4 ms·

Poison Control Centers Are Fielding a Surge of Ivermectin Overdose Calls

14 points by DocFeind 5y ago

MattGaiser 5y ago
People have been convinced to poison themselves at scale in a desire to avoid being poisoned at scale by the vaccine.
rajup 5y ago
Perhaps slightly off-topic: does health insurance cover people who poison themselves on purpose?
- cascom 5y ago
  I would have assumed so, seems to cover all manner of high risk activities (including attempted suicide)
whiddershins 5y ago
Unlikely to be true.
- okl 5y ago
  Why?
fidesomnes 5y ago
The hatred for this drug on reddit and cnn, which is reaching hysterical, irrational levels, including the widespread wish for the people who take it to die (including this week Joe Rogan) has led me to do my own research. I have learned how Ivermetin has been safe for humans since 1975 and has eliminated terrible diseases for millions of people. That said I wouldn't take a dosage recommendation from randoms on the internet. But I am no doctor or medical professional, so I let the doctors explain it to me (this article from 2011 is interesting). So thank you Internet hate mobs for making me learn something new that I did not know about a truly beneficial drug eliminating diseases in Africa. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3043740/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3043740/
grawprog 5y ago
I get some of the conspiracy theories that pop up and why people might believe them, but this ivermectin crap has never made sense to me. In what way is an anti-parasitic drug supposed to help a viral lung infection? I've asked a few people that believe in this ivermectin nonsense to explain exactly how this drug helps against covid. I've yet to receive any explanation as to the mechanism by which ivermectin treats covid that didn't devolve into some unbelievably stupid shit about pleomorphic bacteria and viruses not actually existing. Why this has taken off just leaves me scratching me head. It just makes no sense.
- eth0up 5y ago
  ≥In what way is an anti-parasitic drug supposed to help a viral lung infection? While I have no interest in making a case for ivermectin and covid, you might be interested in the vast, highly relevant field of repurposed drugs. A fair example might be salicylanilides, eg niclosamide - a drug pretty exclusively used for a particular tapeworm, but being repurposed for incurable gonorrhea, c-dif, h-pylori and other conditions. *Edited for shitpad typos
  - grawprog 5y ago
    I can understand an anti-parasitic drug having an effect on bacterial infections. Bacteria falls under what we classically define as 'life'. Bacterial, fungal and parasitic infections share much more in common than viral infections. Viruses are a completely different form of life that causes illness in a totally different way to other forma of infectious organisms.
- h2odragon 5y ago
  https://nature.com/articles/ja201711 https://nature.com/articles/ja201711 listed a couple points of interest: > A 2011 study investigated the impact of ivermectin on allergic asthma symptoms in mice and found that ivermectin (at 2 mg kg−1) significantly curtailed recruitment of immune cells, production of cytokines in the bronchoalveolar lavage fluids and secretion of ovalbumin-specific IgE and IgG1 in the serum. Ivermectin also suppressed mucus hypersecretion by goblet cells, establishing that ivermectin can effectively curb inflammation, such that it may be useful in treating allergic asthma and other inflammatory airway diseases > Ivermectin has also been demonstrated to be a potent broad-spectrum specific inhibitor of importin α/β-mediated nuclear transport and demonstrates antiviral activity against several RNA viruses by blocking the nuclear trafficking of viral proteins. It has been shown to have potent antiviral action against HIV-1 and dengue viruses, both of which are dependent on the importin protein superfamily for several key cellular processes.
deleted 5y ago
[deleted]
jaspax 5y ago
This whole narrative is ragebait. According to the article, the number of calls went up from 133 to 459. In percentage terms, that's an enormous jump, but it absolute terms, it's still basically nothing. There are 55 poison control centers in the country, so this works out to 8 or 9 cases per center. The only reason this is a story at all is because NPR and its allies want to sustain the narrative that there are an enormous number of people attempting to self-medicate with ivermectin, and therefore that we need to further clamp down on free speach and ostracise and punish anyone who isn't going along with the mainstream narrative. Like most "news" these days, it's blatantly propagandistic in its content and intent.
- pseudo0 5y ago
  Also, from the Mississippi health alert they cited (https://msdh.ms.gov/msdhsite/_static/resources/15400.pdf https://msdh.ms.gov/msdhsite/_static/resources/15400.pdf): > No hospitalizations due to ivermectin toxicity have been directly reported to the Mississippi Poison Control Center or the Mississippi State Department of Health. So much for emergency rooms being flooded I guess? This topic really just seems like a way to stereotype and mock rural Americans under the guise of concern. A handful of people with mild symptoms calling poison control really doesn't seem newsworthy without that angle.
- SnowProblem 5y ago
  We have to get smarter and notice we’re being manipulated. Watch this debate. Both sides agree the New York Times sacrifices integrity now for engagement, because its drives revenue. It is only a debate of degree. https://youtu.be/YTHUHJjARKw https://youtu.be/YTHUHJjARKw They perfected this formula under Trump. Exaggerations and lies about people enrage both sides, one at the target and the other at the media. Ragebait is such a perfect term too because it is designed to enrage as many people as possible on all sides. And it works. Just this morning there were 4 different discussions about Ivermectin on Hacker News. 1. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28416654 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28416654 2. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28412115 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28412115 3. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28415708 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28415708 4. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28416790 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28416790
unanswered 5y ago
The more people shout the (racist, if you look just below the surface) claim that ivermectin is "horse dewormer", the more other (less racist but more stupid) people are going to ingest the horse paste formulation of it. The former group needs to realize that the horse has left -- er, that the cat's out of the bag. Viewed in the light most disfavorable to ivermectin, arguendo, the evidence for ivermectin's effectiveness is inconclusive and it cannot be truthfully stated that "it doesn't work"; moreover the evidence for its safety (when taken in the appropriate form and at the appropriate dose) is that it is a ridiculously safe drug. Viewed in a neutral light the evidence really is weighing slightly in favor of ivermectin being part of effective treatment and prophylaxis protocols. The least harm and most benefit will be gained by removing any societal pressures against doctors so that patients can get ivermectin under a doctor's supervision rather than furtively; with the added benefit that under such a system, if the evidence does turn strongly against ivermectin in the future, those doctors can discontinue treatment and explain to their patients the new evidence! The other group just needs to stop eating horse paste. BUT, I suspect that the number of people who have actually done this is probably no more than a few dozen, and that mostly this news is a smear campaign against people taking the human formulation by equating them with people taking the horse paste. Yet, I admit that people's capacity for stupidity never ceases to surprise, so I reserve judgement on the news.
foolzcrow 5y ago
Doctors are saying they've never heard of or treated ivm poisoning. This is propaganda lies because ivm doesn't need tyranny or segregation and it's cheap. Only pieces of shit support segregation at least we can all agree on that part.

