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GraphSCAD – A User Friendly Nodal Editor for OpenSCAD (2018)

122 points by app4soft 5y ago

app4soft 5y ago
GitHub repo: https://github.com/graphscad/graphscad https://github.com/graphscad/graphscad Dimitri Kolovitz's profile on Thingiverse: https://www.thingiverse.com/kolovitz/designs https://www.thingiverse.com/kolovitz/designs
- Ennea 5y ago
  The Git repo does not seem to contain the actual application.
  - FeepingCreature 5y ago
    And the actual application doesn't seem to be opensource. Welp.
    - solarkraft 5y ago
      Oh. Oof.
      - app4soft 5y ago
        Here is a GraphSCAD thread on OpenSCAD form.[0] Also here is Node Graph Interace to OpenSCAD in Java.[1] FTR, I may recommend take a look on VisualScriptCAD[2] and DynFreeCAD[3]. [0] https://forum.openscad.org/Graphscad-A-New-Nodal-editor-for-Openscad-td20016.html https://forum.openscad.org/Graphscad-A-New-Nodal-editor-for-... [1] https://github.com/studiotc/NodeGraphInterface https://github.com/studiotc/NodeGraphInterface [2] https://github.com/kovacsv/VisualScriptCAD https://github.com/kovacsv/VisualScriptCAD [3] https://github.com/infeeeee/DynFreeCAD https://github.com/infeeeee/DynFreeCAD
leoedin 5y ago
Has anyone used this? How does using nodes compare to using text syntax? One of the big problems I've found with openSCAD is that beyond a certain level of complexity it gets very hard to keep a good mental model of the constituent parts of your 3D model in your head, and so changes become hard. This is generally after things get rotated a few times. Does this make that easier?
- contingencies 5y ago
  I've noticed the same. Partly, the need to maintain a complete mental model is obviated by the fast-iterating IDE (ie. a try-it-and-see approach) and comments. Haven't tried this frontend yet but it seems a good match to the structure of abstraction.
- agumonkey 5y ago
  a lot of software use node based UI most movie grade CGI (houdini, maya) or compositors were made this way since most tasks don't require an abnormally large network it's ok (when it's not they try to implement submodules of some kind, it's pretty ad-hoc but it's not supposed to be the average use case) one value of these is that it's obviously (and visually) lazy reactive. You can do the same with text but it's harder to see input/outputs on text IMO.
  - app4soft 5y ago
    > most movie grade CGI (houdini, maya) or compositors were made this way Yeah. Upcoming Olive Video Editor `0.2.x` would be fully on nodes.[0,1] [0] https://olivevideoeditor.org/020.php https://olivevideoeditor.org/020.php [1] https://github.com/olive-editor/olive https://github.com/olive-editor/olive
    - agumonkey 5y ago
      heh, the late 90s are back
  - ur-whale 5y ago
    > a lot of software use node based UI Yes, and as pointed out in another comment, it does not scale well. It's nice for the "tweak" phase of - say - finalizing a shot in a CGI movie, but when you start to get more than a few thousand nodes in a setup, it's very hard to do anything. There are mitigation solutions, such as grouping and collapsing of nodes, but that only goes so far. Another annoying thing with node-based systems: - collaborative work is hard - version control is hard
transfire 5y ago
Can't wait to try! Is the text code and node graph node interchangeable? I.e. can i edit code and see the changes in the graph?
- andybak 5y ago
  Yeah but no but... https://gist.github.com/andybak/f98742b37b801849e1584b7faddcff59 https://gist.github.com/andybak/f98742b37b801849e1584b7faddc... This is the code generated for a single cuboid. EDIT - looking a bit closer, it might not be that bad. That seems to be mostly library functions. The actual user code is fairly concise: function node_cube_matrix(i=0,j=0,k=0,l=0,m=0,n=0) = translate([0,0,0]); module node_cube(i=0,j=0,k=0,l=0,m=0,n=0) { cube([2,1,1],center=false); } node_cube();
kongin 5y ago
I feel exceedingly stupid for never having thought about something so simple.
willvarfar 5y ago
