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The lightning connector is a more physically robust one than USB-C. The male lightning connector is a single flat piece; the female connector is a hole with th

The lightning connector is a more physically robust one than USB-C. The male lightning connector is a single flat piece; the female connector is a hole with the contacts on the top + bottom of the port. Compare to USB-C, which has an exposed "tab" in the middle of the female connector, and the male connector has a matching "hole" in the middle. This makes USB-C more vulnerable to e.g. dust collecting, and damage of the exposed tab. Unlike lightning, which can collect dust in the female port, but it's easily cleaned out using a paperclip or SIM card removal tool.

hungryforcodes 5y ago
We don't really know that -- USB-C hasn't been out long enough. I can tell you that for durability I hate lightning, because it always seems to have connection problems after a while and the plug itself seems overly complex for what it does. I can't recall ever having any such connection problems with micro USB or USB A for example. In general it's easy to see also that the lightning connector itself is far more exposed to the environment than any of the USB connectors which are largely enclosed.
- jonplackett 5y ago
  This is weird. My experience has always been the opposite. I’ve broken lots of usb-c cables with the metal bit coming loose. Lightening hardly ever. Any connection problems are usually pocket lint in the hole and fixed with a paper clip.
  - ksec 5y ago
    Same here, I have had lots of broken Lightning Cables, but never the connector. While I have had lots of USB-C connector issues.
    - southerntofu 5y ago
      Sounds like both tech could be improved?
- jounker 5y ago
  Get a toothpick an scrape out the socket.
  - hungryforcodes 5y ago
    Lovely! What a solid design.
cute_boi 5y ago
This applies in theory but I see things happen differently in real life. I have got macbook 2016 usb c cable and that dust problem etc has never happened to me. And my android cable are pretty robust too. But the funny thing is I always need to put spring so that join don't gets damaged in iphone charger.
endless1234 5y ago
It can be argued that lightning is slightly better, sure. But billions of people use USB-C daily, and even half of Apples product line only has them instead of lightning, so not sure if the difference is that meaningful.
- midasuni 5y ago
  I don’t own a single usbc device, I have lightning on my phone, and tons of microusb-usbA devices/cables “Billions” sounds like a HN bubble statement.
  - vetinari 5y ago
    Same applies in reverse. I don't own a single lightning device, but everything (minus older devices) has usb-c. Even rechargeable battery inside a flashlight.
  - Aeolun 5y ago
    I think that’s where we are headed though. I used to have only microusb, but everything I bought in the past year has had usb-c.
  - endless1234 5y ago
    6 billion smartphone subscriptions worldwide (according to https://www.statista.com/statistics/330695/number-of-smartphone-users-worldwide/ https://www.statista.com/statistics/330695/number-of-smartph...), Android is about 70% (https://gs.statcounter.com/os-market-share/mobile/worldwide https://gs.statcounter.com/os-market-share/mobile/worldwide), and has been predominantly USB C for the past 5 years or so (eg Samsung S7, released in 2016, was their first phone with USB-C afaics). I don't think it's that far fetched.
    - agurk 5y ago
      According to Wikipedia the S7 was first released 2016-03-11. The Oneplus 2 was released on 2015-07-28 which was one the first with a USB-C port. One of the big reasons for me getting the OP2 was the port and I'm still using it (with LineageOS). I'm sure I would have upgraded long ago if it didn't have a USB-C port as that's what I've standardised on for all my portable electronics.
IvanK_net 5y ago
This is not about what connector is better. It is about everyone using the same connector. I believe if Apple allowed others to use their connector for free, they could "beat" USBs and become the only existing standard.
- mrsuprawsm 5y ago
  The parent comment asked: >What's Apple reasoning for not abandoning Lightning for USB-C on their phones? I would think that "what connector is better" definitely plays an important part in Apple's reasoning.
- hexa22 5y ago
  The lightning connector only supports usb 2.0 so even apple binned it on the iPads now.
  - ksec 5y ago
    The lightning connector is perfectly capable of supporting USB3.0, ( and they did at one point in time ), but it just doesn't make sense when iPad's ecosystem are more general purpose and requires interaction with USB-C, from display port to memory sticks.
- hungryforcodes 5y ago
  If we're only allowed to use one connector, it had better be the "better one".
  - IvanK_net 5y ago
    If the better one is expensive (e.g. the creator asks for license fees), we should choose the cheaper one. Just like the VHS has beaten the Betamax.
    - hungryforcodes 5y ago
      I'd rather pay for the nice one to be honest. So I guess we can't just have one connector.
tim333 5y ago
>USB-C more vulnerable to e.g. dust A trouble with lightning is the dust etc. gets stuck in the phone socket - I've had to replace two at like £50 a go. Getting a new cable is often easier.
- mrsuprawsm 5y ago
  I have had similar issues in the past, but instead of having to have a port repaired, when I brought my iPhone to the Apple Store, they simply cleaned out the dust from the port with a SIM removal tool and sent me on my way.
- kergonath 5y ago
  A paper clip or a cocktail stick is enough to clean a Lightning port with dust in it. No need to change anything.
  - daxelrod 5y ago
    You're best off with something that isn't conductive to avoid shorting any of the pins. I'd stay away from paper clips. Toothpicks also work well.
p49k 5y ago
They are both physically robust and very reliable, to the point where I don’t think this is a valid excuse. We’ve come a long way since the early days of mobile phones.
stared 5y ago
It does not match my experience. My lightning connectors wear off - it is only a matter of time. It has never ever happened to any on my USB-C cables.
cesarb 5y ago
> The male lightning connector is a single flat piece; the female connector is a hole with the contacts on the top + bottom of the port. Which means that the part which wears over time (the springs) is on the port instead of the cable. On USB-C, the springs are all in the cable; the port is a single flat piece (the tab in the middle) surrounded by a metallic shield.
marcan_42 5y ago
USB-C puts the compliant side (springs) in the plug. This is the part that fatigues and wears out. Lightning puts it in the socket. This means that Lightning will wear out after sufficient connection cycles, and you need to repair your device; with USB-C you can wear out a cable and just replace it, the device will be fine. Additionally, Lightning plug connectors have a higher tendency to corrode. This is, I believe because the exposed mating surface on the plug end easily gathers debris (in particular e.g. oils and grease), and that can cause poor contact which can result in oxidation due to heating and electrolytic effects. USB-C does not have this problem, as none of the mating surfaces are exposed to being touched. The debris that tends to collect inside USB-C ports is usually solid fluff, not liquids. And Lightning is just a terrible standard anyway. iPhones to this day use compressed video over USB2 for their "HDMI" output dongles (which actually have an Ax class CPU in them just to decode the video) because Apple were too short-sighted in their design to allow for enough expandability to support uncompressed digital video properly.

