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SUVs are offsetting EV car gains

62 points by a22a-dev 5y ago

dartharva 5y ago
SUVs have much lesser chance of going mainstream than EVs in India. The fuel prices here are off the charts, and mileage is generally considered a very important factor in household purchases of cars.
- chupchap 5y ago
  SUV sales are increasing in India and this segment now outsells hatchbacks. See sales numbers https://www.carwale.com/news/suvs-dominate-car-sales-in-india-in-september-2021/ https://www.carwale.com/news/suvs-dominate-car-sales-in-indi... EV will take time without a major company like Reliance or Tata investing heavily on infra to back it.
  - deleted 5y ago
    [deleted]
- harshitaneja 5y ago
  SUVs are already mainstream in India. In 2020, SUVs accounted for 29% of all car sales and suffered the least hit from covid sales decline.
  - dartharva 5y ago
    That's because most of those sales are from institutional/corporate customers, not households.
    - notRobot 5y ago
      Source?
    - TheSpiceIsLife 5y ago
      Doesn’t this just mean that given the choice most who can afford to buy one prefer SUVs?
- umangrathi 5y ago
  Main issue is practical situation of roads in urban areas of India and water logging. Everyone prefers to have a higher seating position to manage the same, apart from the flavor of the month factor. I am personally looking to buy my next vehicle and given the prices of EVs considering a micro SUV just launched because of the factors mentioned earlier.
morsch 5y ago
Alternatively, the 536 hp, 5018 lbs (2276 kg) BMW i4 ("1,000 lbs (454 kg) more than most other 3 and 4 Series BMWs", not known as lightweight cars in the first place) apparently "is the electric BMW sedan you’ve been waiting for". New ways of wasting energy in maximum comfort, all around. https://arstechnica.com/cars/2021/10/the-2023-bmw-i4-is-the-electric-bmw-sedan-youve-been-waiting-for/ https://arstechnica.com/cars/2021/10/the-2023-bmw-i4-is-the-...
- taurath 5y ago
  Quite OT, but the design language of BMW seems lost. I don’t know why the grill needs to be the most distinguishing feature on an electric car.
  - henryackerman 5y ago
    The grille is one of the most characteristic design feature of a BMW. Don't forget that a BMW is a luxury product. Why buy a BMW if it does not look like one?
    - taurath 5y ago
      The grille has tripled in size - it’s like a WRX with a 5 foot tall spoiler on the back. It doesn’t look like a luxury product to me.
  - stepbeek 5y ago
    I made this comment to my wife yesterday. I like an aggressive grill on a car but find it quite funny that it’s becoming more fashionable as air intake is becoming less important.
- trhway 5y ago
  >New ways of wasting energy in maximum comfort, all around. "Over the course of 267 miles (430 km) and 8 hours, the car used 2.6 miles/kWh (23.7 kWh/100 km), bearing in mind that those miles were all driven in Germany and include running at the car's top speed of 140 mph (225 km) on derestricted autobahns." ie. around 100 mpg. It is not even close to "waste", it is saving the planet in maximum comfort.
punnerud 5y ago
What about the EVs that can be classified as SUV? In Norway this is some of the most popular EVs..
- koksik202 5y ago
  These are much more expensive than your regular EV you pay extra for EV + EV being SUV in Ireland those start at prices between 70k-100k and something like Renault Zoe or Tesla non suv cost below 55k. In most of Europe at this stage EV is something upper middle class buys to show off that they can afford going into this new trend, middle and lower class still can’t even afford entry model EV for 20-30k and will continue buying diesel and petrol cars till you will be able to buy EV with decent mileage for less than 30k
  - k8sToGo 5y ago
    Do you have a source for "to show off that they can afford going into this new trend" or is this just some stupid assumption? I drive an SUV EV because I a) can charge at home, b) have a big dog and need the space, c) electricity is cheap here, and d) there does not seem to be an EV "Kombi" yet, which would be the perfect middle ground. I don't care what others think. Your second part of your sentence might be true, but the first one is just a silly assumption.
  - clouddrover 5y ago
    The Volkswagen ID.4 is an electric SUV and it starts at €34,436 (including EV grants): https://www.volkswagen.ie/en/new-cars/ID4.html https://www.volkswagen.ie/en/new-cars/ID4.html The Skoda Enyaq starts at €38,593: https://www.skoda.ie/models/enyaq-iv/enyaq-iv https://www.skoda.ie/models/enyaq-iv/enyaq-iv The Audi Q4 e-tron starts at €49,550: https://www.audi.ie/ie/web/en/models/q4-e-tron/q4-e-tron.html https://www.audi.ie/ie/web/en/models/q4-e-tron/q4-e-tron.htm...
tdrdt 5y ago
Meanwhile the German city Tübingen is raising the parking fee for SUVs by 6 times and other cities are thinking about this as well. They are too big for those cities. https://www.rtl.de/cms/tuebingen-parkgebuehren-fuer-suv-fahrer-bald-6-mal-so-hoch-4841125.html https://www.rtl.de/cms/tuebingen-parkgebuehren-fuer-suv-fahr...
- k8sToGo 5y ago
  Great. The rich can park while the poor cannot afford.
  - adrianN 5y ago
    Poor people have fewer cars, so they tend to benefit from less car-centric legislation. But anyway, even the new, higher costs are minuscule, at most 180€/year.
  - Apocryphon 5y ago
    Who drives SUVs?
    - dzhiurgis 5y ago
      I will until my kids grow up, then might do small sedan. They are just too good with kids. Great for long trips too, but I rarely do those.
  - FranzFerdiNaN 5y ago
    The poor already cant afford an SUV.
  - maxnoe 5y ago
    And in which World exactly do "the poor" drive SUVs?
    - swarnie 5y ago
      Nissan and Renault both make appalling and cheap SUVs?
dt3ft 5y ago
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mbirth 5y ago
This was very obvious when car manufacturers first started producing EVs in Germany. There's a law here that limits the "fleet CO2 output", i.e. the typical CO2 output of every car on offer is measured and the mean value is calculated and has to be lower than what's specified in the law. During the dawn of EVs in Germany, manufacturers built some EVs but barely advertised them and also their prices were way above of their fully specced petrol versions. (Meanwhile bragging in documentaries about how efficiently and cheap they were able to produce said EVs.) You definitely got the feeling they didn't want to sell them. OTOH they usually published a new SUV at the same time - because they sold like hot cakes.

