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>You don't have to imagine it. This has literally been happening for the past decade. You either do not understand or trying to avoid the question Is there a

>You don't have to imagine it. This has literally been happening for the past decade. You either do not understand or trying to avoid the question Is there a TurnMeToThePolice app for linux or windows ? and who installs it for free ? For server side makes 100% sense , I use Facebook,Gmail, Dropbox for free so I expect they will scan shit for stuff. For sharing files I am also expect that cloud providers will also scan and respond for copyright violation, makes sense , for stuff you post on Facebook I also expect they scan for porn or other stuff that is against their TOS. But it would be retarded to install something to scan my local files and report me to the police if I had nothing t6o gain from it , so you have already the iPhone, you paid for it, if Apple wants you to allow them to install this shit you should think, why? what I have to gain? Do I trust Apple and my government, what about the future government and the future Apple? The equation is that you gain nothing and the future is unclear so it is 100% a FACT that is a net negative for the user. Still nobody found an answer why Apple did not scan iCloud for CSAM? And why are they starting now with this "think different" way of doing it. If you are a think of the children person you should denounce the fact they did nothing so far , if you are a privacy kind of person you should ask why Apple is giving up now on privacy.

sbuk 5y ago
> Still nobody found an answer why Apple did not scan iCloud for CSAM? They do.
- GeekyBear 5y ago
  Nope. Apple prefers to keep that sort of data private, and a kiddie porn false positive is not the sort of data that should be vulnerable to misuse by anyone who issues a dragnet warrant. Google's data hordes are already widely abused today. >Google says geofence warrants make up one-quarter of all US demands https://techcrunch.com/2021/08/19/google-geofence-warrants/ https://techcrunch.com/2021/08/19/google-geofence-warrants/ Another example would be that Google scans all your photos to identify the people in them and retains that data on their servers, while Apple chooses to perform those sorts of actions on your own device without uploading it to their servers.
  - Lamad123 5y ago
    I keep seeing more and more of these passionate comments shilling for apple!!
    - dang 5y ago
      You've been breaking the site guidelines with comments like this. Please read the rules and follow them: https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html. Note this one: "Please don't post insinuations about astroturfing, shilling, brigading, foreign agents and the like. It degrades discussion and is usually mistaken. If you're worried about abuse, email hn@ycombinator.com and we'll look at the data." https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://hn.algolia.com/?sort=byDate&dateRange=all&type=comment&storyText=false&prefix=true&page=0&query=by:dang%20astroturf https://hn.algolia.com/?sort=byDate&dateRange=all&type=comme...
  - snuser 5y ago
    It's all fucked up. all of it. Google, Facebook Apple, Microsoft, whatever they are a disease worse than covid
  - sbuk 5y ago
    https://nakedsecurity.sophos.com/2020/01/09/apples-scanning-icloud-photos-for-child-abuse-images/ https://nakedsecurity.sophos.com/2020/01/09/apples-scanning-... https://web.archive.org/web/20200119050834/https://www.apple.com/legal/child-safety/en-ww/index.html https://web.archive.org/web/20200119050834/https://www.apple... Please. This information is out there. It takes 5 minutes to look for it.
- simion314 5y ago
  From what I read they only scan images that are attached to emails. So iCloud could be filled with CSAM.
GeekyBear 5y ago
> You either do not understand or trying to avoid the question I understand perfectly. Google and Microsoft have been scanning everything in your account for the past decade and turning customers over to the police. Apple is set to start scanning iCloud Photos and only iCloud Photos in the future. They waited until they found a way to preserve your privacy until they were reasonably certain there was a real issue with what you were uploading to your online account and not just a false positive. With their system, Apple cannot see the scan results until your device informs them that you have crossed the threshold of 30 images flagged as kiddie porn and hands over the encryption key for the scan results. They can't turn over scan result data to the feds before that, because they can't read it. Google and Microsoft, on the other hand, would have to hand over an every account with a single false positive to anyone who issues a dragnet warrant since they carry out their scans on the server.
- simion314 5y ago
  Apple have the key to read your photos, they probably are even encrypted since you can view them from browsers, so this is fake news. They could have scanned the images on the server at the moment you uploaded them, they could have reported CSAM to the authorities and catch the bad guys. I want the proof that Apple is unable to scan on the server, that they don't have the keys and the only solution is on device scanning.
  - GeekyBear 5y ago
    Of course Apple can read data you have uploaded to iCloud. Every cloud service can read the data you upload to it. How do you think Google and Microsoft are scanning everything in your account? What Apple cannot do is see the results of a scan that was not conducted on it's servers, since those results are encrypted with a key Apple doesn't have until the threshold of 30 images matching known kiddie porn is reached.
    - simion314 5y ago
      This logic makes no sense 1 Apple can read data you have uploaded to iCloud. 2 What Apple cannot do is see the results of a scan What makes 2 impossible? if 1 is true then Apple can generate the scan and check the hashes on the server so 2 is possible. What is the advantage? Apple will also have to push the scanning on device to the laptops too and what do you do with devices that don't get updated? Instead of having a simple solution that works for all images in iCloud you get a privacy-invasive solution that only works for some hardware that runs latest stuff. Seems to me that this implementation is not solving the problem of "Prevent CSAM to be uploaded to iCloud" but solves soem other problem and the CSAM is a cover.