hungryforcodes 5y ago

We don't really know that -- USB-C hasn't been out long enough. I can tell you that for durability I hate lightning, because it always seems to have connection problems after a while and the plug itself seems overly complex for what it does. I can't recall ever having any such connection problems with micro USB or USB A for example. In general it's easy to see also that the lightning connector itself is far more exposed to the environment than any of the USB connectors which are largely enclosed.

jonplackett 5y ago
This is weird. My experience has always been the opposite. I’ve broken lots of usb-c cables with the metal bit coming loose. Lightening hardly ever. Any connection problems are usually pocket lint in the hole and fixed with a paper clip.
- ksec 5y ago
  Same here, I have had lots of broken Lightning Cables, but never the connector. While I have had lots of USB-C connector issues.
  - southerntofu 5y ago
    Sounds like both tech could be improved?
jounker 5y ago
Get a toothpick an scrape out the socket.
- hungryforcodes 5y ago
  Lovely! What a solid design.

cute_boi 5y ago

This applies in theory but I see things happen differently in real life. I have got macbook 2016 usb c cable and that dust problem etc has never happened to me. And my android cable are pretty robust too. But the funny thing is I always need to put spring so that join don't gets damaged in iphone charger.

endless1234 5y ago

It can be argued that lightning is slightly better, sure. But billions of people use USB-C daily, and even half of Apples product line only has them instead of lightning, so not sure if the difference is that meaningful.

