7 ms·

A friend of mine worked as an editor for a news paper. He was a new hire, and a woman who has been working as an editor at the same news paper for 9 years asked

A friend of mine worked as an editor for a news paper. He was a new hire, and a woman who has been working as an editor at the same news paper for 9 years asked him what his salary offer was. It turned out she after 9 years was getting paid $3k less than what he was offered as a new hire.

comeonseriously 5y ago
Similar situations arise constantly in the tech sector. If you stay with a company for a few years, you'll probably get surpassed in salary by new college grads depending on the market at the time. If you let it go too long before you bring it up, when you finally do, you'll get some BS about how they "can't" bump you up because they "can't" authorize that large of a salary bump. A purely BS, arbitrary, rule.
- munk-a 5y ago
  If you find yourself in a situation like that and want to remedy it then get a competing offer. If you're making 80k and sit down with your manager to talk about the possibility of leaving for a 120k position that you're clearly qualified for then a lot of companies will respond with a counter offer. It sucks but you often need to turn your employment rate into a bidding war. Oh - just FYI - be prepared to jump ship if you do this. Some people are manipulative assholes that react strongly and quickly to any employees standing up for themselves - and other companies are legitimately failing and can't afford the pay bump. In either case you're better off at the new shop. Having an actual job offer to another shop should give you the confidence to risk your current position.
  - glouwbug 5y ago
    It's best to just go. Once you've accepted the counter offer you've already indicated to your superiors that you're ready to leave
    - wildrhythms 5y ago
      Use competing offers as leverage for as long as possible. You owe the company nothing.
      - glouwbug 5y ago
        You could accept the counter offer and then be replaced by someone who's willing to work for less (you might even have to train them before you're dismissed). It's just easier to take the new gig and get paid more with a clean political slate
    - munk-a 5y ago
      It really depends - sometimes the team I'm working for is worth the hairiness of negotiating the pay raise - other times it's nothing to write home about and jumping ship is easier.
- t-writescode 5y ago
  Then I guess you "can't" be bothered to keep working at that company. Pity.
conductr 5y ago
This is business as usual in all industries. Companies don’t value tenure and you’re often better off changing companies for promotion, salary increases, etc. To be honest, $3k sounds like a tiny variance. I frequently see 20-30k differences on middle management roles. Often 10%-30% differences. Getting several years of 3% increases can put you well behind the market. This is one of the reasons salary bands are so wide. Employers don’t want to bring current staff up to market but want the ability to hire top talent. Also, there’s a fair bit of budget exceptions that get made when a great candidate comes along (whether they’re great or not, TBD)
- Supermancho 5y ago
  This is why switching jobs to a new employer is the single best way to get a salary increase. The chances that you will get an increase from an employer's pay schedule (or by active request) is far lower than simply applying somewhere else for the going rate, in the US.
- MattGaiser 5y ago
  Experience is valuable. Experience with what specifically your current employer does is not.
- mfer 5y ago
  > Companies don’t value tenure This is very true. They value your ability to do a job. If you've been around a long time and aren't being valuable in your current job they often won't value you. But, if you are being useful in your current job they will value you. Tenure is not valued. Usefulness to the company is. Whether you're 20 or 60 this same thing applies. > you’re often better off changing companies for promotion, salary increases, etc. This depends. Companies often view their people as expenses. They often want to get the maximum they can out of someone at the least expense. There are exceptions to this but it's the rule. So, you need to learn to maximize the thing you value if you want that. Things like position and compensation. When being courted by a new company they will use these to pull you in. But, if you learn the system at your current employer you can use that system to your benefit as well. Your current company doesn't often see benefit from paying people more and promotions. In some cases, they're looking for the people motivated enough to seek them and not wait for them to be given. Especially at the higher levels. Of course, using your current companies system to your benefit means you want to stay there. > 10%-30% differences Hiring companies are looking for that number which will pull people away. Even from a job they like. What they initially offer is almost always lower than they are able to go. Just my 2 cents after many years in the systems.
lliamander 5y ago
Even as a man this has happened to me. In my case at least (and I think in many cases) is that the market price of labor changes, which requires employers to pay more for new hires, but they don't go back and adjust the salaries of existing employees.
- soco 5y ago
  Which basically means they don't value experience in their own company. What better reason to say sayonara?
ericmcer 5y ago
There is a sort of stagnancy that can surround people who have been there for years though. For many devs, the first 3ish months you lack context to be super useful, then that first 2-4 years of hard work and enthusiasm are probably your peak productivity. It gets harder to maintain enthusiasm as the years go by, so some devs who are cruising with 5+ years might actually provide less long term value than a new hire.
- wildrhythms 5y ago
  The 5+ year workers understand, and have experienced, that the promotion system is designed to extract the most value from the greenest thumbs. Tenure is rarely rewarded. Why work harder and harder for nothing?
twistedpair 5y ago
A friend screened a female candidate years ago. She was highly qualified, with serious experience. When asked what her salary expectations were, she said what she made, but confessed she doubted the prospective employer could possibly pay that. The reality was she was quite under paid. It's quite saddening that her prior employer seemed to have convinced her that such low pay was top of the industry mark.
twistedpair 5y ago
Given the ongoing inflation in the US is 5.4% so far this year, everyone has gotten their 5.4% cost of living increase for 2021, right?

