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Here in NYC, we already see Amazon (via Whole Foods) abusing the bike lanes. They have a fleet of electric bikes with several large bins towed behind in a trail

Here in NYC, we already see Amazon (via Whole Foods) abusing the bike lanes. They have a fleet of electric bikes with several large bins towed behind in a trailer. The trailer takes up the whole bike lane (preventing any passing). They've turned massive swaths of the sidewalk outside their Bowery store into a staging area, and the bikes make frequent trips over places like the nearby Williamsburg Bridge, where other cyclists are trying to travel; I consider myself fortunate that I only need to bike in that area occasionally. Of course, these bike lanes are also home to a growing moped infestation, and law enforcement doesn't care about that, either, and they don't do much about the (privately operated) school buses that routinely park in the Vernon Boulevard bike lanes near the Department of Education facility at 44th Rd, either, so, I guess there's just an open invitation to abuse the commons.

yellow_lead 5y ago
The NYC mention reminds me of Bike Lanes by Neistat[1]. Sounds like the situation has deteriorated, I'd be interested to see a 2021 version. [1] https://youtu.be/bzE-IMaegzQh https://youtu.be/bzE-IMaegzQh
rdiddly 5y ago
The cops themselves park in the bike lanes near precincts all over town, too.
- fennecfoxen 5y ago
  Oh, the cops just park all over everywhere. Fire department, too. On the sidewalk, half on the sidewalk, in the crosswalks, over the ADA sidewalk ramps in neighborhoods where they get good amounts of use — hardly worth mentioning the bike lanes at that point. Check out this massive permanent NYPD/FDNY parking-lot that starts on the freeway shoulder and goes along Tillary St / Gold St. These guys are here basically every day: https://www.google.com/maps/@40.6970284,-73.9813054,3a,75y,359.59h,79.08t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sx2P54OwGXRAWgfM9zW7qgg!2e0!7i16384!8i8192 https://www.google.com/maps/@40.6970284,-73.9813054,3a,75y,3... https://www.google.com/maps/@40.6962375,-73.9813369,3a,75y,61.5h,65.1t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sWJSV_AhFOLw5UWpr3krz5g!2e0!7i16384!8i8192 https://www.google.com/maps/@40.6962375,-73.9813369,3a,75y,6... And that's not even a bad day; there's only one or two cars parked on the long narrow triangle where the onramp merges with the street. And the ambulance drivers park in the bike lanes to take a nap or for their lunch break. And the Post Office parks wherever and they just doesn't care, because they're federal, and you can't fine them.
- mapt 5y ago
  Well that sounds illegal. Ever tried a citizen's arrest? (Last time the cops in NYC got angry at civilian oversight they kidnapped the Mayor's daughter and posted her mugshot on Twitter, and a Freudian slip of the SBA's announcement declared that they would "Win the war on New York City". The population should maybe do something about that.)
  - aidenn0 5y ago
    I don't know about NYC, it varies state-to-state, but usually a citizen's arrest is limited to directly witnessed felonies. Illegal parking isn't a felony.
  - dmix 5y ago
    In most cities cops are allowed to park in bike lanes when responding to a call.
    - qvqv 5y ago
      Yes but in NYC they park there even when they aren't responding to calls, including personal vehicles https://twitter.com/jangelooff/status/1436376185039212600 https://twitter.com/jangelooff/status/1436376185039212600
hellbannedguy 5y ago
This sounds like a simple fix. Charge large companies fees to use use their large delivery vechicles on any road. Those fees, and taxes, could build more bike paths, and repair streets. (I would like to see governments charging large companies to use our infrastructure. Only charge the large companies. They are the ones abusing the privilege usually.)
- specialist 5y ago
  Freedom Markets™ theology prohibits taxing megacorps who abuse the commons.
  - fennecfoxen 5y ago
