4 ms·

>there is already a double-digit premium Facebook must pay for talent Really? Are they forced to pay more because people are actively avoiding the company, or

by jdhn 5y ago

>there is already a double-digit premium Facebook must pay for talent Really? Are they forced to pay more because people are actively avoiding the company, or because they have to pay more for top talent due to competitors?

SamBam 5y ago
I was also interested to know what "double-digit premium" actually means in this context. I feel like the order of magnitude are confusing to me. Like, they pay people $10-$99 more, or they pay people 10x-99x more? Neither seems a plausible interpretation of the statement. Edit: Ok, ok, percentage!
- leobg 5y ago
  Double digit percentage was my sense-making interpretation.
- dagmx 5y ago
  I suspect it was percentage. Which is true, Facebook does pay quite a bit more for a lot of roles, and has more flexible working opportunities. Note I do NOT work there but I do have friends who try and get me to join their teams.
- milesward 5y ago
  Tens of percentage points more total comp.
- SirHound 5y ago
  I’m assuming 10-50k+
- Buraksr 5y ago
  I took it to mean double digit percent, but now I am also thinking it is confusing wording.
- harikb 5y ago
  I ready double digit as > 10% higher salary.
- hirako2000 5y ago
  I understood a double digit premium as percentage. So anywhere between 11% to 99% extra just because it's fb. Sounds about right, not that this premium only apply to fb nor only companies having bad reputation.
- version_five 5y ago
  I assumed a 1.zy multiplier vs a 1.0y multiplier (where y,z are decimal digits) Anyway, I'm not convinced that's causal. Doesn't FB have a reputation for paying well to get smart people, and don't many people aspire to work there so they can get paid well? I personally don't believe I would ever work for facebook because of how uninterested / opposed I am to their mission. But I don't see any evidence, including lots of people I know that went to work for them, that a few people like me actually materially impact their ability to hire
  - svachalek 5y ago
    They were always one of the most picky and high paying employers out there, but anecdotal reports from friends say their offers now are truly stratospheric and even other FAANGs don't want to compete on a compensation basis.
- dont__panic 5y ago
  I'd guess that they mean 10% or more total compensation versus comparable positions elsewhere. But I could also see this meaning $10k a year or more because 10% TC is such an insane number. In my experience, Facebook's offers do tend to beat Google's by $10k or so. But it's all so random and all over the place that it's tough to know if that's a consistent number.
  - ditonal 5y ago
    Yeah it's not even true that FB is paying a premium. A thread full of people complaining about misinformation happily posting inaccurate information about Facebook. Go look at levels.fyi. Facebook pays close to market for senior engineers (~450k), more or less in line with companies like Uber, Robinhood, Twitter, Pinterest, LinkedIn, etc. In fact, Facebook doesn't even crack the top 5 on levels for senior SWE comp so this idea that they have to overpay to recruit is clearly false. If anything, if you hang out on Blind, people will pick FB over other companies precisely because it's perceived as having a stronger engineering brand than those other companies. I think Facebook executive team is full of liars but there are also these weird PR games in play. Uber had a woman complain about not getting a jacket in her size, Google gave Andy Rubin 10 figure bonuses after he credibly raped a report, had scandals with Vic Gundrota/Kelly Ellis, etc. yet Google is still a relatively well perceived company but Uber/TK are mysognistic/sexist companies. Google got caught literally forwarding private user data to the government without warrants, nobody cares (except Glenn Greenwald I guess). Sergey Brin and Steve Jobs got caught explicitly and literally illegally colluding to suppress wages but nobody cares. Google execs were caught lying multiple times w.r.t them building weaponized AI for drones for the DoD in the Maven scandal and that largely washed over. Eric Schmidt sends out email after email to Google employees to contribute to his SuperPAC and nobody cares. Google builds Dragonfly to censor Chinese political opponents and nobody really cares. Facebook is an unethical company but companies like Google have objectively far worse scandalds but don't become the media targets. There are weird groupthink/PR plays at work here and it plays out even on Hacker News where accuracy takes a backseat to narrative building.
    - Tarsul 5y ago
      the difference is that facebook is even bad for its users (and disliked by its users). Google is alright for its users (as is, or maybe was, Amazon). I'm talking about perception of course, not reality.
- thecupisblue 5y ago
  As far as I've heard, it's 2-4x the average salary on some positions. The ethical problems and reputation it faces in community increased their churn while reducing the available pool of candidates.
  - post_from_work 5y ago
    Jeez. Do they offer similar above-market rates for remote work? Would they hire a non-CS/SWE managerial type (still with a STEM education), pushing 40, if I grind some leetcode or something? Pretty sure I've got enough Dark Triad traits (and working for other human-destructive organizations) to tolerate their dystopian shenanigans if it comes with a doubling or trebling of my total comp....
    - thecupisblue 5y ago
      Not sure about that since the whole corona-remote thing makes things a bit weird. But I say definitely try, you literally have nothing to lose and they like the managerial types.
cm2012 5y ago
yeah FB comps are no higher than Google, and lower than Netflix

by jdhn 5y ago

SamBam 5y ago

I was also interested to know what "double-digit premium" actually means in this context. I feel like the order of magnitude are confusing to me. Like, they pay people $10-$99 more, or they pay people 10x-99x more? Neither seems a plausible interpretation of the statement. Edit: Ok, ok, percentage!

