4 ms·

I used to donate to Wikipedia but then they got bloated/political. I felt bad about my donations and wished I could take them back. Will the Internet Archive av

by CA0DA 5y ago

I used to donate to Wikipedia but then they got bloated/political. I felt bad about my donations and wished I could take them back. Will the Internet Archive avoid this fate?

sp332 5y ago
Well, probably not as long as it's still run by its founder, Brewster Kahle.
- oenetan 5y ago
  Kahle is a very nice guy. It was a pleasure to interact with him.
Rebelgecko 5y ago
I think the IA does a lot of great stuff but they've also gone out of their way to get involved in dumb lawsuits. It's probably not a huge fraction of their overall budget but it was enough to sour me on them a bit.
- junon 5y ago
  Genuinely curious, can you expand/link/whatever? I'd like to read up.
  - Rebelgecko 5y ago
    In the past, digital copies books at the internet archive that were still under copyright were treated somewhat like real physical books. IA would let people "check out" an ebook for a limited time period. The number of checkouts was limited by the number of physical copies of the book that IA or IA-affiliates (or I think even just individuals who pinky promised that they owned a copy of the book whose PDF they were uploading) had in their possession. At the beginning of COVID, they started doing what they called the "National Emergency Library" (this is probably the best term to look up to find more articles and different takes on the topic), where they just let everyone download copies of Harry_Potter.epub. IMO this was a needless provocation and not surprisingly book publishers claim that this is copyright infringement. They're going a bit scorched earth in response- the lawsuit isn't limited to just the "uncontrolled lending" aspect of the program.
    - gego 5y ago
      Just to clarify... it was less Hardy_Potter.epub and more textbooks and stuff for parents s who had to home school their children while losing their jobs and income... and public libraries closed, publishers not... supporting... any digital lending infrastructure before and during the lockdown (like mp3 and music industry, the industry was dragged kicking and screaming into the 21. century even when making a profit), they decided they need to compensate for the closed libraries by letting people lend freely...
      - matkoniecz 5y ago
        AFAIK everything was included - yes, also Hardy_Potter.epub
        gego 5y ago
        Yes, I know but the reason they did take on the publishers was to fill the void of the closed libraries, who had books (and licences) but could not lend them as they were not open... I looked at the appreciation page of the emergency library during this whole mess, where they asked for use cases of their users and the overwhelming (anecdotal) tone was use for learning, uni, work and less free time - not that that would be a prob. But I understand the curiosity of why they took on publishers and looked into it when publishers first sent out the press release that they would sue... that is what I came up with after looking into it a bit... but interested in other views naturally :)
        matkoniecz 5y ago
        Personally I think that several things illegal should be legal, copyright should last about 30 years after death of author and so on. But Internet Archive quite clearly and blatantly broke law - in situation where their operation were already on edge. So there is no surprise at all that various entities used this occasion to sue them. Hopefully IA will survive, but I am not impressed by their strategy.
        gego 5y ago
sinyug 5y ago
> Will the Internet Archive avoid this fate? No. The borg will come for IA eventually once the old guard retires. Kahle might be left/progressive but he is not insane. You can't say that for whoever replaces him in the future. Always remember Robert Conquest's Second Law of Politics: "Any organization not explicitly right-wing sooner or later becomes left-wing."

by CA0DA 5y ago

I used to donate to Wikipedia but then they got bloated/political. I felt bad about my donations and wished I could take them back. Will the Internet Archive avoid this fate?

sp332 5y ago

Well, probably not as long as it's still run by its founder, Brewster Kahle.

oenetan 5y ago
Kahle is a very nice guy. It was a pleasure to interact with him.

Rebelgecko 5y ago

I think the IA does a lot of great stuff but they've also gone out of their way to get involved in dumb lawsuits. It's probably not a huge fraction of their overall budget but it was enough to sour me on them a bit.

junon 5y ago
Genuinely curious, can you expand/link/whatever? I'd like to read up.
- Rebelgecko 5y ago
  In the past, digital copies books at the internet archive that were still under copyright were treated somewhat like real physical books. IA would let people "check out" an ebook for a limited time period. The number of checkouts was limited by the number of physical copies of the book that IA or IA-affiliates (or I think even just individuals who pinky promised that they owned a copy of the book whose PDF they were uploading) had in their possession. At the beginning of COVID, they started doing what they called the "National Emergency Library" (this is probably the best term to look up to find more articles and different takes on the topic), where they just let everyone download copies of Harry_Potter.epub. IMO this was a needless provocation and not surprisingly book publishers claim that this is copyright infringement. They're going a bit scorched earth in response- the lawsuit isn't limited to just the "uncontrolled lending" aspect of the program.
  - gego 5y ago
    Just to clarify... it was less Hardy_Potter.epub and more textbooks and stuff for parents s who had to home school their children while losing their jobs and income... and public libraries closed, publishers not... supporting... any digital lending infrastructure before and during the lockdown (like mp3 and music industry, the industry was dragged kicking and screaming into the 21. century even when making a profit), they decided they need to compensate for the closed libraries by letting people lend freely...
    - matkoniecz 5y ago
      AFAIK everything was included - yes, also Hardy_Potter.epub
      - gego 5y ago
        Yes, I know but the reason they did take on the publishers was to fill the void of the closed libraries, who had books (and licences) but could not lend them as they were not open... I looked at the appreciation page of the emergency library during this whole mess, where they asked for use cases of their users and the overwhelming (anecdotal) tone was use for learning, uni, work and less free time - not that that would be a prob. But I understand the curiosity of why they took on publishers and looked into it when publishers first sent out the press release that they would sue... that is what I came up with after looking into it a bit... but interested in other views naturally :)
        matkoniecz 5y ago
        Personally I think that several things illegal should be legal, copyright should last about 30 years after death of author and so on. But Internet Archive quite clearly and blatantly broke law - in situation where their operation were already on edge. So there is no surprise at all that various entities used this occasion to sue them. Hopefully IA will survive, but I am not impressed by their strategy.
      - gego 5y ago

sinyug 5y ago

> Will the Internet Archive avoid this fate? No. The borg will come for IA eventually once the old guard retires. Kahle might be left/progressive but he is not insane. You can't say that for whoever replaces him in the future. Always remember Robert Conquest's Second Law of Politics: "Any organization not explicitly right-wing sooner or later becomes left-wing."