    If I am going to call some platform a “freedom markets theology” platform, my #1 candidate is a policy-oriented think tank called the Reason Foundation, staffed by Libertarians, and dedicated to both freedom and markets. While their writing here is not as strident as at their sister site it is certainly worth calling “theology” in an offhand sense like this one. Their site: http://reason.org http://reason.org The thing is that, quite contrary to what you say here, they end up being quite focused on “user pays” infrastructure, particularly for highways (where the worst wear and tear comes from trucks). Besides tolls they also like congestion pricing schemes and hate exceptions to the schemes being handed to privileged groups. You want them to start charging for the bike lane too? They’d be all over that. Market pricing is how they propose to allocate scarce resources; what’s more scarce than road space in Manhattan? There’s a lot of room to be skeptical of “freedom market theology” but it deserves to be critiqued for what it is, not what it is imagined to be, and this particular attack on it is actually radically at odds with what it teaches. p.s. Oh, yeah, great, send upvotes for the non-constructive political cheap shots which misrepresent actual policy positions, and -2 for the post using effort to challenge bullshit with fact. Love you too, HN, and I know you'll never change. Send more downvotes, I love it.
    - imtringued 5y ago
      I look forward to the day when there is a political debate about walkway neutrality because the local walkway monopoly started setting up their own real estate company and only grants access to the shortest routes to people who rent from their real estate company while forcing longer routes on competing real estate.
blacksmith_tb 5y ago
I'd probably feel differently if I had to ride through that on my morning commute, but presumably replacing diesel delivery trucks with (even obnoxious) electric bikes is on balance a good thing? As for trucks and buses parking in the bike lanes, in most states unfortunately traffic laws provide loopholes for that, sadly.
- withinboredom 5y ago
  Not if the people who ride bikes switch to driving because it’s more dangerous or slow to bike.
- hunterb123 5y ago
  They aren't replacing delivery trucks that stock stores, it's adding to personal deliveries usually done by normal bike or sometimes car depending on the traffic density.
  - The-Bus 5y ago
    Amazon deliveries in NYC are done by a mix of bikes with trailers, the US Postal Service, Amazon's own Sprinter vans, and third-party contractors using their own vehicles (e.g. Lasership). The bikes and trailers are replacing these vehicles, not a normal bike.
stickfigure 5y ago
It's natural to feel upset about bike lanes being over-capacity, but maybe look at it this way: Now there is demonstrated need for expanded capacity, and a deep-pocket lobby (Amazon) on your side. Perhaps getting a larger coalition of users on board is exactly what we need to expand bike infrastructure. The scarcity of bike lanes is wholly artificial and easily fixed by transitioning more automobile infrastructure.
- clairity 5y ago
  yup, i read that and thought, "yes, a reason to double-wide the bike lanes!" i mean, i get it, someone abusing the commons is annoying, but it means we need more human-oriented commons (vs. the car-oriented). cars get too much of our shared space. we should consider repurposing most city streets, such as: one lane (each way) for cars, 1 lane for buses, and 1 protected lane for bikes. most lanes are about 10 feet wide, so we can take a foot away from the car lane and give it to the bus lane to promote traffic calming, while the protected (with curb or bollard) bike lane can be split in two to provide a passing lane.
  - Steltek 5y ago
    Interesting. Micro-cars will come to the US - not by beginning with sharing the road with lethal pickups and SUVs - but by "bike" lanes annexing road space.
    - clairity 5y ago
      to be clear, i don't particularly like the trailerduck (outside being a novel application of technology) as a solution to moving large amounts of stuff in the bike lanes, which potentially would be a precursor to that future. i think microcars (up to ~45mph, not highway legal) belong in car lanes in the city, while e-bikes/scooters should be able to utilize double-wide bike lanes (up to ~25mph, primarily in the passing lane).
      - y4mi 5y ago
        People drive 25 mp/h or 40 km/h on bike lanes? I routinely drove about 27-30km/h without assist and was already getting worried about breaking speed and people entering the bike lane. Going so much faster would be terrifying to me
kevin_thibedeau 5y ago
Are they legal pedal-assist e-bikes or do they have a hand throttle like all the takeout delivery guys use? If the latter you can get the city to crack down since they aren't permitted under NY law.
hinkley 5y ago
Traffic legislation is written in blood. Many cities put traffic lights on corners that have had traffic fatalities, and no amount of complaining about near misses gets them to pay the costs. They want numbers. And those numbers are insurance claims. It's probably going to take someone plowing into a tour group of kids before anything changes, and then that change will be shrill and reactionary.