This is a bit of a tangent but I wish I could find a tool for designing houses that was graphical but underneath based on a programming language. There are several cad and floor planner software that are for designing houses, and modelling software like sketch up that are more general. All seem to be awkward or incomplete. Sketch up is perhaps the fastest for visualizing the shell, but is painful to sketch something with exact measurements. You end up sketching on paper and then trying to enter it into the computer. Sweet home 3D is clunky. Homestyler is actually really good, but doesn’t do roofs and lifts. You can actually do great getting-a-feel sketches in The Sims (honest!) but the grid is all wrong. And all of them treat walls and things as solid volumes. There’s no snap-to-grid on standard studwork spacings or picking walls based on cavity. So much could be done in code eg sorting out wiring, plumbing etc. Building models like openscad does hints at a direction where you lay out the general building and code can auto fit to actually make it buildable and produce working construction drawings etc. Even start computing structural aspects etc. If anyone knows the killer software for designing houses easily but properly, please let me know! I may have missed something. ;)
- ramboldio 5y ago
  TrussFab takes care of the structural aspect: https://hpi.de/baudisch/projects/trussfab.html https://hpi.de/baudisch/projects/trussfab.html
- Iv 5y ago
  FreeCad is a generic parametric CAD software. It is not designed for houses, but it allows to create constraints-based designs and is scriptable through python. So not a 100% match but it checks several of your items. If you are considering something as remote as openSCAD, I think you should give a try to FreeCAD and look at a few tutorials (its workflow is not the most intuitive thing)
  - drran 5y ago
    See Arch[0] module for FreeCAD. [0]: https://wiki.freecadweb.org/Arch_Workbench https://wiki.freecadweb.org/Arch_Workbench
  - 5y ago
ur-whale 5y ago
This type of tool will only reach its full potential when it can really go both ways, i.e going back and forth from nodal representation to actual code seamlessly. And by seamlessly, I mean not losing your loops and recursive calls after doing minor editing to the nodal representation. This is - of course - not easy (and no surprise, this tools does not pull it off), but it's a goal worth pursuing.
- hobofan 5y ago
  Yes, it seems like there are very few efforts that work towards seamless visual<->text code editing. Even for things like React apps where you have pretty clear composable building blocks in the form of components, I only know of Utopia[0] as an ongoing project. I've worked towards having a React-based interface for OpenJSCAD with Landau[1], where one of the goals was having an editor like Utopia to make most of the editing capabilites available in a standard 3D editor interface that edits the variables in the code. [0]: https://utopia.app/ https://utopia.app/ [1]: https://github.com/landaujs/landau https://github.com/landaujs/landau
  - willvarfar 5y ago
    Wow! Just … wow! Super cool! But how far has this gotten?
    - hobofan 5y ago
      Landau has gotten "good enough" to replace OpenSCAD/OpenJSCAD for my personal 3d printing use-cases, where the main benefit I was looking for as a first step is better reusability via npm packages and a familiar interface via React. E.g. in a non-public project of mine that contains a Raspberry PI case, I can just import a 3D model of the RPI[0] to visually ensure that it correctly fits the case, and easily keep them in sync. As I don't really have time to maintain it, development usually moves forward when I find time for my 3d printing hobby, so I wouldn't advise anyone to rely on it. Since the space of alternative React renderers has been explored more and more in the last years (e.g. Remotion[1] for producing videos), I assumed that a "proper version" of Landau would exist by now, but AFAIK there isn't one. [0]: https://github.com/hobofan/landau-rpi https://github.com/hobofan/landau-rpi [1]: https://www.remotion.dev/ https://www.remotion.dev/
nine_k 5y ago
Honest question: are such nodal editors easier for you than the indented text? If so, how do you navigate the charts? How do you organize stuff in nice planar graphs? How do you manage to see enough with such a low information density, compared to text? What are the key advantages you see? (Disclaimer: yes, I did use OpenSCAD to describe moderately complex geometry.)
- adamnemecek 5y ago
  It makes it somewhat clearer what flows where.
nullsmack 5y ago
Is this actually abandoned? It doesn't look like there's been any activity at all since 2018.
ruslan 5y ago
I'm trying to compile for FreeBSD, but main file graphscad.py is missing in the repository on Github. Please update.

