3 ms·

Wasn't efficacy originally defined as preventing symptomatic covid infections? > The mRNA-based Pfizer1, 2 and Moderna3 vaccines were shown to have 94–95% eff

by bko 5y ago

Wasn't efficacy originally defined as preventing symptomatic covid infections? > The mRNA-based Pfizer1, 2 and Moderna3 vaccines were shown to have 94–95% efficacy in preventing symptomatic COVID-19, calculated as 100 × (1 minus the attack rate with vaccine divided by the attack rate with placebo). It means that in a population such as the one enrolled in the trials, with a cumulated COVID-19 attack rate over a period of 3 months of about 1% without a vaccine, we would expect roughly 0·05% of vaccinated people would get diseased. Even if you consider Delta variant, we were originally told the vaccines were very effective: > The study said the Pfizer vaccine was 88% effective against the B.1.617.2 variant, first found in India, 2 weeks after the second dose. The Pfizer vaccine was 93% effective against the variant found in the U.K., known as B.1.1.7, two weeks after the second dose. > Two doses of the AstraZeneca vaccine were 60% effective against the B.1.617.2 variant and 66% effective against B.1.1.7, the study said. It's fine if preliminary results didn't hold up, but lets not gaslight the public into thinking vaccines were never about not getting infected. [0] https://www.thelancet.com/journals/laninf/article/PIIS1473-3099(21)00075-X/fulltext https://www.thelancet.com/journals/laninf/article/PIIS1473-3... [1] https://www.webmd.com/vaccines/covid-19-vaccine/news/20210525/pfizer-astrazeneca-vaccines-indian-variant-study https://www.webmd.com/vaccines/covid-19-vaccine/news/2021052... [EDIT] Updated link 0 to one that more clearly states the definition of efficacy

chii 5y ago
i think may be a lot of people assumed initially, that the covid vaccine is gonna be like other vaccines - it prevents the virus from spreading by making it unable to take hold in your body to spread.
- bko 5y ago
  Isn't that what the clinical trials are for? I guess 3 months wasn't enough as places like Israel saw their infection rate go down a lot only to shoot back up recently as immunity wore off. Again, I'm okay with new finding. What I'm not okay with is this constant gaslighting. The media tries to pretend I don't remember what was reported 6 months ago.
  - jml7c5 5y ago
    Delta variant was first detected in late Feb, after the clinical trials.
- josephg 5y ago
  My understanding is it does reduce infection - but only by 70% or something; and with pfeizer that wanes to about 30% over the following year. The vaccines stay highly effective at preventing hospitalisation and death. But we’ll probably all end up taking a 3rd shot eventually.
- jkhdigital 5y ago
  Sterilizing immunity is the term for that, and just as with the flu vaccine we cannot yet achieve such an outcome with Covid vaccines. Respiratory viruses seem to be particularly difficult in this respect.
  - headsoup 5y ago
    And the fact the mRNA method is not technically a vaccine as such (excepting that they've changed the definition since). The vaccine was sold as the ticket to freedom with early claims that it prevents spread and death. It does neither, might actually increase risk of more virulent strains longer term and brings a false sense of security to those not informed fully of the ongoing risks. It will be the 'unvaccinated' - the 5-10% left - somehow still causing all spread and death because that's easier than having to continue to be cautious and responsible after 'taking one for the team' with the jab, or admit the vaccine mostly provides individual risk reduction, not societal.

by bko 5y ago

chii 5y ago

i think may be a lot of people assumed initially, that the covid vaccine is gonna be like other vaccines - it prevents the virus from spreading by making it unable to take hold in your body to spread.

bko 5y ago
Isn't that what the clinical trials are for? I guess 3 months wasn't enough as places like Israel saw their infection rate go down a lot only to shoot back up recently as immunity wore off. Again, I'm okay with new finding. What I'm not okay with is this constant gaslighting. The media tries to pretend I don't remember what was reported 6 months ago.
- jml7c5 5y ago
  Delta variant was first detected in late Feb, after the clinical trials.
josephg 5y ago
My understanding is it does reduce infection - but only by 70% or something; and with pfeizer that wanes to about 30% over the following year. The vaccines stay highly effective at preventing hospitalisation and death. But we’ll probably all end up taking a 3rd shot eventually.
jkhdigital 5y ago
Sterilizing immunity is the term for that, and just as with the flu vaccine we cannot yet achieve such an outcome with Covid vaccines. Respiratory viruses seem to be particularly difficult in this respect.
- headsoup 5y ago
  And the fact the mRNA method is not technically a vaccine as such (excepting that they've changed the definition since). The vaccine was sold as the ticket to freedom with early claims that it prevents spread and death. It does neither, might actually increase risk of more virulent strains longer term and brings a false sense of security to those not informed fully of the ongoing risks. It will be the 'unvaccinated' - the 5-10% left - somehow still causing all spread and death because that's easier than having to continue to be cautious and responsible after 'taking one for the team' with the jab, or admit the vaccine mostly provides individual risk reduction, not societal.