yellow_lead 5y ago

The NYC mention reminds me of Bike Lanes by Neistat[1]. Sounds like the situation has deteriorated, I'd be interested to see a 2021 version. [1] https://youtu.be/bzE-IMaegzQh https://youtu.be/bzE-IMaegzQh

rdiddly 5y ago

The cops themselves park in the bike lanes near precincts all over town, too.

fennecfoxen 5y ago
Oh, the cops just park all over everywhere. Fire department, too. On the sidewalk, half on the sidewalk, in the crosswalks, over the ADA sidewalk ramps in neighborhoods where they get good amounts of use — hardly worth mentioning the bike lanes at that point. Check out this massive permanent NYPD/FDNY parking-lot that starts on the freeway shoulder and goes along Tillary St / Gold St. These guys are here basically every day: https://www.google.com/maps/@40.6970284,-73.9813054,3a,75y,359.59h,79.08t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sx2P54OwGXRAWgfM9zW7qgg!2e0!7i16384!8i8192 https://www.google.com/maps/@40.6970284,-73.9813054,3a,75y,3... https://www.google.com/maps/@40.6962375,-73.9813369,3a,75y,61.5h,65.1t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sWJSV_AhFOLw5UWpr3krz5g!2e0!7i16384!8i8192 https://www.google.com/maps/@40.6962375,-73.9813369,3a,75y,6... And that's not even a bad day; there's only one or two cars parked on the long narrow triangle where the onramp merges with the street. And the ambulance drivers park in the bike lanes to take a nap or for their lunch break. And the Post Office parks wherever and they just doesn't care, because they're federal, and you can't fine them.
mapt 5y ago
Well that sounds illegal. Ever tried a citizen's arrest? (Last time the cops in NYC got angry at civilian oversight they kidnapped the Mayor's daughter and posted her mugshot on Twitter, and a Freudian slip of the SBA's announcement declared that they would "Win the war on New York City". The population should maybe do something about that.)
- aidenn0 5y ago
  I don't know about NYC, it varies state-to-state, but usually a citizen's arrest is limited to directly witnessed felonies. Illegal parking isn't a felony.
- dmix 5y ago
  In most cities cops are allowed to park in bike lanes when responding to a call.
  - qvqv 5y ago
    Yes but in NYC they park there even when they aren't responding to calls, including personal vehicles https://twitter.com/jangelooff/status/1436376185039212600 https://twitter.com/jangelooff/status/1436376185039212600

hellbannedguy 5y ago

This sounds like a simple fix. Charge large companies fees to use use their large delivery vechicles on any road. Those fees, and taxes, could build more bike paths, and repair streets. (I would like to see governments charging large companies to use our infrastructure. Only charge the large companies. They are the ones abusing the privilege usually.)

