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So the left turn signal is an arrow pointing to the right? And the right turn signal is an arrow pointing to the left? How does that pass, well, anything at a
by malyk 5y ago
So the left turn signal is an arrow pointing to the right? And the right turn signal is an arrow pointing to the left?
How does that pass, well, anything at all without someone saying “that might not be the best idea”!
- chrisseaton 5y agoHow could anyone be confused? They’re on the side the car is turning - like every other turn signal you’ve seen in your entire life.
- input_sh 5y agoThey're shaped like arrows pointing the opposite way, and we've had arrows for directions long before we had turn signals. If I ever see one of those in the street you bet I'll be confused for a split second. Being confused even for a split second is not a great thing when you're driving a two ton vehicle.
- shreddit 5y agoLet’s talk again in the dark and something like 100m away
- atty 5y agoIf I were behind that I would not be perpetually confused. But I’d sure as hell have a split second of confusion, and generally we try to avoid those sorts of situations when driving.
- chriswait 5y agoThe article talks about this: "Now, I think the vast majority of drivers will understand what’s going on and treat them as normal blinking turn indicators, but these indicators hurt your brain, at least a little bit" I think you are interpreting "confused" as "I can't tell which way the car is turning", while everyone else is talking about "This UX forces me to use my brain when I shouldn't have to".
- chrisseaton 5y agoI guess I don't know what the author thinks they mean about 'hurt your brain'.
- fortyseven 5y agoSure, go ahead and play stupid.
- chrisseaton 5y agoTo be honest I think the author is playing stupid pretending to be confused by a simple indicator light.
- lost-found 5y agoThey specifically address this in the article. You’re being willfully obtuse.
- andrewflnr 5y agoI think the author is more accurately simulating how his brain will feel when he's flying down the road, tracking the trajectories of the very fast metal boxes surrounding him, and suddenly encounters a non-standard ambiguous signal. Turn signal decoding should be instant and unconscious, and this mini signal disrupts that. If anything I think he's understating the risks.
- torstenvl 5y agoDishonesty is unbecoming.
- mthoms 5y agoSafety features should not be fun or cheeky. They should be intuitive and obvious. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stroop_effect https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stroop_effect
- chriswait 5y ago
- roamerz 5y agoI had to just laugh at your comment. It’s either brilliant sarcasm or you just might be the guy that designed this.
- chrisseaton 5y agoNo not joking. They seem to follow the same predictable pattern as every other turn signal I've ever seen. Not sure what the fuss is.
- cortesoft 5y agoThey do not follow the pattern if every other turn signal you have seen, because no other turn signal has an arrow pointing in the opposite direction of what it is indicating. Can you really not understand how that might cause a moment of confusion? You see a turn signal like normal, but then you notice it is pointing in a different direction… you don’t think that might make some people pause for an instant and think? We are used to both turn signals and arrows being used to indicate direction… when they contradict each other, it is going to get past our automatic brain and make us think, which is bad when driving.
- Toutouxc 5y agoOkay, maybe your brain is wired differently, just like the brain of the designer who created the lights. The position of the light on the car is a signal for my brain, but it takes some processing. If it's on the right side of the vehicle, my brain evaluates that to "right" and vice versa, but maybe it's a short car, like a Smart ForTwo or a Fiat 500, and I'm looking at its side, so the right-hand-side indicator is left from the "center of perceived mass", but in that case there should be another smaller light somewhere around the side-view mirror and hmmm, yeah, it's turning right. It just takes a tiny bit of processing power and a tiny bit of time. But an arrow, boy, I've been looking at arrows all my life. They've been telling me where to go at the train station, which way to turn on Google Maps and sometimes even literally which way to turn the steering wheel, on the outside of a sharp turn. An arrow requires no additional processing and is a strong, unmistakable signal. So what my brain sees on that Mini flashing its left indicator is something like "Car turning left, btw RIGHT".
- sbarre 5y agoWhat if you're in foggy weather or bad rain and can't properly see the car in front of you, and you see a "arrow pointing left" flashing ahead... Not only is the arrow pointing in the wrong direction but you may incorrectly assume that the vehicle itself is to the right of that light when it is in fact to the left of it. Signals are most important in reduced vision conditions, and this reduces the reliability of those signals. Surely you understand this.
