9 ms·

The more I hear scam w/o reasoning, the more likely i am to buy nfts. This is just like bitcoin in 2011.

mminer237 5y ago
Okay? NFTs are still fundamentally stupid and only exist because people can make money selling worthless...nothings. That meets the definition of "scam" in my book. Bitcoin at least has theoretical uses, although practically it is definitely a negative force in the world. Their current price does not logically make them useful.
- X6S1x6Okd1st 5y ago
  > NFTs are still fundamentally stupid and only exist because people can make money selling worthless...nothings. What about games, or art?
  - ALittleLight 5y ago
    Neither of which use or benefit from NFTs.
  - djur 5y ago
    NFTs are not games or art and are not necessary or useful to sell games or art.
  - mminer237 5y ago
    If I buy a license of a game, I gain the legal ability to play the game. If I buy a print of and associated license to art, I gain the legal ability to look at and resell my copy the art. If I invest and buy the copyright to something, I can sell the above rights to others. If I pay to record on a blockchain my ownership a hash, I gain...nothing. I guess I could brag about how I paid money for a hexadecimal string when no one else was willing to? The theoretical advantage is that I can try to pawn it off on someone else for more money by convincing him that he can do the same to someone else.
    - X6S1x6Okd1st 5y ago
      > If I buy a print of and associated license to art, I gain the legal ability to look at and resell my copy the art. If I buy an NFT, I gain the defacto ability to resell my copy the art.
      - lottin 5y ago
        You don't own your own copy of the art. And you can't sell something you don't own.
        X6S1x6Okd1st 5y ago
        Do you think anyone owns even a fraction of a bitcoin?
        lottin 5y ago
        I don't know if "own" is the right word, but people do have bitcoins under their control, yes, which means they can transfer them. Why?
        X6S1x6Okd1st 5y ago
        I have NFTs under my control. I can transfer them, list them for sale, w/e. It's the same relationship to cryptocurrencies I have control over. The IRS sure seems to think that I owned bitcoin.
        lottin 5y ago
        > I have NFTs under my control. I can transfer them, list them for sale. An NFT is not a "copy of a the art". That's the part that you got wrong.
        X6S1x6Okd1st 5y ago
        > That's the part that you got wrong. That's quite confrontational, if this topic is making you upset I'll refrain from continuing.
  - StrLght 5y ago
    You mean games that have been doing just fine with just usual microtransactions? Sure big publishers are going to throw that away and switch to NFTs because... Why exactly? Are there any surveys or something on how much gamers care about NFTs in their games? Because if there's no such data I can't think of a single reason for publishers to care about this.
- elevenoh 5y ago
  Genuinely curious: does the concept of intermediary-less digital ownership get you emotional? And if so, why?
  - mminer237 5y ago
    No, the concept sounds neat and impractical, but I don't care much about it. The implementations get me a bit angry. They enable criminals to extort and launder funds. They've led to massive profits for speculators at the expense of ignorant people throwing their own money into the bubble. They haven't benefited the average person at all. Bitcoin wastes monumentous amounts of energy, raising the price for everyone else and further polluting the earth; it has wild value fluctuations, making it completely unusable as a currency; and it has no underlying value. Then NFTs aren't even really ownership. You're buying the right to record a ownership of a hash. It just makes people feel like they own something unique. If you actually want to buy a digital assets without an intermediary, you contact the creator of a work and have him e-sign a contract giving you the copyrights in it. Boom. No need for a intermediary like OpenSea to skim its 2.5% off the top like NFTs do in practice, and you actually gets real rights in the work. People just don't do that because they don't want to actually give up something of actual value, they just want to rip people off, and because it's boring. NFTs are just a fad.
joe_guy 5y ago
Or it's like people who tossed all their 1960s baseball cards taking their regret out on beanie babies.
djur 5y ago
Amway has existed for 61 years.
ohashi 5y ago
The survivorship bias is strong here
keewee7 5y ago
There was an incredibly positive vibe around Bitcoin in 2011. It was still seen as a currency and not something to invest in to get rich fast.
thephyber 5y ago
I personally see lots of value and potential for smart contracts. The current NFTs making news for the highest transaction price are are terrible examples of that value and appear to be scams - they provide no significant value. It looks like speculation and greed without significant additional value. The only additional value I have seen so far appears to be the equivalent of a country club membership when you buy certain NFTs. I suspect there will be more opportunities for NFTs to change my mind in the future with governance, but that risks them stepping into SEC governed territory.