14 points by DocFeind 5y ago

MattGaiser 5y ago

People have been convinced to poison themselves at scale in a desire to avoid being poisoned at scale by the vaccine.

rajup 5y ago

Perhaps slightly off-topic: does health insurance cover people who poison themselves on purpose?

cascom 5y ago
I would have assumed so, seems to cover all manner of high risk activities (including attempted suicide)

whiddershins 5y ago

Unlikely to be true.

okl 5y ago
Why?

fidesomnes 5y ago

The hatred for this drug on reddit and cnn, which is reaching hysterical, irrational levels, including the widespread wish for the people who take it to die (including this week Joe Rogan) has led me to do my own research. I have learned how Ivermetin has been safe for humans since 1975 and has eliminated terrible diseases for millions of people. That said I wouldn't take a dosage recommendation from randoms on the internet. But I am no doctor or medical professional, so I let the doctors explain it to me (this article from 2011 is interesting). So thank you Internet hate mobs for making me learn something new that I did not know about a truly beneficial drug eliminating diseases in Africa. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3043740/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3043740/

grawprog 5y ago

I get some of the conspiracy theories that pop up and why people might believe them, but this ivermectin crap has never made sense to me. In what way is an anti-parasitic drug supposed to help a viral lung infection? I've asked a few people that believe in this ivermectin nonsense to explain exactly how this drug helps against covid. I've yet to receive any explanation as to the mechanism by which ivermectin treats covid that didn't devolve into some unbelievably stupid shit about pleomorphic bacteria and viruses not actually existing. Why this has taken off just leaves me scratching me head. It just makes no sense.

