4 ms·

It could have been prevented, just don't require a vaccine passport. I'm hoping that more countries will follow the danish example, where the vaccine passport

It could have been prevented, just don't require a vaccine passport. I'm hoping that more countries will follow the danish example, where the vaccine passport was dropped on September 10, 2021. This amount of control doesn't make any sense in countries with high percentage of vaccination such as Canada. Another country about to make this mistake is Scotland.

newsbinator 5y ago
There's an argument to be made, not that I'm making it, that you need to have vaccine passports in order to get from 80-something % vaccinated to some higher key immunity threshold, since otherwise it's hard to convince the final group of unvaccinated stragglers to get vaccinated.
- Romanulus 5y ago
  That's an interesting use of the word 'convince' you've made there.
- syshum 5y ago
  >>it's hard to convince the final group Hmmm that is an odd spelling for coerce, force, threaten...
  - barbazoo 5y ago
    You should look up the definition of those words, they don't apply here.
    - HelixEndeavor 5y ago
      Yeah, banning people from participating in basic society unless they take the medical procedure you want them to is totally not coercion in any way...
      - barbazoo 5y ago
        What kind of vaccine mandate are you talking about? In my province, there are only a few non-essential activities that require vaccination. I wouldn't call this "banning from basic society", at least not in our case. But your experience might be different.
        HelixEndeavor 5y ago
        In America, President Joe Biden is attempting to use OSHA to enforce vaccines upon all businesses in the nation, so that those who either cannot or refuse to take the vaccine will be fired. This is highly unconstitutional on many levels, and will likely be dismissed by the Supreme Court, but the fact that it's even being considered by the administration as an option is disturbing. Other nations such as France and Australia are locking people in their homes and preventing them from traveling or performing basic essentials activities like grocery shopping without proof of vaccination.
        barbazoo 5y ago
        I don't think that's accurate at all. According to [0]: > Federal employees, federal contractors and health-care workers at facilities that receive federal funding must show proof of vaccination, with no testing option. > 80 million U.S. workers will have a choice between providing proof of vaccination or submitting to weekly Covid testing. Your examples of France and Australia are also not accurate. According to [1] > There may be circumstances in the future in which proof of vaccination will be required, such as border or re-entry requirements, or continued employment in particular areas. One example of this is the mandatory vaccination requirements for all residential aged care workers which will come into effect on 17 September 2021 in line with relevant state and territory directions. For France there is no mandate like you described [2]. No one is keeping anyone from doing essential things like grocery shopping, I don't know where you got that from but I suggest you do some research. [0] https://www.cnbc.com/2021/09/10/what-you-need-to-know-about-president-joe-bidens-new-vaccine-mandates.html https://www.cnbc.com/2021/09/10/what-you-need-to-know-about-... [1] https://www.health.gov.au/initiatives-and-programs/covid-19-vaccines/is-it-true/is-it-true-are-covid-19-vaccines-mandatory-in-australia https://www.health.gov.au/initiatives-and-programs/covid-19-... [2] https://www.rfi.fr/en/france/20210930-health-pass-becomes-mandatory-for-french-teens-from-30-september https://www.rfi.fr/en/france/20210930-health-pass-becomes-ma...
- penultimatebro 5y ago
  Instead of straight coercion like limiting travel with a passport, I would argue the following is more effective: - Full liability for vaccine manufacturers - No censorship of dissenting views - Open discussion with all views represented instead of suppressed - Honesty on unvaccinated vs vaccinated case, death numbers - Following the science instead of what’s convenient for politicians at the moment
- HelixEndeavor 5y ago
  "convince" yeah, that's the word...
mullingitover 5y ago
Sure would be great if we could get to Denmark's vaccination numbers. This is like saying "We should stop all the DUI checkpoints like this other country did," when that country doesn't have a DUI problem but 30% of drivers in our country are drunk.
- iamstupidsimple 5y ago
  In my country, you're not even legally required to give your driving license when stopped by a police officer for DUI.
  - mullingitover 5y ago
    You're talking about the UK, right? From what I understand they're still going to ID you one way or another (e.g. they'll just look you up in their database, just like police in the US will do if you don't have your license on your person).
    - Scoundreller 5y ago
      Sorta works that way in Canada too. At a DUI checkpoint where they pull over everyone without reasonable cause, the stop is supposed to be strictly to check for DUI. They’re not supposed to go poking around for more things unless it’s incidental to the stop (if they see a dead body, they can investigate that, but not supposed to decide to check your immigration/license/insurance status as a part of the stop).
    - mnw21cam 5y ago
      They'll ID you if you did something wrong. If not, for instance if they're randomly pulling over cars to check for drink driving and you're clean, then they don't need to ID you.
- sharken 5y ago
  Vaccination numbers as of 28.09.2021: Denmark: 76.7% / 75.1% Canada: 77.5% / 71.4% Scotland: 76.7% / 70.2% Canada will most likely overtake Denmark as more people have had the first vaccine shot.

newsbinator 5y ago

There's an argument to be made, not that I'm making it, that you need to have vaccine passports in order to get from 80-something % vaccinated to some higher key immunity threshold, since otherwise it's hard to convince the final group of unvaccinated stragglers to get vaccinated.

