3 ms·

I think baseline means power plant that is always available, except for outages planned well in advance, and runs 24x7 at a given output. Generally baseline pow

I think baseline means power plant that is always available, except for outages planned well in advance, and runs 24x7 at a given output. Generally baseline power doesn’t depend on the weather. You could have a stable reliable grid consisting solely of wind and solar but it would also require a lot of storage, which would be insanely expensive in order to achieve the level of reliability we take for granted today. I am sure we will find the limit of penetration for wind and solar, and already people are willing to give up and accept blackouts like in California instead of brushing under the power lines and cutting down trees which might fall on them proactively, which is expensive, they just have a blackout on hot windy days.

labawi 5y ago
Had trouble finding baseline power definition, but here is one: https://www.collicutt.com/understanding-power/reliability-in-power/ https://www.collicutt.com/understanding-power/reliability-in... Baseline power is slow to change. Not all always-available power is slow, thus not all is baseline. It is not even a desirable quality except for the associated low running costs. To a large degree, storage is interchangeable with transport, so we would not necessarily need a lot of storage even if we wanted to disqualify sources other than wind and solar. That being said, in long term, I think we will have a lot of storage and storage-equivalent in industrial chemical and technical processes once they switch to electricity, in consumer batteries (EVs), generally more flexible load, etc.
- liketochill 5y ago
  Thanks for finding a definition. Baseline / baseload power sources not only is always available, but it is always generating as well, at a relatively constant output. I would disagree that it is not a desirable quality. Storage and transmission are interchangeable, both are expensive. I agree storage will win out since it is easier to build unless the transmission path is underwater. Demand response will continue to generally be emergency reserves, since it means that there is power not being generated and consumed that could have been. Peak shifting is viable, as long as my car is charged in the morning I don’t care when it happened - although how long do cars take to charge at home? There isn’t that much flexibility in there. I also don’t want my battery cycles used to provide $1 of electricity. Interesting times!

labawi 5y ago

Had trouble finding baseline power definition, but here is one: https://www.collicutt.com/understanding-power/reliability-in-power/ https://www.collicutt.com/understanding-power/reliability-in... Baseline power is slow to change. Not all always-available power is slow, thus not all is baseline. It is not even a desirable quality except for the associated low running costs. To a large degree, storage is interchangeable with transport, so we would not necessarily need a lot of storage even if we wanted to disqualify sources other than wind and solar. That being said, in long term, I think we will have a lot of storage and storage-equivalent in industrial chemical and technical processes once they switch to electricity, in consumer batteries (EVs), generally more flexible load, etc.

liketochill 5y ago
Thanks for finding a definition. Baseline / baseload power sources not only is always available, but it is always generating as well, at a relatively constant output. I would disagree that it is not a desirable quality. Storage and transmission are interchangeable, both are expensive. I agree storage will win out since it is easier to build unless the transmission path is underwater. Demand response will continue to generally be emergency reserves, since it means that there is power not being generated and consumed that could have been. Peak shifting is viable, as long as my car is charged in the morning I don’t care when it happened - although how long do cars take to charge at home? There isn’t that much flexibility in there. I also don’t want my battery cycles used to provide $1 of electricity. Interesting times!