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It seems like the so-called progressives want to take a stab at solving socialism again by making everyone miserable.

option 5y ago
Yes, it blows my mind that in the last century not one, but 2 countries have been divided in half producing as perfect AB-test of capitalism vs socialism as one could imagine and people still think socialist economy is a great idea. Not to mention dozens of other socialist countries which produced nothing but misery for their people.
- joshsyn 5y ago
  Exactly, mob ruling never works. No matter how extreme length you go to prove it. So many examples, but somehow either they don't learn the history or this time it will be different. They are most the ignorant and the irresponsible. Most normal people just want freedom to work, freedom to trade and pursue their own interests and helping those in their circles, not being enslaved to everyone else.
  - imtringued 5y ago
    >Most normal people just want freedom to work, freedom to trade and pursue their own interests and helping those in their circles, not being enslaved to everyone else. Then they should welcome negative interest rates because that is exactly what they do.
    - joshsyn 5y ago
      Thats totally a different discussion and don't see how that is related. Monetary supply/control is a centrally planned policy.
- gmadsen 5y ago
  I really don't think the only options are US style socialism for the elites and austerity for the rest versus USSR totalitarianism. Just look at any other developed country in the world to see more reasonable social welfare programs
  - option 5y ago
    this is false dichotomy invoked every time in discussions like these. Totalitarianism is a property of political system, not economic one. South Korea was not democracy by any stretch of imagination for quite some time. China is totalitarian but very capitalist in most of their economy, hence their success. Also - do not confuse socialism (as in economic system) and social democracy (political system).
    - gmadsen 5y ago
      I didn't give a dichotomy, I called out one. A straw man was given that any sort of reform is paramount to big S Socialism which """has failed every time its been tried""" Political systems are not separate from economic ones.

Yes, it blows my mind that in the last century not one, but 2 countries have been divided in half producing as perfect AB-test of capitalism vs socialism as one could imagine and people still think socialist economy is a great idea. Not to mention dozens of other socialist countries which produced nothing but misery for their people.

joshsyn 5y ago
Exactly, mob ruling never works. No matter how extreme length you go to prove it. So many examples, but somehow either they don't learn the history or this time it will be different. They are most the ignorant and the irresponsible. Most normal people just want freedom to work, freedom to trade and pursue their own interests and helping those in their circles, not being enslaved to everyone else.
- imtringued 5y ago
  >Most normal people just want freedom to work, freedom to trade and pursue their own interests and helping those in their circles, not being enslaved to everyone else. Then they should welcome negative interest rates because that is exactly what they do.
  - joshsyn 5y ago
    Thats totally a different discussion and don't see how that is related. Monetary supply/control is a centrally planned policy.
gmadsen 5y ago
I really don't think the only options are US style socialism for the elites and austerity for the rest versus USSR totalitarianism. Just look at any other developed country in the world to see more reasonable social welfare programs
- option 5y ago
  this is false dichotomy invoked every time in discussions like these. Totalitarianism is a property of political system, not economic one. South Korea was not democracy by any stretch of imagination for quite some time. China is totalitarian but very capitalist in most of their economy, hence their success. Also - do not confuse socialism (as in economic system) and social democracy (political system).
  - gmadsen 5y ago
    I didn't give a dichotomy, I called out one. A straw man was given that any sort of reform is paramount to big S Socialism which """has failed every time its been tried""" Political systems are not separate from economic ones.