62 points by a22a-dev 5y ago

SUVs have much lesser chance of going mainstream than EVs in India. The fuel prices here are off the charts, and mileage is generally considered a very important factor in household purchases of cars.

chupchap 5y ago
SUV sales are increasing in India and this segment now outsells hatchbacks. See sales numbers https://www.carwale.com/news/suvs-dominate-car-sales-in-india-in-september-2021/ https://www.carwale.com/news/suvs-dominate-car-sales-in-indi... EV will take time without a major company like Reliance or Tata investing heavily on infra to back it.
- deleted 5y ago
  [deleted]
harshitaneja 5y ago
SUVs are already mainstream in India. In 2020, SUVs accounted for 29% of all car sales and suffered the least hit from covid sales decline.
- dartharva 5y ago
  That's because most of those sales are from institutional/corporate customers, not households.
  - notRobot 5y ago
    Source?
  - TheSpiceIsLife 5y ago
    Doesn’t this just mean that given the choice most who can afford to buy one prefer SUVs?
umangrathi 5y ago
Main issue is practical situation of roads in urban areas of India and water logging. Everyone prefers to have a higher seating position to manage the same, apart from the flavor of the month factor. I am personally looking to buy my next vehicle and given the prices of EVs considering a micro SUV just launched because of the factors mentioned earlier.

morsch 5y ago

Alternatively, the 536 hp, 5018 lbs (2276 kg) BMW i4 ("1,000 lbs (454 kg) more than most other 3 and 4 Series BMWs", not known as lightweight cars in the first place) apparently "is the electric BMW sedan you’ve been waiting for". New ways of wasting energy in maximum comfort, all around. https://arstechnica.com/cars/2021/10/the-2023-bmw-i4-is-the-electric-bmw-sedan-youve-been-waiting-for/ https://arstechnica.com/cars/2021/10/the-2023-bmw-i4-is-the-...