- macintux 5y agoEspecially given how many cars have faulty lights, so that might literally be the only indicator you can see of a vehicle in front of you.
- Scarbutt 5y agoI bet you are fun at parties.
- indentit 5y agoAnd if one tail light isn't working in the dark, or the view of one is obstructed, what then?
- young_unixer 5y agoPlease, do the stroop test and tell me you don't get confused by the incongruence.
- pests 5y agoJust looking at the video in the tweet had me slightly confused. Arrows are powerful. It's like those puzzles or quiz's or whatnot that have the word "red" written in a blue font. Of course everyone can read the word, but in split second decisions the brain is going to grab whichever details it can.
- jobigoud 5y ago> like every other turn signal you’ve seen in your entire life. You don't know a priori that they work like other turn signals. You are presented with a new paradigm. Blinking side AND arrow direction. All bets are off. You now have to decide whether they indeed kept them on the right side or if they innovated and it's the arrows that are right.
- chrisseaton 5y ago> All bets are off. It's a turn signal on a car. It's not the enigma you're making it out to be. Thousands of these on the road for like a decade. Absolutely nobody is actually confused. A whole lot of people pretending to be mystified for some reason in this thread.
- _dain_ 5y agoDo you honestly not comprehend the difference between being able to think about this for as long as you want and post comments on HackerNews, and having to make a split-second decision while driving at high speed? Yeah, obviously System 2 gives the right answer. But what about System 1?
- chrisseaton 5y agoI don't know what else to say? I've seen them on cars. They really aren't confusing. They've been around for like a decade. Nobody seems to actually have a problem with them. Only people looking at photos of them on a website and discussing on a forum seem to be irate about it.
- exporectomy 5y agoThen what does this flashing arrow on the back of the vehicle mean? https://trafficsafetyzone.com/product/magnetic-led-direction-sign/ https://trafficsafetyzone.com/product/magnetic-led-direction... or this which looks a lot more like the Mini indicator: https://www.duluthnewstribune.com/business/2304413-red-light-green-light-yellow-arrow https://www.duluthnewstribune.com/business/2304413-red-light... Of course you can work it out with context and time, but are you sure your reflexes can work it all out quickly?
- chrisseaton 5y agoThe Mini indicators don't look like arrows to me. They look just like basic indicators. I don't know what else to say? To be honest I think people are massively exaggerating how confusing they are for fun Internet outrage points. People calling for people to be sacked and things. Crazy.
- CRConrad 5y ago> The Mini indicators don't look like arrows to me. How do you draw an arrow?
- chrisseaton 5y agoThey don't look like one as they're not in the context of one.
- ryandrake 5y agoI've worked in places where, if it's a senior VIP's idea, nobody questions it. You just do it. Doesn't matter if it's good, clever, high-value, safe, ethical, legal, or even possible. You just do it and don't ask why, or so much as hint that it's a terrible idea. Everyone just whistles and pretends it's great. I would hope that this wouldn't be the case in a car company, where safety needs to be a huge part of the whole process, but I've never worked there.
- danuker 5y agoIn Kaizen, if you don't find a problem, there is a problem. Might as well point out the problem. https://harishsnotebook.wordpress.com/2015/08/16/what-do-you-mean-by-no-problem-is-a-problem/ https://harishsnotebook.wordpress.com/2015/08/16/what-do-you...
- GhostVII 5y agoThey probably designed the car with Europe regulations in mind first, and then rather than try and design an entirely new brake light for the US just took the lazy/cheap way and lit up the other two available light bars.
- siva7 5y agoI wonder what kind of company culture exists at mini that no one had the power to step und say that this might be not a good idea
- IshKebab 5y agoIs that really the case? In the UK at least indicators have to be orange, so they are easy to distinguish from brake lights. I find it insane that there are cars with red indicators like this one. Definitely couldn't be sold in the UK.
- AnssiH 5y agoThe article writer believes EU spec indicators are just horizontal (amber) lines so they would not have the issue. But presumably those would be too small for US rules so they lit additional segments, making the arrow, which is what the parent commenter referred to.
- u801e 5y ago> But presumably those would be too small for US rules so they lit additional segments I've seen various Tesla models that just use a single horizontal line of LEDs (either amber or red on color) for their turn signals in the US.