6 ms·

The answer is simple, you don't need an entire article on that. It's all politically motivated. Accepting it as airborne would force governments to accept the c

The answer is simple, you don't need an entire article on that. It's all politically motivated. Accepting it as airborne would force governments to accept the costs of fighting it. Forget that "keep the 2m distance" nonsense. Airborne means you need N95 required everywhere. Public gatherings are out of question too. And if you fight the narrative, you can easily be labeled as "anti-science", whatever that means. Did you all forget how the mask guidance was changed overnight around April/2020? All in the name of "new science information". Take any information from the CDC or WHO with a large grain of salt.

nradov 5y ago
Regardless of whether the virus is airborne or not, there is no need to require N95 masks everywhere or prohibit public gatherings. All exposure control interventions are ultimately futile. They can perhaps slow the spread down slightly to reduce impact on the healthcare system but we'll all eventually be exposed no matter what we do. Fortunately the vaccines are very effective at preventing deaths. https://www.businessinsider.com/delta-variant-made-herd-immunity-not-possible-astrazeneca-developer-2021-8 https://www.businessinsider.com/delta-variant-made-herd-immu...
- sharx 5y ago
  "slow the spread down slightly to reduce impact on the healthcare system" is pretty important during these big waves. Banning outdoor gatherings is probably overkill though, I believe the worst places still have maskless indoor activities.
- sonicggg 5y ago
  Why are people so obsessed with death count? We still don't understand the long term effects of this virus. You don't know the "Long Covid" count for example. And there is very little evidence that vaccines are effective at preventing that.
  - rspeele 5y ago
    Death count is relatively objective. There is some fudge factor for whether somebody died “from” COVID vs “with” COVID but other than that it’s cut and dry. That is a big advantage over comparing case numbers, which depend heavily on testing, or long COVID which there’s not even a hard definition of.
    - LorenPechtel 5y ago
      The lack of a definition for long Covid doesn't mean it's not happening. It just means we don't have good studies of it.
      - rspeele 5y ago
        I don't mean to imply that long COVID isn't happening. Just offering a reason why death counts get most of the attention when we try to assess whether a vaccine/treatment/policy measure is effective.
      - bequanna 5y ago
        A study to prove/disprove long term COVID issues seems awfully difficult or impossible, especially for minor, objective things (fatigue, taste, “brain fog”, etc). Are we relying on patients to self-report whether they had COVID, what they long term effects they noticed? If so, it seems like we’re testing mass hysteria as much as actual effects. I was likely infected and noticed the taste/smell issue. Since I’ve recovered, so has my taste/smell but it was not an immediate recovery and I have no idea if I “lost” some amount of scent sensitivity. It is probably the same as pre-COVID, but if I heard others were reporting this issue it would be very easy to convince myself that I did lose sensitivity and report that.
  - nradov 5y ago
    Deaths can be counted with reasonable accuracy (although there are some edge cases where the primary cause of death is unclear). Whereas "long COVID" is just a vague term for a random collection of non-specific symptoms which seem to occur more commonly in recovered patients than in the general population. The science in this area is very preliminary and mostly low quality as studies have relied mainly on subjective patient reports rather than objective test results. For example, one recent widely cited study listed anxiety as a common "long COVID" symptom even though they didn't describe a plausible causative mechanism. https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(21)01755-4/fulltext https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6... In general any serious viral infection can potentially cause post-viral syndrome. That's not a valid reason for keeping pandemic control restrictions or mandates in place indefinitely. At some point we have to accept the risk and move on. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1710789/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1710789/
2OEH8eoCRo0 5y ago
> The answer is simple Kiss of death right here. If you think any of this is simple then I have a bridge to sell you. And why is there always the need to invoke conspiracy here lately? Don't trust the CDC or the WHO? Yikes!
- sonicggg 5y ago
  https://mobile.twitter.com/WHO/status/1217043229427761152 https://mobile.twitter.com/WHO/status/1217043229427761152 Please, go on
  - snypher 5y ago
    >preliminary investigation >local authority >no clear evidence This doesn't seem like a definite statement of something we know to be wrong in hindsight?
dirtyid 5y ago
A friend working in gov lab responsible for measuring covid airborne behavior said there's a lot of expenses, liabilities involved in formally labelling covid as airborne. The amount of resource intensive measures needed to make spaces not occupational hazards because covid is legally recognized as airborn is onerous.