midasuni 5y ago
I don’t own a single usbc device, I have lightning on my phone, and tons of microusb-usbA devices/cables “Billions” sounds like a HN bubble statement.
- vetinari 5y ago
  Same applies in reverse. I don't own a single lightning device, but everything (minus older devices) has usb-c. Even rechargeable battery inside a flashlight.
- Aeolun 5y ago
  I think that’s where we are headed though. I used to have only microusb, but everything I bought in the past year has had usb-c.
- endless1234 5y ago
  6 billion smartphone subscriptions worldwide (according to https://www.statista.com/statistics/330695/number-of-smartphone-users-worldwide/ https://www.statista.com/statistics/330695/number-of-smartph...), Android is about 70% (https://gs.statcounter.com/os-market-share/mobile/worldwide https://gs.statcounter.com/os-market-share/mobile/worldwide), and has been predominantly USB C for the past 5 years or so (eg Samsung S7, released in 2016, was their first phone with USB-C afaics). I don't think it's that far fetched.
  - agurk 5y ago
    According to Wikipedia the S7 was first released 2016-03-11. The Oneplus 2 was released on 2015-07-28 which was one the first with a USB-C port. One of the big reasons for me getting the OP2 was the port and I'm still using it (with LineageOS). I'm sure I would have upgraded long ago if it didn't have a USB-C port as that's what I've standardised on for all my portable electronics.

IvanK_net 5y ago

This is not about what connector is better. It is about everyone using the same connector. I believe if Apple allowed others to use their connector for free, they could "beat" USBs and become the only existing standard.

mrsuprawsm 5y ago
The parent comment asked: >What's Apple reasoning for not abandoning Lightning for USB-C on their phones? I would think that "what connector is better" definitely plays an important part in Apple's reasoning.
hexa22 5y ago
The lightning connector only supports usb 2.0 so even apple binned it on the iPads now.
- ksec 5y ago
  The lightning connector is perfectly capable of supporting USB3.0, ( and they did at one point in time ), but it just doesn't make sense when iPad's ecosystem are more general purpose and requires interaction with USB-C, from display port to memory sticks.
hungryforcodes 5y ago
If we're only allowed to use one connector, it had better be the "better one".
- IvanK_net 5y ago
  If the better one is expensive (e.g. the creator asks for license fees), we should choose the cheaper one. Just like the VHS has beaten the Betamax.
  - hungryforcodes 5y ago
    I'd rather pay for the nice one to be honest. So I guess we can't just have one connector.

tim333 5y ago

>USB-C more vulnerable to e.g. dust A trouble with lightning is the dust etc. gets stuck in the phone socket - I've had to replace two at like £50 a go. Getting a new cable is often easier.

mrsuprawsm 5y ago
I have had similar issues in the past, but instead of having to have a port repaired, when I brought my iPhone to the Apple Store, they simply cleaned out the dust from the port with a SIM removal tool and sent me on my way.
kergonath 5y ago
A paper clip or a cocktail stick is enough to clean a Lightning port with dust in it. No need to change anything.
- daxelrod 5y ago
  You're best off with something that isn't conductive to avoid shorting any of the pins. I'd stay away from paper clips. Toothpicks also work well.

p49k 5y ago

They are both physically robust and very reliable, to the point where I don’t think this is a valid excuse. We’ve come a long way since the early days of mobile phones.

stared 5y ago

It does not match my experience. My lightning connectors wear off - it is only a matter of time. It has never ever happened to any on my USB-C cables.

cesarb 5y ago

> The male lightning connector is a single flat piece; the female connector is a hole with the contacts on the top + bottom of the port. Which means that the part which wears over time (the springs) is on the port instead of the cable. On USB-C, the springs are all in the cable; the port is a single flat piece (the tab in the middle) surrounded by a metallic shield.

marcan_42 5y ago

USB-C puts the compliant side (springs) in the plug. This is the part that fatigues and wears out. Lightning puts it in the socket. This means that Lightning will wear out after sufficient connection cycles, and you need to repair your device; with USB-C you can wear out a cable and just replace it, the device will be fine. Additionally, Lightning plug connectors have a higher tendency to corrode. This is, I believe because the exposed mating surface on the plug end easily gathers debris (in particular e.g. oils and grease), and that can cause poor contact which can result in oxidation due to heating and electrolytic effects. USB-C does not have this problem, as none of the mating surfaces are exposed to being touched. The debris that tends to collect inside USB-C ports is usually solid fluff, not liquids. And Lightning is just a terrible standard anyway. iPhones to this day use compressed video over USB2 for their "HDMI" output dongles (which actually have an Ax class CPU in them just to decode the video) because Apple were too short-sighted in their design to allow for enough expandability to support uncompressed digital video properly.