Romanulus 5y ago
That's an interesting use of the word 'convince' you've made there.
syshum 5y ago
>>it's hard to convince the final group Hmmm that is an odd spelling for coerce, force, threaten...
- barbazoo 5y ago
  You should look up the definition of those words, they don't apply here.
  - HelixEndeavor 5y ago
    Yeah, banning people from participating in basic society unless they take the medical procedure you want them to is totally not coercion in any way...
    - barbazoo 5y ago
      What kind of vaccine mandate are you talking about? In my province, there are only a few non-essential activities that require vaccination. I wouldn't call this "banning from basic society", at least not in our case. But your experience might be different.
      - HelixEndeavor 5y ago
        In America, President Joe Biden is attempting to use OSHA to enforce vaccines upon all businesses in the nation, so that those who either cannot or refuse to take the vaccine will be fired. This is highly unconstitutional on many levels, and will likely be dismissed by the Supreme Court, but the fact that it's even being considered by the administration as an option is disturbing. Other nations such as France and Australia are locking people in their homes and preventing them from traveling or performing basic essentials activities like grocery shopping without proof of vaccination.
        barbazoo 5y ago
        I don't think that's accurate at all. According to [0]: > Federal employees, federal contractors and health-care workers at facilities that receive federal funding must show proof of vaccination, with no testing option. > 80 million U.S. workers will have a choice between providing proof of vaccination or submitting to weekly Covid testing. Your examples of France and Australia are also not accurate. According to [1] > There may be circumstances in the future in which proof of vaccination will be required, such as border or re-entry requirements, or continued employment in particular areas. One example of this is the mandatory vaccination requirements for all residential aged care workers which will come into effect on 17 September 2021 in line with relevant state and territory directions. For France there is no mandate like you described [2]. No one is keeping anyone from doing essential things like grocery shopping, I don't know where you got that from but I suggest you do some research. [0] https://www.cnbc.com/2021/09/10/what-you-need-to-know-about-president-joe-bidens-new-vaccine-mandates.html https://www.cnbc.com/2021/09/10/what-you-need-to-know-about-... [1] https://www.health.gov.au/initiatives-and-programs/covid-19-vaccines/is-it-true/is-it-true-are-covid-19-vaccines-mandatory-in-australia https://www.health.gov.au/initiatives-and-programs/covid-19-... [2] https://www.rfi.fr/en/france/20210930-health-pass-becomes-mandatory-for-french-teens-from-30-september https://www.rfi.fr/en/france/20210930-health-pass-becomes-ma...
penultimatebro 5y ago
Instead of straight coercion like limiting travel with a passport, I would argue the following is more effective: - Full liability for vaccine manufacturers - No censorship of dissenting views - Open discussion with all views represented instead of suppressed - Honesty on unvaccinated vs vaccinated case, death numbers - Following the science instead of what’s convenient for politicians at the moment
HelixEndeavor 5y ago
"convince" yeah, that's the word...

mullingitover 5y ago

Sure would be great if we could get to Denmark's vaccination numbers. This is like saying "We should stop all the DUI checkpoints like this other country did," when that country doesn't have a DUI problem but 30% of drivers in our country are drunk.

iamstupidsimple 5y ago
In my country, you're not even legally required to give your driving license when stopped by a police officer for DUI.
- mullingitover 5y ago
  You're talking about the UK, right? From what I understand they're still going to ID you one way or another (e.g. they'll just look you up in their database, just like police in the US will do if you don't have your license on your person).
  - Scoundreller 5y ago
    Sorta works that way in Canada too. At a DUI checkpoint where they pull over everyone without reasonable cause, the stop is supposed to be strictly to check for DUI. They’re not supposed to go poking around for more things unless it’s incidental to the stop (if they see a dead body, they can investigate that, but not supposed to decide to check your immigration/license/insurance status as a part of the stop).
  - mnw21cam 5y ago
    They'll ID you if you did something wrong. If not, for instance if they're randomly pulling over cars to check for drink driving and you're clean, then they don't need to ID you.
sharken 5y ago
Vaccination numbers as of 28.09.2021: Denmark: 76.7% / 75.1% Canada: 77.5% / 71.4% Scotland: 76.7% / 70.2% Canada will most likely overtake Denmark as more people have had the first vaccine shot.