Okay? NFTs are still fundamentally stupid and only exist because people can make money selling worthless...nothings. That meets the definition of "scam" in my book. Bitcoin at least has theoretical uses, although practically it is definitely a negative force in the world. Their current price does not logically make them useful.

X6S1x6Okd1st 5y ago
> NFTs are still fundamentally stupid and only exist because people can make money selling worthless...nothings. What about games, or art?
- ALittleLight 5y ago
  Neither of which use or benefit from NFTs.
- djur 5y ago
  NFTs are not games or art and are not necessary or useful to sell games or art.
- mminer237 5y ago
  If I buy a license of a game, I gain the legal ability to play the game. If I buy a print of and associated license to art, I gain the legal ability to look at and resell my copy the art. If I invest and buy the copyright to something, I can sell the above rights to others. If I pay to record on a blockchain my ownership a hash, I gain...nothing. I guess I could brag about how I paid money for a hexadecimal string when no one else was willing to? The theoretical advantage is that I can try to pawn it off on someone else for more money by convincing him that he can do the same to someone else.
  - X6S1x6Okd1st 5y ago
    > If I buy a print of and associated license to art, I gain the legal ability to look at and resell my copy the art. If I buy an NFT, I gain the defacto ability to resell my copy the art.
    - lottin 5y ago
      You don't own your own copy of the art. And you can't sell something you don't own.
      - X6S1x6Okd1st 5y ago
        Do you think anyone owns even a fraction of a bitcoin?
        lottin 5y ago
        I don't know if "own" is the right word, but people do have bitcoins under their control, yes, which means they can transfer them. Why?
        X6S1x6Okd1st 5y ago
        I have NFTs under my control. I can transfer them, list them for sale, w/e. It's the same relationship to cryptocurrencies I have control over. The IRS sure seems to think that I owned bitcoin.
        lottin 5y ago
        > I have NFTs under my control. I can transfer them, list them for sale. An NFT is not a "copy of a the art". That's the part that you got wrong.
        X6S1x6Okd1st 5y ago
        > That's the part that you got wrong. That's quite confrontational, if this topic is making you upset I'll refrain from continuing.
- StrLght 5y ago
  You mean games that have been doing just fine with just usual microtransactions? Sure big publishers are going to throw that away and switch to NFTs because... Why exactly? Are there any surveys or something on how much gamers care about NFTs in their games? Because if there's no such data I can't think of a single reason for publishers to care about this.
elevenoh 5y ago
Genuinely curious: does the concept of intermediary-less digital ownership get you emotional? And if so, why?
- mminer237 5y ago
  No, the concept sounds neat and impractical, but I don't care much about it. The implementations get me a bit angry. They enable criminals to extort and launder funds. They've led to massive profits for speculators at the expense of ignorant people throwing their own money into the bubble. They haven't benefited the average person at all. Bitcoin wastes monumentous amounts of energy, raising the price for everyone else and further polluting the earth; it has wild value fluctuations, making it completely unusable as a currency; and it has no underlying value. Then NFTs aren't even really ownership. You're buying the right to record a ownership of a hash. It just makes people feel like they own something unique. If you actually want to buy a digital assets without an intermediary, you contact the creator of a work and have him e-sign a contract giving you the copyrights in it. Boom. No need for a intermediary like OpenSea to skim its 2.5% off the top like NFTs do in practice, and you actually gets real rights in the work. People just don't do that because they don't want to actually give up something of actual value, they just want to rip people off, and because it's boring. NFTs are just a fad.

joe_guy 5y ago

Or it's like people who tossed all their 1960s baseball cards taking their regret out on beanie babies.

djur 5y ago

Amway has existed for 61 years.

ohashi 5y ago

The survivorship bias is strong here

keewee7 5y ago

There was an incredibly positive vibe around Bitcoin in 2011. It was still seen as a currency and not something to invest in to get rich fast.

thephyber 5y ago

I personally see lots of value and potential for smart contracts. The current NFTs making news for the highest transaction price are are terrible examples of that value and appear to be scams - they provide no significant value. It looks like speculation and greed without significant additional value. The only additional value I have seen so far appears to be the equivalent of a country club membership when you buy certain NFTs. I suspect there will be more opportunities for NFTs to change my mind in the future with governance, but that risks them stepping into SEC governed territory.