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So you literally do have a choice. There’s just a consequence (There are worse things than not living in America, hard as that might be for you to imagine.)

by Veen 5y ago

aaomidi 5y ago
You're going to say no to writing a timeout code and risk your entire family going back to your country? What if you have kids who were born here? You're now going to take them back to a place they don't know? Or are you going to let them go to foster care here? How about if you've bought a house here? You're going to have just a few months to settle everything before you can go.
- Veen 5y ago
  Why would anyone contemplate leaving their children behind in foster care? That seems an absurdly hyperbolic suggestion. People move countries for work and take their children with them all the time. I mean, if the country was Syria and you literally risk death, then I could understand, but people in that situation are refugees, not on work visas. Perhaps I’m finding this hard to understand since I have no desire to live in the US whatsoever and have turned down several offers from companies that wanted me to move there. Nice place to visit, but I can think of dozens of places I would rather live.
  - otterley 5y ago
    What country are you based in? Have you ever lived in a country with extreme poverty or an oppressive government?
  - aaomidi 5y ago
    The kid is a US citizen and doesn't know any language other than English. Depending on the home country that might be a huge huge obstacle for the kid. I was once that kid who had to go back to Iran without knowing Persian. It was fucking terrible.
    - Veen 5y ago
      Yes, moving to a country is hard when you don’t speak the language. Can I ask, why did your Iranian parents not ensure you learned Persian if moving back was a possibility?
      - aaomidi 5y ago
        Because it was something I resisted and made me miserable trying to learn in another country. They did the right thing because I was able to still have a childhood that wasn't bogged down with learning Persian.
- Aeolun 5y ago
  Why would you risk all of those things on the whim of an employer. I swear the US must be the worst possible country in the world to emigrate to.
siculars 5y ago
(Right, like returning to a country you were trying to escape.)
- josephcsible 5y ago
  If you're here from a country that you had to escape, then you're a refugee, and unlike H-1B immigrants, refugees don't have to leave just because they lost their job.
  - iaml 5y ago
    There's a ton of people who had to (or really wanted to, makes no difference in this case) escape a country that did it using their skills as a programmer.
    - Veen 5y ago
      But the vast majority moved because they could make more money in the US. They behave unethically because they don’t want to give up that income. It’s a purely mercenary calculation. And it does make a difference whether it’s a want rather than a need. I want lots of things, but if I behave in a shitty way to get them I should be condemned. I’m sure there are some people in the unfortunate position you describe, and in their case it’s understandable. But it’s not the general case.
      - iaml 5y ago
        People who moved for the money likely went to FAANG instead. Actually, I got interested in this and checked trustarc's careers page and it seems most technical positions are in Philippines/Canada with a mention of "global team" so I'm convinced now all this thread is arguing about strawmen and in reality the product is being written by some remote contractors from third world country who will be easily replaced by a million others if they refuse.
redler 5y ago
The corporate leaders that make the decisions are the ones that should resign on principle. Not the theoretical H1B employee who would uproot their family, derail their career, distress-sell their house, leave the country, etc., over the setTimeout line.

So you literally do have a choice. There’s just a consequence (There are worse things than not living in America, hard as that might be for you to imagine.)

by Veen 5y ago

So you literally do have a choice. There’s just a consequence (There are worse things than not living in America, hard as that might be for you to imagine.)

aaomidi 5y ago

You're going to say no to writing a timeout code and risk your entire family going back to your country? What if you have kids who were born here? You're now going to take them back to a place they don't know? Or are you going to let them go to foster care here? How about if you've bought a house here? You're going to have just a few months to settle everything before you can go.

Veen 5y ago
Why would anyone contemplate leaving their children behind in foster care? That seems an absurdly hyperbolic suggestion. People move countries for work and take their children with them all the time. I mean, if the country was Syria and you literally risk death, then I could understand, but people in that situation are refugees, not on work visas. Perhaps I’m finding this hard to understand since I have no desire to live in the US whatsoever and have turned down several offers from companies that wanted me to move there. Nice place to visit, but I can think of dozens of places I would rather live.
- otterley 5y ago
  What country are you based in? Have you ever lived in a country with extreme poverty or an oppressive government?
- aaomidi 5y ago
  The kid is a US citizen and doesn't know any language other than English. Depending on the home country that might be a huge huge obstacle for the kid. I was once that kid who had to go back to Iran without knowing Persian. It was fucking terrible.
  - Veen 5y ago
    Yes, moving to a country is hard when you don’t speak the language. Can I ask, why did your Iranian parents not ensure you learned Persian if moving back was a possibility?
    - aaomidi 5y ago
      Because it was something I resisted and made me miserable trying to learn in another country. They did the right thing because I was able to still have a childhood that wasn't bogged down with learning Persian.
Aeolun 5y ago
Why would you risk all of those things on the whim of an employer. I swear the US must be the worst possible country in the world to emigrate to.

siculars 5y ago

(Right, like returning to a country you were trying to escape.)

josephcsible 5y ago
If you're here from a country that you had to escape, then you're a refugee, and unlike H-1B immigrants, refugees don't have to leave just because they lost their job.
- iaml 5y ago
  There's a ton of people who had to (or really wanted to, makes no difference in this case) escape a country that did it using their skills as a programmer.
  - Veen 5y ago
    But the vast majority moved because they could make more money in the US. They behave unethically because they don’t want to give up that income. It’s a purely mercenary calculation. And it does make a difference whether it’s a want rather than a need. I want lots of things, but if I behave in a shitty way to get them I should be condemned. I’m sure there are some people in the unfortunate position you describe, and in their case it’s understandable. But it’s not the general case.
    - iaml 5y ago
      People who moved for the money likely went to FAANG instead. Actually, I got interested in this and checked trustarc's careers page and it seems most technical positions are in Philippines/Canada with a mention of "global team" so I'm convinced now all this thread is arguing about strawmen and in reality the product is being written by some remote contractors from third world country who will be easily replaced by a million others if they refuse.

redler 5y ago

The corporate leaders that make the decisions are the ones that should resign on principle. Not the theoretical H1B employee who would uproot their family, derail their career, distress-sell their house, leave the country, etc., over the setTimeout line.