specialist 5y ago
Freedom Markets™ theology prohibits taxing megacorps who abuse the commons.
- fennecfoxen 5y ago
  If I am going to call some platform a “freedom markets theology” platform, my #1 candidate is a policy-oriented think tank called the Reason Foundation, staffed by Libertarians, and dedicated to both freedom and markets. While their writing here is not as strident as at their sister site it is certainly worth calling “theology” in an offhand sense like this one. Their site: http://reason.org http://reason.org The thing is that, quite contrary to what you say here, they end up being quite focused on “user pays” infrastructure, particularly for highways (where the worst wear and tear comes from trucks). Besides tolls they also like congestion pricing schemes and hate exceptions to the schemes being handed to privileged groups. You want them to start charging for the bike lane too? They’d be all over that. Market pricing is how they propose to allocate scarce resources; what’s more scarce than road space in Manhattan? There’s a lot of room to be skeptical of “freedom market theology” but it deserves to be critiqued for what it is, not what it is imagined to be, and this particular attack on it is actually radically at odds with what it teaches. p.s. Oh, yeah, great, send upvotes for the non-constructive political cheap shots which misrepresent actual policy positions, and -2 for the post using effort to challenge bullshit with fact. Love you too, HN, and I know you'll never change. Send more downvotes, I love it.
  - imtringued 5y ago
    I look forward to the day when there is a political debate about walkway neutrality because the local walkway monopoly started setting up their own real estate company and only grants access to the shortest routes to people who rent from their real estate company while forcing longer routes on competing real estate.

blacksmith_tb 5y ago

I'd probably feel differently if I had to ride through that on my morning commute, but presumably replacing diesel delivery trucks with (even obnoxious) electric bikes is on balance a good thing? As for trucks and buses parking in the bike lanes, in most states unfortunately traffic laws provide loopholes for that, sadly.

withinboredom 5y ago
Not if the people who ride bikes switch to driving because it’s more dangerous or slow to bike.
hunterb123 5y ago
They aren't replacing delivery trucks that stock stores, it's adding to personal deliveries usually done by normal bike or sometimes car depending on the traffic density.
- The-Bus 5y ago
  Amazon deliveries in NYC are done by a mix of bikes with trailers, the US Postal Service, Amazon's own Sprinter vans, and third-party contractors using their own vehicles (e.g. Lasership). The bikes and trailers are replacing these vehicles, not a normal bike.

stickfigure 5y ago

It's natural to feel upset about bike lanes being over-capacity, but maybe look at it this way: Now there is demonstrated need for expanded capacity, and a deep-pocket lobby (Amazon) on your side. Perhaps getting a larger coalition of users on board is exactly what we need to expand bike infrastructure. The scarcity of bike lanes is wholly artificial and easily fixed by transitioning more automobile infrastructure.

clairity 5y ago
yup, i read that and thought, "yes, a reason to double-wide the bike lanes!" i mean, i get it, someone abusing the commons is annoying, but it means we need more human-oriented commons (vs. the car-oriented). cars get too much of our shared space. we should consider repurposing most city streets, such as: one lane (each way) for cars, 1 lane for buses, and 1 protected lane for bikes. most lanes are about 10 feet wide, so we can take a foot away from the car lane and give it to the bus lane to promote traffic calming, while the protected (with curb or bollard) bike lane can be split in two to provide a passing lane.
- Steltek 5y ago
  Interesting. Micro-cars will come to the US - not by beginning with sharing the road with lethal pickups and SUVs - but by "bike" lanes annexing road space.
  - clairity 5y ago
    to be clear, i don't particularly like the trailerduck (outside being a novel application of technology) as a solution to moving large amounts of stuff in the bike lanes, which potentially would be a precursor to that future. i think microcars (up to ~45mph, not highway legal) belong in car lanes in the city, while e-bikes/scooters should be able to utilize double-wide bike lanes (up to ~25mph, primarily in the passing lane).
    - y4mi 5y ago
      People drive 25 mp/h or 40 km/h on bike lanes? I routinely drove about 27-30km/h without assist and was already getting worried about breaking speed and people entering the bike lane. Going so much faster would be terrifying to me

kevin_thibedeau 5y ago

Are they legal pedal-assist e-bikes or do they have a hand throttle like all the takeout delivery guys use? If the latter you can get the city to crack down since they aren't permitted under NY law.

hinkley 5y ago

Traffic legislation is written in blood. Many cities put traffic lights on corners that have had traffic fatalities, and no amount of complaining about near misses gets them to pay the costs. They want numbers. And those numbers are insurance claims. It's probably going to take someone plowing into a tour group of kids before anything changes, and then that change will be shrill and reactionary.