nradov 5y ago

Regardless of whether the virus is airborne or not, there is no need to require N95 masks everywhere or prohibit public gatherings. All exposure control interventions are ultimately futile. They can perhaps slow the spread down slightly to reduce impact on the healthcare system but we'll all eventually be exposed no matter what we do. Fortunately the vaccines are very effective at preventing deaths. https://www.businessinsider.com/delta-variant-made-herd-immunity-not-possible-astrazeneca-developer-2021-8 https://www.businessinsider.com/delta-variant-made-herd-immu...

sharx 5y ago
"slow the spread down slightly to reduce impact on the healthcare system" is pretty important during these big waves. Banning outdoor gatherings is probably overkill though, I believe the worst places still have maskless indoor activities.
sonicggg 5y ago
Why are people so obsessed with death count? We still don't understand the long term effects of this virus. You don't know the "Long Covid" count for example. And there is very little evidence that vaccines are effective at preventing that.
- rspeele 5y ago
  Death count is relatively objective. There is some fudge factor for whether somebody died “from” COVID vs “with” COVID but other than that it’s cut and dry. That is a big advantage over comparing case numbers, which depend heavily on testing, or long COVID which there’s not even a hard definition of.
  - LorenPechtel 5y ago
    The lack of a definition for long Covid doesn't mean it's not happening. It just means we don't have good studies of it.
    - rspeele 5y ago
      I don't mean to imply that long COVID isn't happening. Just offering a reason why death counts get most of the attention when we try to assess whether a vaccine/treatment/policy measure is effective.
    - bequanna 5y ago
      A study to prove/disprove long term COVID issues seems awfully difficult or impossible, especially for minor, objective things (fatigue, taste, “brain fog”, etc). Are we relying on patients to self-report whether they had COVID, what they long term effects they noticed? If so, it seems like we’re testing mass hysteria as much as actual effects. I was likely infected and noticed the taste/smell issue. Since I’ve recovered, so has my taste/smell but it was not an immediate recovery and I have no idea if I “lost” some amount of scent sensitivity. It is probably the same as pre-COVID, but if I heard others were reporting this issue it would be very easy to convince myself that I did lose sensitivity and report that.
- nradov 5y ago
  Deaths can be counted with reasonable accuracy (although there are some edge cases where the primary cause of death is unclear). Whereas "long COVID" is just a vague term for a random collection of non-specific symptoms which seem to occur more commonly in recovered patients than in the general population. The science in this area is very preliminary and mostly low quality as studies have relied mainly on subjective patient reports rather than objective test results. For example, one recent widely cited study listed anxiety as a common "long COVID" symptom even though they didn't describe a plausible causative mechanism. https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(21)01755-4/fulltext https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6... In general any serious viral infection can potentially cause post-viral syndrome. That's not a valid reason for keeping pandemic control restrictions or mandates in place indefinitely. At some point we have to accept the risk and move on. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1710789/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1710789/

2OEH8eoCRo0 5y ago

> The answer is simple Kiss of death right here. If you think any of this is simple then I have a bridge to sell you. And why is there always the need to invoke conspiracy here lately? Don't trust the CDC or the WHO? Yikes!

sonicggg 5y ago
https://mobile.twitter.com/WHO/status/1217043229427761152 https://mobile.twitter.com/WHO/status/1217043229427761152 Please, go on
- snypher 5y ago
  >preliminary investigation >local authority >no clear evidence This doesn't seem like a definite statement of something we know to be wrong in hindsight?

dirtyid 5y ago

A friend working in gov lab responsible for measuring covid airborne behavior said there's a lot of expenses, liabilities involved in formally labelling covid as airborne. The amount of resource intensive measures needed to make spaces not occupational hazards because covid is legally recognized as airborn is onerous.