taurath 5y ago
Quite OT, but the design language of BMW seems lost. I don’t know why the grill needs to be the most distinguishing feature on an electric car.
- henryackerman 5y ago
  The grille is one of the most characteristic design feature of a BMW. Don't forget that a BMW is a luxury product. Why buy a BMW if it does not look like one?
  - taurath 5y ago
    The grille has tripled in size - it’s like a WRX with a 5 foot tall spoiler on the back. It doesn’t look like a luxury product to me.
- stepbeek 5y ago
  I made this comment to my wife yesterday. I like an aggressive grill on a car but find it quite funny that it’s becoming more fashionable as air intake is becoming less important.
trhway 5y ago
>New ways of wasting energy in maximum comfort, all around. "Over the course of 267 miles (430 km) and 8 hours, the car used 2.6 miles/kWh (23.7 kWh/100 km), bearing in mind that those miles were all driven in Germany and include running at the car's top speed of 140 mph (225 km) on derestricted autobahns." ie. around 100 mpg. It is not even close to "waste", it is saving the planet in maximum comfort.

punnerud 5y ago

What about the EVs that can be classified as SUV? In Norway this is some of the most popular EVs..

koksik202 5y ago
These are much more expensive than your regular EV you pay extra for EV + EV being SUV in Ireland those start at prices between 70k-100k and something like Renault Zoe or Tesla non suv cost below 55k. In most of Europe at this stage EV is something upper middle class buys to show off that they can afford going into this new trend, middle and lower class still can’t even afford entry model EV for 20-30k and will continue buying diesel and petrol cars till you will be able to buy EV with decent mileage for less than 30k
- k8sToGo 5y ago
  Do you have a source for "to show off that they can afford going into this new trend" or is this just some stupid assumption? I drive an SUV EV because I a) can charge at home, b) have a big dog and need the space, c) electricity is cheap here, and d) there does not seem to be an EV "Kombi" yet, which would be the perfect middle ground. I don't care what others think. Your second part of your sentence might be true, but the first one is just a silly assumption.
- clouddrover 5y ago
  The Volkswagen ID.4 is an electric SUV and it starts at €34,436 (including EV grants): https://www.volkswagen.ie/en/new-cars/ID4.html https://www.volkswagen.ie/en/new-cars/ID4.html The Skoda Enyaq starts at €38,593: https://www.skoda.ie/models/enyaq-iv/enyaq-iv https://www.skoda.ie/models/enyaq-iv/enyaq-iv The Audi Q4 e-tron starts at €49,550: https://www.audi.ie/ie/web/en/models/q4-e-tron/q4-e-tron.html https://www.audi.ie/ie/web/en/models/q4-e-tron/q4-e-tron.htm...

tdrdt 5y ago

Meanwhile the German city Tübingen is raising the parking fee for SUVs by 6 times and other cities are thinking about this as well. They are too big for those cities. https://www.rtl.de/cms/tuebingen-parkgebuehren-fuer-suv-fahrer-bald-6-mal-so-hoch-4841125.html https://www.rtl.de/cms/tuebingen-parkgebuehren-fuer-suv-fahr...

k8sToGo 5y ago
Great. The rich can park while the poor cannot afford.
- adrianN 5y ago
  Poor people have fewer cars, so they tend to benefit from less car-centric legislation. But anyway, even the new, higher costs are minuscule, at most 180€/year.
- Apocryphon 5y ago
  Who drives SUVs?
  - dzhiurgis 5y ago
    I will until my kids grow up, then might do small sedan. They are just too good with kids. Great for long trips too, but I rarely do those.
- FranzFerdiNaN 5y ago
  The poor already cant afford an SUV.
- maxnoe 5y ago
  And in which World exactly do "the poor" drive SUVs?
  - swarnie 5y ago
    Nissan and Renault both make appalling and cheap SUVs?

dt3ft 5y ago

To read this, you’ll need a register for an account.

mbirth 5y ago

This was very obvious when car manufacturers first started producing EVs in Germany. There's a law here that limits the "fleet CO2 output", i.e. the typical CO2 output of every car on offer is measured and the mean value is calculated and has to be lower than what's specified in the law. During the dawn of EVs in Germany, manufacturers built some EVs but barely advertised them and also their prices were way above of their fully specced petrol versions. (Meanwhile bragging in documentaries about how efficiently and cheap they were able to produce said EVs.) You definitely got the feeling they didn't want to sell them. OTOH they usually published a new SUV at the same time - because they sold like hot cakes.