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> What you've been saying boils down to "You're wrong in claiming that everyone would gladly nerve-gas everyone around them!" That's literally the opposite of
by baobabKoodaa 5y ago
> What you've been saying boils down to "You're wrong in claiming that everyone would gladly nerve-gas everyone around them!"
That's literally the opposite of what I've been saying. That "everyone" in that sentence, man, do you not listen at all? I've explained to you multiple times that the topic of contention is not "degree of evil that everyone has" - the topic of contention is whether people are grouped into 1 group or 2 groups in this context. What I found offensive in the original post is that it grouped people into 2 groups instead of 1 group. And yet you're here pretending that I'm upset that someone grouped people into 1 group. No, that would have been fine, but they didn't do that. If the original post had grouped people into 1 group, like if it had claimed "everyone is an arsehole", that would've been fine by me, as I've explained to you multiple times. My issue was with a description that divided people up by party lines and described one group as saints and the other group as evil.
> The original contention was just "people do shit like smoking regardless of the harm it does to those around them".
No it wasn't. The sentiment in your statement is that "people are similar in this way", whereas the sentiment in the original post was "people are not similar - there are 2 groups of people, one of these is good and the other is evil". For reference, here's that original post again, which VERY OBVIOUSLY describes the existence of 2 groups which are different from each other:
> > America has two radically different concepts of freedom that travel under the same name. Both start with "I should be free to do as I want". One ends with "as long as I don't harm others". The other ends with "regardless of harm to others".
I'm arguing that "two radically different" groups don't exist; that people are similar in this manner, not too different from one another. You've already conceded multiple times that you agree with this point. If you want to argue that the original post (which I copypasted above) is also saying that "two radically different groups" don't exist, PLEASE, go ahead, let's see that magic how you will twist those words into the opposite of what they actually meant. Go ahead, I'll wait.
- CRConrad 5y agoAs to your last two paragraphs, the quoted one and your reply: You're still, after a week of arguing, reading shit into that which simply isn't there. Now you're quibbling about "radically different groups"... Hey, wake up! It doesn't say that, it says "radically different concepts"! Nobody ever said it's different groups holding those concepts; we all hold them both simultaneously -- one for ourselves, and the other for others. That's the whole damn problem. After a whole week of this, and you still so convincingly demonstrating the whole brouhaha you're raising is all due to your own inability to understand what you're reading, I've had enough and will bow out here. Thanks for the discussion; don't hold your breath for me to return to it.
- wpietri 5y agoExactly, and well put. My point was about rhetoric. There are tribal differences in frequency and manner of use of that rhetoric. But we all start out as perfectly self-centered, and although most of us work our way out, we never lose it entirely.
- dang 5y agoPlease do not perpetuate flamewars on HN. You've broken the site guidelines egregiously in this thread, and we ban such accounts. I don't want to ban you, so if you'd please review the site guidelines at https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html and stick to them in the future, we'd appreciate it. Edit: please see https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28579169 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28579169 also. That's already a pattern—please reverse it!
- dang 5y agoPlease do not perpetuate flamewars on HN. You've broken the site guidelines egregiously in this thread, and we ban such accounts. I don't want to ban you, so if you'd please review the site guidelines at https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html and stick to them in the future, we'd appreciate it.