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I have done remote work for a long time (because ...Canada), and the real issue is that it requires management to have their shit together. I also assess compan

I have done remote work for a long time (because ...Canada), and the real issue is that it requires management to have their shit together. I also assess companies for acquisitions now so I talk every month to companies about what's working and what isn't. I've seen some very successful companies with partially remote or even 100% remote teams. And... they have their shit together. Managers have to actually know what the hell they are going to do tomorrow, instead of making stuff up when the stand-up happens. Workers have to be lined up in their swim lanes and the whole thing has to be orchestrated... you know, like actual agile instead of the reactive pfaffery that everyone passes off as "hybrid agile" (boy do I hear that phrase a lot in diligence!) Given how much I've seen it work, and how bad the tech talent war is right now, I'm pretty confident there will be lots of remote only options in 6-12 months when upper managers finally wrap their heads around the fact that this is what they have to do to find and hold top talent now. At the competitive companies, upper execs/board members will start dropping middle managers who can't hack it when they see their attrition numbers in the losing part of the spread.

BiteCode_dev 5y ago
Yes, it's a wonderful filter, isn't it?
lmilcin 5y ago
To be fair, same things apply when your team isn't working remotely. It is not like being able to plan one day in advance has less value when you work in person. It is just that remote working mercilessly exposes some of the flaws in the organization. For example, people who look for a way to slack off now can do this much easier. The problem really is selecting right personnel and motivating them. If you try to treat the problem with a stick it most likely will fail with remote people.
- mumblemumble 5y ago
  I've bounced back and forth among remote and co-located positions of varying levels of effectiveness. I haven't seen much trouble with remote workers slacking off. But I have seen a lot of tension with mixed teams, typically around this problem of remote people getting frustrated about management not having their shit together. The overarching theme that I've seen is that it's really easy to confuse "enjoyable" and "effective." And co-located offices give you all sorts of opportunities to mix those up, because oftentimes the most enjoyable ways for a co-located team to work aren't really the most effective. But nobody cares, because they're enjoying it. By contrast, one of the (un?)happy accidents of remote life is that it tends to cause ineffective organization and communication styles to also be unenjoyable.
Clubber 5y ago
>Workers have to be lined up in their swim lanes and the whole thing has to be orchestrated... you know, like actual agile instead of the reactive pfaffery that everyone passes off as "hybrid agile" (boy do I hear that phrase a lot in diligence!) Swim lanes isn't agile per se, it's just business communicating their priorities and assigning it to development. I remember when agile came out, it was great from the development point of view. It was almost immediately perverted by consultants trying to make a buck trying to sell scrum as a panacea to all development costs and overruns. There's an awful lot of snake oil salesmen in tech. Other than that, I agree with everything you said. https://agilemanifesto.org/principles.html https://agilemanifesto.org/principles.html
- mumblemumble 5y ago
  The Agile Manifesto is not gospel. For starters, I would argue that, "The most efficient and effective method of conveying information to and within a development team is face-to-face conversation," has proven, in the fullness of time, to be an oversimplification. More importantly, the Agile Manifesto not saying something two decades ago does not mean that it has no place in contemporary agile software development. We've had 20 years' worth of time to learn since then. It would be a shame if we hadn't. To that end, I do think that active orchestration - and, for that matter, written communication - is critical to being really agile at any sort of scale. It doesn't necessarily need to be done using swim lanes, but they do happen to be a nice mental model (and visual mnemonic) for keeping track of real-world phenomena such as varying quality of service obligations. But I also think that it makes sense to leave them out of any concrete definition of what it means to be agile. Not only is there more than one way to satisfy that need, there's also no guarantee that every team will have that need.
- iainctduncan 5y ago
  Agreed. I'm using it as a loose metaphor here, I just mean in general, they need to be a lot more organized and proactive. I've seen many varieties of agile and not-so-agile work well.... if they have their shit together. And even the most well though out agile process can be a gong show if they don't.
astockwell 5y ago
The #1 question I wish I could get answered for any prospective company (as an interviewee): "Do you have your shit together?" Seriously. This could avoid so much heartache.
- shreddit 5y ago
  Since most companies employ humans, i'd say most of them don't.
- georgeecollins 5y ago
  I think at a certain point in your career you often get hired because things are messed up. That isn't bad, that is why they are ready to pay for experience and skill.
- stingraycharles 5y ago
  It’s actually fairly easy to ask, and many candidates ask me that: “how do you organize yourselves?” It’s a very reasonable question to ask during an interview.
- rpmisms 5y ago
  I asked this, almost verbatim, in an interview recently. They appreciated the question and ended up hiring me.

