connection is USB-C, but if you connect ANY USB-C cable to the keyboard, it wont charge. Even the USB-C <> USB-C cable that comes with iPad Pro doesn't charge it. So far of the ~20 cables I own that I've tried, the only cable that will charge it is the Asus provided cable...

can16358p 5y ago
Same with my Momentum 3 headset. It charges over any USB-C cable "that can also carry data". If the cable is power-only (and surprizingly, many are power-only, including Apple's cables that come with iPad/MacBook) it won't charge even though I just need to charge my headset and (obviously) no data transfer. It's stupid, but it is unfortunatelly the way it is.
- philliphaydon 5y ago
  Oh! I wonder if it will work with my Wii cable then! I haven’t tried that! It never occured to me that most of my cables are power only. Thanks!
  - can16358p 5y ago
    Yup, check if it can also carry data. If it can, it's probably that. Cheers!

chx 5y ago

> If you have a device that wants 20W as 9V/2.22A , your 30W charger may not support that specific combination and will charge much slower than a 20W charger that does. Such a charger would be not specifications compliant. Don't blame the specs for what the manufacturers did with it. Oh and don't get me wrong: there are a lot of problems with USB C mostly with the complete impossibility of knowing what the heck a USB C port is actually capable of. Is it Thunderbolt capable? if not, DisplayPort alternate mode capable? Can you charge the device over it? If yes, what's the maximum wattage. This will ease finally because Microsoft will require PCIe tunneling on all C ports for the device to be Windows 11 certified so there won't really be different USB 4 ports -- except for charging wattage... https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/windows-hardware/test/hlk/testref/7d627bf0-25f3-4564-b554-b2a3450e2bcf https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/windows-hardware/test/hlk/t...

Kliment 5y ago
A charger does not have to support any particular voltage/current combination. If a device requests a specific config (9V/2A) but the charger only provides 12V/1.5A with 5V/1.5A fallback, then the best the two can negotiate is 5V at 1.5A. Even if the charger provides 9V/1.5A the device might be programmed to only accept 9V/2A with 5V fallback. This would be USB-compliant, but still frustrating to the user.
- chx 5y ago
  First of all, I have answered to "If you have a device that wants 20W as 9V/2.22A , your 30W charger may not support that specific combination" saying that's not specs compliant. https://i.imgur.com/rkIJuMr.png https://i.imgur.com/rkIJuMr.png I highlighted the relevant part. These are the rules: https://i.imgur.com/b8q96tH.png https://i.imgur.com/b8q96tH.png So, to summarize: since a 30W charger must provide everything a lower wattage charger like a 20W charger does and 20W falls between 15 and 27 then yes it must support 9V 2.22A as well. If it doesn't then it's not compliant. Note the caption in the second image "an example of an adapter with a rating at 50W. The adapter is required to support 20V at 2.5A, 15V at 3A, 9V at 3A and 5V at 3A." > If a device requests a specific config (9V/2A) but the charger only provides 12V/1.5A with 5V/1.5A fallback Then it's not compliant. 15-27W is to be delivered via 9V. 12V is optional.

ksec 5y ago

Its time to tell the somewhat unpopular story again. ( Because USB-C Supporters hate it ) Trying to help a lawyer out and trying to explain why the $5.00 USB-C cable he'd bought from Amazon wasn't delivering 4K video to his expensive monitor AND powering his laptop too. Me: OK: so its a USB-C cable, but its not a high data rate USB-C cable. Him: But, its a USB-C Cable. Me: but, no, not all USB-C cables are high speed cables. And some of them can't do high speed and power delivery Him: but... its a USB-C cable: it plugs into the port. Me: Um... just because it plugs in, doesn't mean its going to work. You can have USB-C cables that are actually slower than the old USB ports. Him: but.... shouldn't it just work? And so on. For... 15? more minutes? maybe 30? I finally got him to buy a "proper" belkin USB-C cable . Which was bought from a company that should be anonymous, but lets just say that a "refurbished" cable was shipped, which, surprise, surprise ,didn't work, for ANYTHING. This basically sums up everything that is wrong with Tech thinking vs User Thinking.

antifa 5y ago
> This basically sums up everything that is wrong with Tech thinking vs User Thinking. Are the cables actually accurately describing themselves? I'm more concerned that products are obsfucating what corners they cut rather than that a lawyer should "know" the nuances of the USB-C industrial complex.
robertlagrant 5y ago
> This basically sums up everything that is wrong with Tech thinking vs User Thinking. This is a pretend dichotomy. It's not "people who think about tech vs people who think about people." It's "some parts are cheaper than others because they don't do as much."
hbn 5y ago
Maybe a road analogy would have helped him If you need to send 100 cars down a strip of road every 10 seconds, you can't use any road. You'd need one with lots of lanes But that said, I'm not defending USB-C. It's true, I've had to do more research on cables than ever before in my life since it started becoming the new """standard"""
farisjarrah 5y ago

nicbou 5y ago

I'm honestly really happy with USB-C. My phone, laptop and tablet charge the same way. I bring one charger and two cables, so I can pack much lighter than before. Each device can serve as a power bank for the others. My monitor serves as a powered hub, so there's only one cable connecting everything to my laptop. I use the same charger for everything from my camping lantern to my computer. I don't have a big box of cables anymore, nor do I pack 5 different cables when I'm on the move. It's very convenient. It only becomes a problem when I leave my bubble. I usually travel without my adapters, so I can't borrow someone's mouse, or plug something into their TV. Then there's the issue with cables and chargers. I have thick cables and 100W chargers, so it's never a bother, but it's not a trivial thing for the average user to make sense of.

AtlasBarfed 5y ago

When USB was first being sold it was supposed to connect everything. Monitors, modems, network cards, peripherals. USB has been letting everyone down since 1998. I am floored at the ports. Floored. Apple LISTENED? Like, seriously, LISTENED to its customers? I thought HDMI would never come back.