comeonseriously 5y ago

Similar situations arise constantly in the tech sector. If you stay with a company for a few years, you'll probably get surpassed in salary by new college grads depending on the market at the time. If you let it go too long before you bring it up, when you finally do, you'll get some BS about how they "can't" bump you up because they "can't" authorize that large of a salary bump. A purely BS, arbitrary, rule.

munk-a 5y ago
If you find yourself in a situation like that and want to remedy it then get a competing offer. If you're making 80k and sit down with your manager to talk about the possibility of leaving for a 120k position that you're clearly qualified for then a lot of companies will respond with a counter offer. It sucks but you often need to turn your employment rate into a bidding war. Oh - just FYI - be prepared to jump ship if you do this. Some people are manipulative assholes that react strongly and quickly to any employees standing up for themselves - and other companies are legitimately failing and can't afford the pay bump. In either case you're better off at the new shop. Having an actual job offer to another shop should give you the confidence to risk your current position.
- glouwbug 5y ago
  It's best to just go. Once you've accepted the counter offer you've already indicated to your superiors that you're ready to leave
  - wildrhythms 5y ago
    Use competing offers as leverage for as long as possible. You owe the company nothing.
    - glouwbug 5y ago
      You could accept the counter offer and then be replaced by someone who's willing to work for less (you might even have to train them before you're dismissed). It's just easier to take the new gig and get paid more with a clean political slate
  - munk-a 5y ago
    It really depends - sometimes the team I'm working for is worth the hairiness of negotiating the pay raise - other times it's nothing to write home about and jumping ship is easier.
t-writescode 5y ago
Then I guess you "can't" be bothered to keep working at that company. Pity.

conductr 5y ago

This is business as usual in all industries. Companies don’t value tenure and you’re often better off changing companies for promotion, salary increases, etc. To be honest, $3k sounds like a tiny variance. I frequently see 20-30k differences on middle management roles. Often 10%-30% differences. Getting several years of 3% increases can put you well behind the market. This is one of the reasons salary bands are so wide. Employers don’t want to bring current staff up to market but want the ability to hire top talent. Also, there’s a fair bit of budget exceptions that get made when a great candidate comes along (whether they’re great or not, TBD)

Supermancho 5y ago
This is why switching jobs to a new employer is the single best way to get a salary increase. The chances that you will get an increase from an employer's pay schedule (or by active request) is far lower than simply applying somewhere else for the going rate, in the US.
MattGaiser 5y ago
Experience is valuable. Experience with what specifically your current employer does is not.
mfer 5y ago
> Companies don’t value tenure This is very true. They value your ability to do a job. If you've been around a long time and aren't being valuable in your current job they often won't value you. But, if you are being useful in your current job they will value you. Tenure is not valued. Usefulness to the company is. Whether you're 20 or 60 this same thing applies. > you’re often better off changing companies for promotion, salary increases, etc. This depends. Companies often view their people as expenses. They often want to get the maximum they can out of someone at the least expense. There are exceptions to this but it's the rule. So, you need to learn to maximize the thing you value if you want that. Things like position and compensation. When being courted by a new company they will use these to pull you in. But, if you learn the system at your current employer you can use that system to your benefit as well. Your current company doesn't often see benefit from paying people more and promotions. In some cases, they're looking for the people motivated enough to seek them and not wait for them to be given. Especially at the higher levels. Of course, using your current companies system to your benefit means you want to stay there. > 10%-30% differences Hiring companies are looking for that number which will pull people away. Even from a job they like. What they initially offer is almost always lower than they are able to go. Just my 2 cents after many years in the systems.

lliamander 5y ago

Even as a man this has happened to me. In my case at least (and I think in many cases) is that the market price of labor changes, which requires employers to pay more for new hires, but they don't go back and adjust the salaries of existing employees.

soco 5y ago
Which basically means they don't value experience in their own company. What better reason to say sayonara?

ericmcer 5y ago

There is a sort of stagnancy that can surround people who have been there for years though. For many devs, the first 3ish months you lack context to be super useful, then that first 2-4 years of hard work and enthusiasm are probably your peak productivity. It gets harder to maintain enthusiasm as the years go by, so some devs who are cruising with 5+ years might actually provide less long term value than a new hire.

wildrhythms 5y ago
The 5+ year workers understand, and have experienced, that the promotion system is designed to extract the most value from the greenest thumbs. Tenure is rarely rewarded. Why work harder and harder for nothing?

twistedpair 5y ago

A friend screened a female candidate years ago. She was highly qualified, with serious experience. When asked what her salary expectations were, she said what she made, but confessed she doubted the prospective employer could possibly pay that. The reality was she was quite under paid. It's quite saddening that her prior employer seemed to have convinced her that such low pay was top of the industry mark.

twistedpair 5y ago

Given the ongoing inflation in the US is 5.4% so far this year, everyone has gotten their 5.4% cost of living increase for 2021, right?