BiteCode_dev 5y ago

Yes, it's a wonderful filter, isn't it?

lmilcin 5y ago

To be fair, same things apply when your team isn't working remotely. It is not like being able to plan one day in advance has less value when you work in person. It is just that remote working mercilessly exposes some of the flaws in the organization. For example, people who look for a way to slack off now can do this much easier. The problem really is selecting right personnel and motivating them. If you try to treat the problem with a stick it most likely will fail with remote people.

mumblemumble 5y ago
I've bounced back and forth among remote and co-located positions of varying levels of effectiveness. I haven't seen much trouble with remote workers slacking off. But I have seen a lot of tension with mixed teams, typically around this problem of remote people getting frustrated about management not having their shit together. The overarching theme that I've seen is that it's really easy to confuse "enjoyable" and "effective." And co-located offices give you all sorts of opportunities to mix those up, because oftentimes the most enjoyable ways for a co-located team to work aren't really the most effective. But nobody cares, because they're enjoying it. By contrast, one of the (un?)happy accidents of remote life is that it tends to cause ineffective organization and communication styles to also be unenjoyable.

Clubber 5y ago

>Workers have to be lined up in their swim lanes and the whole thing has to be orchestrated... you know, like actual agile instead of the reactive pfaffery that everyone passes off as "hybrid agile" (boy do I hear that phrase a lot in diligence!) Swim lanes isn't agile per se, it's just business communicating their priorities and assigning it to development. I remember when agile came out, it was great from the development point of view. It was almost immediately perverted by consultants trying to make a buck trying to sell scrum as a panacea to all development costs and overruns. There's an awful lot of snake oil salesmen in tech. Other than that, I agree with everything you said. https://agilemanifesto.org/principles.html https://agilemanifesto.org/principles.html

mumblemumble 5y ago
The Agile Manifesto is not gospel. For starters, I would argue that, "The most efficient and effective method of conveying information to and within a development team is face-to-face conversation," has proven, in the fullness of time, to be an oversimplification. More importantly, the Agile Manifesto not saying something two decades ago does not mean that it has no place in contemporary agile software development. We've had 20 years' worth of time to learn since then. It would be a shame if we hadn't. To that end, I do think that active orchestration - and, for that matter, written communication - is critical to being really agile at any sort of scale. It doesn't necessarily need to be done using swim lanes, but they do happen to be a nice mental model (and visual mnemonic) for keeping track of real-world phenomena such as varying quality of service obligations. But I also think that it makes sense to leave them out of any concrete definition of what it means to be agile. Not only is there more than one way to satisfy that need, there's also no guarantee that every team will have that need.
iainctduncan 5y ago
Agreed. I'm using it as a loose metaphor here, I just mean in general, they need to be a lot more organized and proactive. I've seen many varieties of agile and not-so-agile work well.... if they have their shit together. And even the most well though out agile process can be a gong show if they don't.

astockwell 5y ago

The #1 question I wish I could get answered for any prospective company (as an interviewee): "Do you have your shit together?" Seriously. This could avoid so much heartache.

shreddit 5y ago
Since most companies employ humans, i'd say most of them don't.
georgeecollins 5y ago
I think at a certain point in your career you often get hired because things are messed up. That isn't bad, that is why they are ready to pay for experience and skill.
stingraycharles 5y ago
It’s actually fairly easy to ask, and many candidates ask me that: “how do you organize yourselves?” It’s a very reasonable question to ask during an interview.
rpmisms 5y ago
I asked this, almost verbatim, in an interview recently. They appreciated the question and ended up hiring me.