eth0up 5y ago
≥In what way is an anti-parasitic drug supposed to help a viral lung infection? While I have no interest in making a case for ivermectin and covid, you might be interested in the vast, highly relevant field of repurposed drugs. A fair example might be salicylanilides, eg niclosamide - a drug pretty exclusively used for a particular tapeworm, but being repurposed for incurable gonorrhea, c-dif, h-pylori and other conditions. *Edited for shitpad typos
- grawprog 5y ago
  I can understand an anti-parasitic drug having an effect on bacterial infections. Bacteria falls under what we classically define as 'life'. Bacterial, fungal and parasitic infections share much more in common than viral infections. Viruses are a completely different form of life that causes illness in a totally different way to other forma of infectious organisms.
h2odragon 5y ago
https://nature.com/articles/ja201711 https://nature.com/articles/ja201711 listed a couple points of interest: > A 2011 study investigated the impact of ivermectin on allergic asthma symptoms in mice and found that ivermectin (at 2 mg kg−1) significantly curtailed recruitment of immune cells, production of cytokines in the bronchoalveolar lavage fluids and secretion of ovalbumin-specific IgE and IgG1 in the serum. Ivermectin also suppressed mucus hypersecretion by goblet cells, establishing that ivermectin can effectively curb inflammation, such that it may be useful in treating allergic asthma and other inflammatory airway diseases > Ivermectin has also been demonstrated to be a potent broad-spectrum specific inhibitor of importin α/β-mediated nuclear transport and demonstrates antiviral activity against several RNA viruses by blocking the nuclear trafficking of viral proteins. It has been shown to have potent antiviral action against HIV-1 and dengue viruses, both of which are dependent on the importin protein superfamily for several key cellular processes.

deleted 5y ago

[deleted]

jaspax 5y ago

This whole narrative is ragebait. According to the article, the number of calls went up from 133 to 459. In percentage terms, that's an enormous jump, but it absolute terms, it's still basically nothing. There are 55 poison control centers in the country, so this works out to 8 or 9 cases per center. The only reason this is a story at all is because NPR and its allies want to sustain the narrative that there are an enormous number of people attempting to self-medicate with ivermectin, and therefore that we need to further clamp down on free speach and ostracise and punish anyone who isn't going along with the mainstream narrative. Like most "news" these days, it's blatantly propagandistic in its content and intent.

pseudo0 5y ago
Also, from the Mississippi health alert they cited (https://msdh.ms.gov/msdhsite/_static/resources/15400.pdf https://msdh.ms.gov/msdhsite/_static/resources/15400.pdf): > No hospitalizations due to ivermectin toxicity have been directly reported to the Mississippi Poison Control Center or the Mississippi State Department of Health. So much for emergency rooms being flooded I guess? This topic really just seems like a way to stereotype and mock rural Americans under the guise of concern. A handful of people with mild symptoms calling poison control really doesn't seem newsworthy without that angle.
SnowProblem 5y ago
We have to get smarter and notice we’re being manipulated. Watch this debate. Both sides agree the New York Times sacrifices integrity now for engagement, because its drives revenue. It is only a debate of degree. https://youtu.be/YTHUHJjARKw https://youtu.be/YTHUHJjARKw They perfected this formula under Trump. Exaggerations and lies about people enrage both sides, one at the target and the other at the media. Ragebait is such a perfect term too because it is designed to enrage as many people as possible on all sides. And it works. Just this morning there were 4 different discussions about Ivermectin on Hacker News. 1. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28416654 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28416654 2. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28412115 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28412115 3. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28415708 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28415708 4. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28416790 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28416790

unanswered 5y ago

The more people shout the (racist, if you look just below the surface) claim that ivermectin is "horse dewormer", the more other (less racist but more stupid) people are going to ingest the horse paste formulation of it. The former group needs to realize that the horse has left -- er, that the cat's out of the bag. Viewed in the light most disfavorable to ivermectin, arguendo, the evidence for ivermectin's effectiveness is inconclusive and it cannot be truthfully stated that "it doesn't work"; moreover the evidence for its safety (when taken in the appropriate form and at the appropriate dose) is that it is a ridiculously safe drug. Viewed in a neutral light the evidence really is weighing slightly in favor of ivermectin being part of effective treatment and prophylaxis protocols. The least harm and most benefit will be gained by removing any societal pressures against doctors so that patients can get ivermectin under a doctor's supervision rather than furtively; with the added benefit that under such a system, if the evidence does turn strongly against ivermectin in the future, those doctors can discontinue treatment and explain to their patients the new evidence! The other group just needs to stop eating horse paste. BUT, I suspect that the number of people who have actually done this is probably no more than a few dozen, and that mostly this news is a smear campaign against people taking the human formulation by equating them with people taking the horse paste. Yet, I admit that people's capacity for stupidity never ceases to surprise, so I reserve judgement on the news.

foolzcrow 5y ago

Doctors are saying they've never heard of or treated ivm poisoning. This is propaganda lies because ivm doesn't need tyranny or segregation and it's cheap. Only pieces of shit support segregation at least we can all agree on that part.