122 points by app4soft 5y ago

GitHub repo: https://github.com/graphscad/graphscad https://github.com/graphscad/graphscad Dimitri Kolovitz's profile on Thingiverse: https://www.thingiverse.com/kolovitz/designs https://www.thingiverse.com/kolovitz/designs

Ennea 5y ago
The Git repo does not seem to contain the actual application.
- FeepingCreature 5y ago
  And the actual application doesn't seem to be opensource. Welp.
  - solarkraft 5y ago
    Oh. Oof.
    - app4soft 5y ago
      Here is a GraphSCAD thread on OpenSCAD form.[0] Also here is Node Graph Interace to OpenSCAD in Java.[1] FTR, I may recommend take a look on VisualScriptCAD[2] and DynFreeCAD[3]. [0] https://forum.openscad.org/Graphscad-A-New-Nodal-editor-for-Openscad-td20016.html https://forum.openscad.org/Graphscad-A-New-Nodal-editor-for-... [1] https://github.com/studiotc/NodeGraphInterface https://github.com/studiotc/NodeGraphInterface [2] https://github.com/kovacsv/VisualScriptCAD https://github.com/kovacsv/VisualScriptCAD [3] https://github.com/infeeeee/DynFreeCAD https://github.com/infeeeee/DynFreeCAD

leoedin 5y ago

Has anyone used this? How does using nodes compare to using text syntax? One of the big problems I've found with openSCAD is that beyond a certain level of complexity it gets very hard to keep a good mental model of the constituent parts of your 3D model in your head, and so changes become hard. This is generally after things get rotated a few times. Does this make that easier?

contingencies 5y ago
I've noticed the same. Partly, the need to maintain a complete mental model is obviated by the fast-iterating IDE (ie. a try-it-and-see approach) and comments. Haven't tried this frontend yet but it seems a good match to the structure of abstraction.
agumonkey 5y ago
a lot of software use node based UI most movie grade CGI (houdini, maya) or compositors were made this way since most tasks don't require an abnormally large network it's ok (when it's not they try to implement submodules of some kind, it's pretty ad-hoc but it's not supposed to be the average use case) one value of these is that it's obviously (and visually) lazy reactive. You can do the same with text but it's harder to see input/outputs on text IMO.
- app4soft 5y ago
  > most movie grade CGI (houdini, maya) or compositors were made this way Yeah. Upcoming Olive Video Editor `0.2.x` would be fully on nodes.[0,1] [0] https://olivevideoeditor.org/020.php https://olivevideoeditor.org/020.php [1] https://github.com/olive-editor/olive https://github.com/olive-editor/olive
  - agumonkey 5y ago
    heh, the late 90s are back
- ur-whale 5y ago
  > a lot of software use node based UI Yes, and as pointed out in another comment, it does not scale well. It's nice for the "tweak" phase of - say - finalizing a shot in a CGI movie, but when you start to get more than a few thousand nodes in a setup, it's very hard to do anything. There are mitigation solutions, such as grouping and collapsing of nodes, but that only goes so far. Another annoying thing with node-based systems: - collaborative work is hard - version control is hard

transfire 5y ago

Can't wait to try! Is the text code and node graph node interchangeable? I.e. can i edit code and see the changes in the graph?

andybak 5y ago
Yeah but no but... https://gist.github.com/andybak/f98742b37b801849e1584b7faddcff59 https://gist.github.com/andybak/f98742b37b801849e1584b7faddc... This is the code generated for a single cuboid. EDIT - looking a bit closer, it might not be that bad. That seems to be mostly library functions. The actual user code is fairly concise: function node_cube_matrix(i=0,j=0,k=0,l=0,m=0,n=0) = translate([0,0,0]); module node_cube(i=0,j=0,k=0,l=0,m=0,n=0) { cube([2,1,1],center=false); } node_cube();

kongin 5y ago

I feel exceedingly stupid for never having thought about something so simple.

