3 ms·

I'd agree in the ideal world that's exactly what should happen, however in reality there are a load of unadministered doses in the US (https://twitter.com/EricT

I'd agree in the ideal world that's exactly what should happen, however in reality there are a load of unadministered doses in the US (https://twitter.com/EricTopol/status/1437617018782449668?s=20 https://twitter.com/EricTopol/status/1437617018782449668?s=2...) which will go to waste if not used, so it would seem to make sense to use those for boosters where they're available.

est31 5y ago
What about sending the unused doses to developing countries? Then they wouldn't go to waste.
- raesene9 5y ago
  yeah ideally that should happen :) Just it hasn't so the choice isn't "use locally or send abroad" it's "use locally or let them go to waste" TBF I guess this must be a really complex logistical challenge.
  - hef19898 5y ago
    Not sure about logistics, so. Sure it i challenging, but there are well established vaccination programms run by expierenced NOGs in developing countries already. These folks would, I guess, be really happy to take those doses and set something up. They are also rather capable of doing so. initially, that was part of the EUs over-ordering. Take those doses and give them to poorer countries. Good for public health, good PR and really good at gaining soft power in the world. No idea why that isn't happening. Russia and China are grateful for that I guess, so.
    - dalyons 5y ago
      I read that it wasn’t the logistics of sending them out that’s challenging; rather it’s trying to collect them back from the 100k+ pharmacies, hospitals, distribution sites etc in the US, most with poor records. The us mounted such a large and effective campaign to get them out there, would take just almost as large an effort to bring them back
      - hef19898 5y ago
        True, that is a a challenge, I didn't think of that... It's definitely easier to use those doses still sitting in central warehouses somewhere. Funny how demand can be off so much from estimations. I, and it seems I'm not alone with that, really did expect demand for the vaccine to be much higher than it turned out to be.
- HWR_14 5y ago
  The US government, to secure the doses, committed to indemnify the suppliers if anything went wrong and not to transfer the doses to any country that would not (or in some cases, they had to commit to not transferring the doses at all). Most countries are refusing to indemnify the companies. So the US government would be in breach of contract and could be sued for sending the doses overseas.
  - est31 5y ago
    Oh I see, didn't know that. Thanks for explaining! That being said, the government could also give the doses back to the manufacturers for a small fee who could then sell it abroad themselves, because right now it seems to me that their production capacities are maxed out and they produce less than they could sell.
    - HWR_14 5y ago
      Oh yes. Or renegotiate the contracts. And, IIRC, Biden got around that in the case of Mexico by "loaning" them the doses against their preorder that Pfizer couldn't fill yet.
swader999 5y ago
By the time these are distributed the virus will have drifted and these legacy doses likely not as effective with the new strains.
- Robotbeat 5y ago
  Which is why we should use them as soon as possible.

est31 5y ago

What about sending the unused doses to developing countries? Then they wouldn't go to waste.

raesene9 5y ago
yeah ideally that should happen :) Just it hasn't so the choice isn't "use locally or send abroad" it's "use locally or let them go to waste" TBF I guess this must be a really complex logistical challenge.
- hef19898 5y ago
  Not sure about logistics, so. Sure it i challenging, but there are well established vaccination programms run by expierenced NOGs in developing countries already. These folks would, I guess, be really happy to take those doses and set something up. They are also rather capable of doing so. initially, that was part of the EUs over-ordering. Take those doses and give them to poorer countries. Good for public health, good PR and really good at gaining soft power in the world. No idea why that isn't happening. Russia and China are grateful for that I guess, so.
  - dalyons 5y ago
    I read that it wasn’t the logistics of sending them out that’s challenging; rather it’s trying to collect them back from the 100k+ pharmacies, hospitals, distribution sites etc in the US, most with poor records. The us mounted such a large and effective campaign to get them out there, would take just almost as large an effort to bring them back
    - hef19898 5y ago
      True, that is a a challenge, I didn't think of that... It's definitely easier to use those doses still sitting in central warehouses somewhere. Funny how demand can be off so much from estimations. I, and it seems I'm not alone with that, really did expect demand for the vaccine to be much higher than it turned out to be.
HWR_14 5y ago
The US government, to secure the doses, committed to indemnify the suppliers if anything went wrong and not to transfer the doses to any country that would not (or in some cases, they had to commit to not transferring the doses at all). Most countries are refusing to indemnify the companies. So the US government would be in breach of contract and could be sued for sending the doses overseas.
- est31 5y ago
  Oh I see, didn't know that. Thanks for explaining! That being said, the government could also give the doses back to the manufacturers for a small fee who could then sell it abroad themselves, because right now it seems to me that their production capacities are maxed out and they produce less than they could sell.
  - HWR_14 5y ago
    Oh yes. Or renegotiate the contracts. And, IIRC, Biden got around that in the case of Mexico by "loaning" them the doses against their preorder that Pfizer couldn't fill yet.

swader999 5y ago

By the time these are distributed the virus will have drifted and these legacy doses likely not as effective with the new strains.

Robotbeat 5y ago
Which is why we should use them as soon as possible.