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> Don't eat less than 1500 / 1300 calories for men/women respectively and try to get some nutrients. Fasting has tremendous benefits, including an increase in

> Don't eat less than 1500 / 1300 calories for men/women respectively and try to get some nutrients. Fasting has tremendous benefits, including an increase in cellars autophagy and down regulation of IGF-1. Crash dieting is not healthy, but that is a psychological issue and not a metabolic one.

justinator 5y ago
I think fasting should only be done after talking to your doctor. Oftentimes, fasting is just another name for normalizing starving oneself, which is a type of disordered eating.
- mym1990 5y ago
  Extended fasting is widely prevalent in many cultures, but I wouldn't consider those parts of the world as having eating disorders. Starvation in a bigger sense is a prolonged deficiency in nutrients and energy needs. Fasting doesn't have to be a set number of hours/days either. You fast every time you go to sleep.
  - qeternity 5y ago
    Starvation mode is something most people do not understand. I can’t count the number of morbidly obese people I’ve heard tell me they need to eat 6 small meals per day so their metabolism doesn’t shift into starvation mode and they stop losing weight. The few studies we have on actual starvation suggest that the body’s BMR does not change substantially until > 10 days without food. Fasting and low carb diets have very similar effects, principally keeping insulin levels very reduced.
- qeternity 5y ago
  > I think fasting should only be done after talking to your doctor. This is what I’m talking about. You been told that it’s dangerous. The human body is incredibly well equipped to go a few days without food. Fasting for a day is absolutely not something that requires medical advice.
  - justinator 5y ago
    To me it could be. I've seen disordered eating in my family (and have done it myself). to me, it's not a good idea, and anectdata on something like my health isn't what I suggest when people are looking for advice. Running right into "don't eat for a couple of days" is a lot more extreme than, "take a good look at your diet and make small adjustments, over time". I know it's not sexy or provocative, but it does work. And that's why I preempted my post with, "talk to an expert" rather than dismissing the whole idea. ie: don't trust some random person on an VC tech forum.
bumby 5y ago
Is there any research on the window from which fasting becomes a crash diet? E.g., if I average 1200 calories over 3 days is that a fast whereas averaging 1200 over a month becomes a crash diet?
- mym1990 5y ago
  Averaging 1200 over 3 days doesn't actually say anything about when you are eating and whether you are fasting.
  - bumby 5y ago
    That’s what I’m getting at. Broad claims like “fasting isn’t unhealthy” need more narrow definitions about what constitutes a “fast”
- themodelplumber 5y ago
  Has the term "crash diet" ever really been raised to any kind of status that is attached to objective measurement? That would be interesting if so. If a crash diet description involves averaging, especially in the 1200 zone and over several weeks, to me that's less of a crash diet and more of an emergent norm that ought to be figured out quickly. Is this person reading /r/1200isplenty, or are they completely depressed, or what? The details are interesting and relevant. If I had to model-ize crash dieting I'd start with something like a caloric deficit > 20% below TDEE, attempted multiple times, combined with the outcome of not meeting or maintaining target weight goals.
- qeternity 5y ago
  Crash dieting is typically the quick reversal of a diet. For instance I eat 500 kcal/day for a week, then then the following month I go back to eating a 500 kcal surplus and more than offset my losses. I would not consider 1200 over 3 days (400/day) to be a fast. I would consider 1200 in a month (40/day) to be a fast (I also think that is far to aggressive).
yoyohello13 5y ago
Fasting for a day is different than chronically eating < 1500/1300. Fasting and what OP said are not mutually exclusive.
- qeternity 5y ago
  OP didn’t say chronically. You did. Fasting and what OP said are mutually exclusive. OP was touting the typical 500 calorie deficit max advice which is rule of thumb meant to keep people prepared for a longer term change, instead of an immediate fix. The problem with a huge amount of diet advice is that it’s psychological, not biological.

justinator 5y ago

I think fasting should only be done after talking to your doctor. Oftentimes, fasting is just another name for normalizing starving oneself, which is a type of disordered eating.

mym1990 5y ago
Extended fasting is widely prevalent in many cultures, but I wouldn't consider those parts of the world as having eating disorders. Starvation in a bigger sense is a prolonged deficiency in nutrients and energy needs. Fasting doesn't have to be a set number of hours/days either. You fast every time you go to sleep.
- qeternity 5y ago
  Starvation mode is something most people do not understand. I can’t count the number of morbidly obese people I’ve heard tell me they need to eat 6 small meals per day so their metabolism doesn’t shift into starvation mode and they stop losing weight. The few studies we have on actual starvation suggest that the body’s BMR does not change substantially until > 10 days without food. Fasting and low carb diets have very similar effects, principally keeping insulin levels very reduced.
qeternity 5y ago
> I think fasting should only be done after talking to your doctor. This is what I’m talking about. You been told that it’s dangerous. The human body is incredibly well equipped to go a few days without food. Fasting for a day is absolutely not something that requires medical advice.
- justinator 5y ago
  To me it could be. I've seen disordered eating in my family (and have done it myself). to me, it's not a good idea, and anectdata on something like my health isn't what I suggest when people are looking for advice. Running right into "don't eat for a couple of days" is a lot more extreme than, "take a good look at your diet and make small adjustments, over time". I know it's not sexy or provocative, but it does work. And that's why I preempted my post with, "talk to an expert" rather than dismissing the whole idea. ie: don't trust some random person on an VC tech forum.

bumby 5y ago

Is there any research on the window from which fasting becomes a crash diet? E.g., if I average 1200 calories over 3 days is that a fast whereas averaging 1200 over a month becomes a crash diet?

mym1990 5y ago
Averaging 1200 over 3 days doesn't actually say anything about when you are eating and whether you are fasting.
- bumby 5y ago
  That’s what I’m getting at. Broad claims like “fasting isn’t unhealthy” need more narrow definitions about what constitutes a “fast”
themodelplumber 5y ago
Has the term "crash diet" ever really been raised to any kind of status that is attached to objective measurement? That would be interesting if so. If a crash diet description involves averaging, especially in the 1200 zone and over several weeks, to me that's less of a crash diet and more of an emergent norm that ought to be figured out quickly. Is this person reading /r/1200isplenty, or are they completely depressed, or what? The details are interesting and relevant. If I had to model-ize crash dieting I'd start with something like a caloric deficit > 20% below TDEE, attempted multiple times, combined with the outcome of not meeting or maintaining target weight goals.
qeternity 5y ago
Crash dieting is typically the quick reversal of a diet. For instance I eat 500 kcal/day for a week, then then the following month I go back to eating a 500 kcal surplus and more than offset my losses. I would not consider 1200 over 3 days (400/day) to be a fast. I would consider 1200 in a month (40/day) to be a fast (I also think that is far to aggressive).

yoyohello13 5y ago

Fasting for a day is different than chronically eating < 1500/1300. Fasting and what OP said are not mutually exclusive.

qeternity 5y ago
OP didn’t say chronically. You did. Fasting and what OP said are mutually exclusive. OP was touting the typical 500 calorie deficit max advice which is rule of thumb meant to keep people prepared for a longer term change, instead of an immediate fix. The problem with a huge amount of diet advice is that it’s psychological, not biological.