willvarfar 5y ago

This is a bit of a tangent but I wish I could find a tool for designing houses that was graphical but underneath based on a programming language. There are several cad and floor planner software that are for designing houses, and modelling software like sketch up that are more general. All seem to be awkward or incomplete. Sketch up is perhaps the fastest for visualizing the shell, but is painful to sketch something with exact measurements. You end up sketching on paper and then trying to enter it into the computer. Sweet home 3D is clunky. Homestyler is actually really good, but doesn’t do roofs and lifts. You can actually do great getting-a-feel sketches in The Sims (honest!) but the grid is all wrong. And all of them treat walls and things as solid volumes. There’s no snap-to-grid on standard studwork spacings or picking walls based on cavity. So much could be done in code eg sorting out wiring, plumbing etc. Building models like openscad does hints at a direction where you lay out the general building and code can auto fit to actually make it buildable and produce working construction drawings etc. Even start computing structural aspects etc. If anyone knows the killer software for designing houses easily but properly, please let me know! I may have missed something. ;)

ramboldio 5y ago
TrussFab takes care of the structural aspect: https://hpi.de/baudisch/projects/trussfab.html https://hpi.de/baudisch/projects/trussfab.html
Iv 5y ago
FreeCad is a generic parametric CAD software. It is not designed for houses, but it allows to create constraints-based designs and is scriptable through python. So not a 100% match but it checks several of your items. If you are considering something as remote as openSCAD, I think you should give a try to FreeCAD and look at a few tutorials (its workflow is not the most intuitive thing)
- drran 5y ago
  See Arch[0] module for FreeCAD. [0]: https://wiki.freecadweb.org/Arch_Workbench https://wiki.freecadweb.org/Arch_Workbench
- 5y ago

ur-whale 5y ago

This type of tool will only reach its full potential when it can really go both ways, i.e going back and forth from nodal representation to actual code seamlessly. And by seamlessly, I mean not losing your loops and recursive calls after doing minor editing to the nodal representation. This is - of course - not easy (and no surprise, this tools does not pull it off), but it's a goal worth pursuing.

hobofan 5y ago
Yes, it seems like there are very few efforts that work towards seamless visual<->text code editing. Even for things like React apps where you have pretty clear composable building blocks in the form of components, I only know of Utopia[0] as an ongoing project. I've worked towards having a React-based interface for OpenJSCAD with Landau[1], where one of the goals was having an editor like Utopia to make most of the editing capabilites available in a standard 3D editor interface that edits the variables in the code. [0]: https://utopia.app/ https://utopia.app/ [1]: https://github.com/landaujs/landau https://github.com/landaujs/landau
- willvarfar 5y ago
  Wow! Just … wow! Super cool! But how far has this gotten?
  - hobofan 5y ago
    Landau has gotten "good enough" to replace OpenSCAD/OpenJSCAD for my personal 3d printing use-cases, where the main benefit I was looking for as a first step is better reusability via npm packages and a familiar interface via React. E.g. in a non-public project of mine that contains a Raspberry PI case, I can just import a 3D model of the RPI[0] to visually ensure that it correctly fits the case, and easily keep them in sync. As I don't really have time to maintain it, development usually moves forward when I find time for my 3d printing hobby, so I wouldn't advise anyone to rely on it. Since the space of alternative React renderers has been explored more and more in the last years (e.g. Remotion[1] for producing videos), I assumed that a "proper version" of Landau would exist by now, but AFAIK there isn't one. [0]: https://github.com/hobofan/landau-rpi https://github.com/hobofan/landau-rpi [1]: https://www.remotion.dev/ https://www.remotion.dev/

nine_k 5y ago

Honest question: are such nodal editors easier for you than the indented text? If so, how do you navigate the charts? How do you organize stuff in nice planar graphs? How do you manage to see enough with such a low information density, compared to text? What are the key advantages you see? (Disclaimer: yes, I did use OpenSCAD to describe moderately complex geometry.)

adamnemecek 5y ago
It makes it somewhat clearer what flows where.

nullsmack 5y ago

Is this actually abandoned? It doesn't look like there's been any activity at all since 2018.

ruslan 5y ago

I'm trying to compile for FreeBSD, but main file graphscad.py is missing in the repository on Github. Please update.