3 ms·

Why do you need to cut them off? I mean, isn't the fact that most countries in the world are dictatorship (or failed states, and these are a much bigger problem

Why do you need to cut them off? I mean, isn't the fact that most countries in the world are dictatorship (or failed states, and these are a much bigger problem) a surprise? China is different from other dictatorships only in size. If anything, maximising interoperation with non-free countries only benefits free countries, making their position more exclusive. Say: Chinese rich are likely to settle in US and Europe once they made it, just because it's too scary to stay in China, but they spend and pay taxes there. The world will never be "free" in the Western sense of it, because even the very concept of "society" is foreign to the vast majority of people, the concept of "public good" is foreign too, damn it, in the most countries people can't even queue: they fight for their turn to be served and everyone accepts it as fair. Not just democracy, but even freedom or "rights" in the very basic sense are not understood, or actively rejected by people from all walks of life in most of the world. Just a thought experiment: if you could "fix" those countries, why not start with Saudi Arabia, instead of China or Russia? Extent of human right abuses in the former is bigger than in either of the latter; it's a no-brainer to invade and occupy it - it's a plain desert great for tanks and they have no nukes; and they have oil. Yet this isn't done for the simple reason - no one is going to benefit from it.

jeswin 5y ago
> Just a thought experiment: if you could "fix" those countries, why not start with Saudi Arabia, instead of China or Russia? On account of them being tiny, they aren't a threat to freedoms outside of their own country. China on the other hand, is busy forging alliances with North Korea and Taliban. And threatening democratic Taiwan almost every other week with invasion.
- pell 5y ago
  >On account of them being tiny, they aren't a threat to freedoms outside of their own country. SA has been directly involved in funding terrorism(1), they're fighting a war in Yemen for their own national interest(2), they are pressuring countries in very concrete ways (e.g. Lebanese prime minister Saad Hariri's resignation in 2017 was basically forced by SA)(3), they've been trying to isolate Qatar since 2017(4), they have no qualms about murdering a critic in an embassy overseas(5), they're increasing their influence in places like Bosnia(6). ________________ (1) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/State-sponsored_terrorism#Saudi_Arabia https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/State-sponsored_terrorism#Saud... (2) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saudi_Arabian-led_intervention_in_Yemen https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saudi_Arabian-led_intervention... (3) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2017_Lebanon%E2%80%93Saudi_Arabia_dispute https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2017_Lebanon%E2%80%93Saudi_Ara... (4) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Qatar_diplomatic_crisis https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Qatar_diplomatic_crisis (5) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Assassination_of_Jamal_Khashoggi https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Assassination_of_Jamal_Khashog... (6) https://www.france24.com/en/20181113-focus-bosnia-herzegovina-saudi-arabia-gulf-tourists-influence-business-investments-islam https://www.france24.com/en/20181113-focus-bosnia-herzegovin...
  - fakedang 5y ago
    They've patched up with Qatar by the way. Now they're picking a bone with the UAE.
- modo_mario 5y ago
  >On account of them being tiny, they aren't a threat to freedoms outside of their own country. Lmao what. Have you followed anything at all they've been doing? >China on the other hand, is busy forging alliances with North Korea You know they've had those relations with north korea since forever. You might remember a bit of a war that split the country. >and Taliban Just like every other surrounding country and countries like the US with business interests in the nation. Saudi Arabia was the second country to recognize their government in the past. Pakistan was bombing for and aiding the taliban before the invasion because they prefer them over pashtun nationalists and for other reasons. Iran which was fighting the Taliban has dropped their rhetoric a good bit.

jeswin 5y ago

> Just a thought experiment: if you could "fix" those countries, why not start with Saudi Arabia, instead of China or Russia? On account of them being tiny, they aren't a threat to freedoms outside of their own country. China on the other hand, is busy forging alliances with North Korea and Taliban. And threatening democratic Taiwan almost every other week with invasion.

pell 5y ago
>On account of them being tiny, they aren't a threat to freedoms outside of their own country. SA has been directly involved in funding terrorism(1), they're fighting a war in Yemen for their own national interest(2), they are pressuring countries in very concrete ways (e.g. Lebanese prime minister Saad Hariri's resignation in 2017 was basically forced by SA)(3), they've been trying to isolate Qatar since 2017(4), they have no qualms about murdering a critic in an embassy overseas(5), they're increasing their influence in places like Bosnia(6). ________________ (1) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/State-sponsored_terrorism#Saudi_Arabia https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/State-sponsored_terrorism#Saud... (2) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saudi_Arabian-led_intervention_in_Yemen https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saudi_Arabian-led_intervention... (3) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2017_Lebanon%E2%80%93Saudi_Arabia_dispute https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2017_Lebanon%E2%80%93Saudi_Ara... (4) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Qatar_diplomatic_crisis https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Qatar_diplomatic_crisis (5) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Assassination_of_Jamal_Khashoggi https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Assassination_of_Jamal_Khashog... (6) https://www.france24.com/en/20181113-focus-bosnia-herzegovina-saudi-arabia-gulf-tourists-influence-business-investments-islam https://www.france24.com/en/20181113-focus-bosnia-herzegovin...
- fakedang 5y ago
  They've patched up with Qatar by the way. Now they're picking a bone with the UAE.
modo_mario 5y ago
>On account of them being tiny, they aren't a threat to freedoms outside of their own country. Lmao what. Have you followed anything at all they've been doing? >China on the other hand, is busy forging alliances with North Korea You know they've had those relations with north korea since forever. You might remember a bit of a war that split the country. >and Taliban Just like every other surrounding country and countries like the US with business interests in the nation. Saudi Arabia was the second country to recognize their government in the past. Pakistan was bombing for and aiding the taliban before the invasion because they prefer them over pashtun nationalists and for other reasons. Iran which was fighting the Taliban has dropped their rhetoric a good bit.