sbuk 5y ago

> Still nobody found an answer why Apple did not scan iCloud for CSAM? They do.

GeekyBear 5y ago
Nope. Apple prefers to keep that sort of data private, and a kiddie porn false positive is not the sort of data that should be vulnerable to misuse by anyone who issues a dragnet warrant. Google's data hordes are already widely abused today. >Google says geofence warrants make up one-quarter of all US demands https://techcrunch.com/2021/08/19/google-geofence-warrants/ https://techcrunch.com/2021/08/19/google-geofence-warrants/ Another example would be that Google scans all your photos to identify the people in them and retains that data on their servers, while Apple chooses to perform those sorts of actions on your own device without uploading it to their servers.
- Lamad123 5y ago
  I keep seeing more and more of these passionate comments shilling for apple!!
  - dang 5y ago
    You've been breaking the site guidelines with comments like this. Please read the rules and follow them: https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html. Note this one: "Please don't post insinuations about astroturfing, shilling, brigading, foreign agents and the like. It degrades discussion and is usually mistaken. If you're worried about abuse, email hn@ycombinator.com and we'll look at the data." https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://hn.algolia.com/?sort=byDate&dateRange=all&type=comment&storyText=false&prefix=true&page=0&query=by:dang%20astroturf https://hn.algolia.com/?sort=byDate&dateRange=all&type=comme...
- snuser 5y ago
  It's all fucked up. all of it. Google, Facebook Apple, Microsoft, whatever they are a disease worse than covid
- sbuk 5y ago
  https://nakedsecurity.sophos.com/2020/01/09/apples-scanning-icloud-photos-for-child-abuse-images/ https://nakedsecurity.sophos.com/2020/01/09/apples-scanning-... https://web.archive.org/web/20200119050834/https://www.apple.com/legal/child-safety/en-ww/index.html https://web.archive.org/web/20200119050834/https://www.apple... Please. This information is out there. It takes 5 minutes to look for it.
simion314 5y ago
From what I read they only scan images that are attached to emails. So iCloud could be filled with CSAM.

GeekyBear 5y ago

> You either do not understand or trying to avoid the question I understand perfectly. Google and Microsoft have been scanning everything in your account for the past decade and turning customers over to the police. Apple is set to start scanning iCloud Photos and only iCloud Photos in the future. They waited until they found a way to preserve your privacy until they were reasonably certain there was a real issue with what you were uploading to your online account and not just a false positive. With their system, Apple cannot see the scan results until your device informs them that you have crossed the threshold of 30 images flagged as kiddie porn and hands over the encryption key for the scan results. They can't turn over scan result data to the feds before that, because they can't read it. Google and Microsoft, on the other hand, would have to hand over an every account with a single false positive to anyone who issues a dragnet warrant since they carry out their scans on the server.

simion314 5y ago
Apple have the key to read your photos, they probably are even encrypted since you can view them from browsers, so this is fake news. They could have scanned the images on the server at the moment you uploaded them, they could have reported CSAM to the authorities and catch the bad guys. I want the proof that Apple is unable to scan on the server, that they don't have the keys and the only solution is on device scanning.
- GeekyBear 5y ago
  Of course Apple can read data you have uploaded to iCloud. Every cloud service can read the data you upload to it. How do you think Google and Microsoft are scanning everything in your account? What Apple cannot do is see the results of a scan that was not conducted on it's servers, since those results are encrypted with a key Apple doesn't have until the threshold of 30 images matching known kiddie porn is reached.
  - simion314 5y ago
    This logic makes no sense 1 Apple can read data you have uploaded to iCloud. 2 What Apple cannot do is see the results of a scan What makes 2 impossible? if 1 is true then Apple can generate the scan and check the hashes on the server so 2 is possible. What is the advantage? Apple will also have to push the scanning on device to the laptops too and what do you do with devices that don't get updated? Instead of having a simple solution that works for all images in iCloud you get a privacy-invasive solution that only works for some hardware that runs latest stuff. Seems to me that this implementation is not solving the problem of "Prevent CSAM to be uploaded to iCloud" but solves soem other problem and the CSAM is a cover.