leobg 5y ago
Double digit percentage was my sense-making interpretation.
dagmx 5y ago
I suspect it was percentage. Which is true, Facebook does pay quite a bit more for a lot of roles, and has more flexible working opportunities. Note I do NOT work there but I do have friends who try and get me to join their teams.
milesward 5y ago
Tens of percentage points more total comp.
SirHound 5y ago
I’m assuming 10-50k+
Buraksr 5y ago
I took it to mean double digit percent, but now I am also thinking it is confusing wording.
harikb 5y ago
I ready double digit as > 10% higher salary.
hirako2000 5y ago
I understood a double digit premium as percentage. So anywhere between 11% to 99% extra just because it's fb. Sounds about right, not that this premium only apply to fb nor only companies having bad reputation.
version_five 5y ago
I assumed a 1.zy multiplier vs a 1.0y multiplier (where y,z are decimal digits) Anyway, I'm not convinced that's causal. Doesn't FB have a reputation for paying well to get smart people, and don't many people aspire to work there so they can get paid well? I personally don't believe I would ever work for facebook because of how uninterested / opposed I am to their mission. But I don't see any evidence, including lots of people I know that went to work for them, that a few people like me actually materially impact their ability to hire
- svachalek 5y ago
  They were always one of the most picky and high paying employers out there, but anecdotal reports from friends say their offers now are truly stratospheric and even other FAANGs don't want to compete on a compensation basis.
dont__panic 5y ago
I'd guess that they mean 10% or more total compensation versus comparable positions elsewhere. But I could also see this meaning $10k a year or more because 10% TC is such an insane number. In my experience, Facebook's offers do tend to beat Google's by $10k or so. But it's all so random and all over the place that it's tough to know if that's a consistent number.
- ditonal 5y ago
  Yeah it's not even true that FB is paying a premium. A thread full of people complaining about misinformation happily posting inaccurate information about Facebook. Go look at levels.fyi. Facebook pays close to market for senior engineers (~450k), more or less in line with companies like Uber, Robinhood, Twitter, Pinterest, LinkedIn, etc. In fact, Facebook doesn't even crack the top 5 on levels for senior SWE comp so this idea that they have to overpay to recruit is clearly false. If anything, if you hang out on Blind, people will pick FB over other companies precisely because it's perceived as having a stronger engineering brand than those other companies. I think Facebook executive team is full of liars but there are also these weird PR games in play. Uber had a woman complain about not getting a jacket in her size, Google gave Andy Rubin 10 figure bonuses after he credibly raped a report, had scandals with Vic Gundrota/Kelly Ellis, etc. yet Google is still a relatively well perceived company but Uber/TK are mysognistic/sexist companies. Google got caught literally forwarding private user data to the government without warrants, nobody cares (except Glenn Greenwald I guess). Sergey Brin and Steve Jobs got caught explicitly and literally illegally colluding to suppress wages but nobody cares. Google execs were caught lying multiple times w.r.t them building weaponized AI for drones for the DoD in the Maven scandal and that largely washed over. Eric Schmidt sends out email after email to Google employees to contribute to his SuperPAC and nobody cares. Google builds Dragonfly to censor Chinese political opponents and nobody really cares. Facebook is an unethical company but companies like Google have objectively far worse scandalds but don't become the media targets. There are weird groupthink/PR plays at work here and it plays out even on Hacker News where accuracy takes a backseat to narrative building.
  - Tarsul 5y ago
    the difference is that facebook is even bad for its users (and disliked by its users). Google is alright for its users (as is, or maybe was, Amazon). I'm talking about perception of course, not reality.
thecupisblue 5y ago
As far as I've heard, it's 2-4x the average salary on some positions. The ethical problems and reputation it faces in community increased their churn while reducing the available pool of candidates.
- post_from_work 5y ago
  Jeez. Do they offer similar above-market rates for remote work? Would they hire a non-CS/SWE managerial type (still with a STEM education), pushing 40, if I grind some leetcode or something? Pretty sure I've got enough Dark Triad traits (and working for other human-destructive organizations) to tolerate their dystopian shenanigans if it comes with a doubling or trebling of my total comp....
  - thecupisblue 5y ago
    Not sure about that since the whole corona-remote thing makes things a bit weird. But I say definitely try, you literally have nothing to lose and they like the managerial types.

cm2012 5y ago

yeah FB comps are no higher than Google, and lower than Netflix