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I played rugby in high school, and I was surprised at how much you don't hit your head intentionally like you do in American football. You use your shoulders, t

• smcl 5y ago
  For non-rugby types, here's a Garryowen: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SmdqLiEvYw4 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SmdqLiEvYw4
  • engineer_22 5y ago
    I don't know what I'm looking for, there's several stages of play in that clip, is a garyowen where they collide in midair?
    • maccard 5y ago
      It's the high kick.
    • smcl 5y ago
      edit: just read Jenk's comment :)
    • Jenk 5y ago
      A "Garryowen" is very high, but not that long, kick. It's a kick where the intent is to have your own team catch it. Let's say you are the fullback and you are facing a wall of approaching opposition, charging at you. All of your team are ahead of you, too, so they are of no use. Blocking is illegal. The opposition are not allowed to tackle you if you don't have the ball, so you kick it up high, over their heads, and run past them, catch it, and carry on running. The opposition's inertia will keep them going past the ball (and you) so when you regain the ball, you'll have a clear field ahead of you. That's the dream. The reality is you now have a field of fast, heavy, people running toward the same spot on the field, all looking straight-up at the ball that is now 50ft in the air, unaware they are about to collide in a wind-taking, bone-crunching crash.
      • smcl 5y ago
        Thanks, a better explanation
      • unethical_ban 5y ago
        My team called that the eagle, but yeah - I've seen people knock themselves out making that play.
• hnlmorg 5y ago
  There's similar research that shows padded gloves have lead to more injuries in boxing.
  • deleted 5y ago
    [deleted]
  • blix 5y ago
    There's some evidence that increased padding leads to increased impact force in a wide range of sports, from boxing to running, that have a padded person initiating impact. Anecdotally, this is well known among hockey players and there's a social stigma against wearing more protective gear than average. I've even seen it implicated in pedestrian deaths as a result of driving.
    • elevenoh 5y ago
      Protective gear wont save ya much from concussions though. Doesn't matter whats on your head if you're head is caught with an elbow, shoulder or the glass. Tis a tough problem.
  • matwood 5y ago
    I've seen some of that research. MMA for example looks worse b/c of the potential for cuts and blood, but a single good punch typically ends a fight (and if a fighter does get to a position to really tee off, the ref stops the fight). Whereas in boxing, the boxer takes repeated punches over many rounds, and that doesn't count the training they do.
  • linguistbreaker 5y ago
    More head injuries. The gloves are to protect the hands.
    • hnlmorg 5y ago
      Yes, that's what I said :)
  • 5y ago
• switchbak 5y ago
  I played a bunch of football myself. While others may deny it, there really exists an intentional tactic of crashing into opponents with your helmet. Especially on the line. I did it a lot myself. The additional protection from armor very much does lead to an increase in the velocity of hits. This results in very high forces, and while you might not see broken bones, there's often injuries still happening. I had about three months of foggy brain after I stopped playing. Now there's just no way I'd let a child of mine play that sport. I had a great time and learned a lot, but it's just not worth it, even just at the high school level.
  • toss1 5y ago
    Yup, knew a guy who played in the Rose Bowl, had a bunch of NFL offers. He passed and went to a corporate job. While his concern was constant knee injuries, his key statement was "I want to be able to walk when I'm 45". Wise choice.
    • toss1 5y ago
      Edit: This was before the knowledge about TBI became widespread, so in some ways, his ability to look forward to the results of his older peers was even more prescient.
  • oogali 5y ago
    Perhaps it varies from area to area? Where I grew up, the pee wee football league (9 and up), there was an unwritten rule of “no head hunting” (purposeful helmet to helmet contact). If you suspected the other team of doing so, or vice versa there would certainly be a fight amongst the teams: either after the game or even mid-game. Now I’m speculating here but maybe it had to do with inner city culture where sports was seen as a way out rather than simply as an extracurricular so cheap shots and other intentional injuries were very much frowned upon.
  • svrtknst 5y ago
    This is an increasingly common sentiment among hockey players too, that softer shoulder pads could be a way to decrease head trauma
• avnigo 5y ago
  What you wrote reminded me of an article on the bike helmet paradox: https://www.theatlantic.com/health/archive/2013/03/the-bike-helmet-paradox/273555/ https://www.theatlantic.com/health/archive/2013/03/the-bike-...
  • ehnto 5y ago
    It's definitely a weird kind of embarrassment, I won't pretend it doesn't exist. But it's one of those hurdles that are so small in retrospect, you wonder how you ever let it stop you from experiencing all the benefits of a cycling rich life. I think it's because until you've experienced it, you don't realize how much is on offer on the other side of the fence. In my own city I wouldn't ride without one, but in a more shared space friendly city, like famously in many cities in Japan, I wouldn't be as inclined to wear one. If I'm riding at 30kmph right next to traffic, you bet I want a helmet. But < 20kmph in and out of foot traffic, or properly shared slower roads, then I wouldn't worry about it.
    • ihaveajob 5y ago
      I am somewhat similar. The irony is that when you're riding next to traffic, a helmet offers little protection against being hit by a car. The biggest gains are solo crashes against the asphalt, with no cars involved. So if I'm riding a city bike for fun or chores, I may not wear a helmet (especially a shared bike). But if I'm riding the hills for sport, helmet on every time.
      • teachrdan 5y ago
        Anecdote incoming: I was hit by a car while bicycling home one night about ten years ago. I was knocked over and broke my collarbone in two places. I remember thinking at the hospital, "It's amazing I didn't hit my head. A broken clavicle really isn't that bad." (it's basically nature's crumple zone) Only a couple days later did I think to check my helmet. It had a huge crack on the outside and two smaller ones on the inside. I absolutely smashed my head on the pavement. That helmet saved me from serious head trauma, if not worse. From a random stranger on the internet: Please wear your helmet while bicycling. There are many ways to end up hitting your head after a bike crash, and all of them are bad.
• GordonS 5y ago
  Reminds me playing rugby at high school... one time I dived to catch the ball, and went head-first into an (unpadded) goal post, knocking myself out cold :( What an absolute eejit! I played casually off an on for a few years, and that was the only head injury I ever received.
• forgotmypw17 5y ago
  The whiplash from getting tackled in the shoulder is enough to cause a concussion itself.
  • hirvi74 5y ago
    Whiplash and concussion have near identical symptoms too. It's very very difficult to tell them apart.
• dfsegoat 5y ago
  Played rugby (college and usa d1 mens club) and American football in highschool. I've never felt like I got my bell rung (severe impact) as much as I did in American football. That said, I do feel like between the drinking culture of rugby, and the small impacts of tackling and going to ground, I certainly did some damage.
• snapetom 5y ago
  About three or four years ago, college football formally implemented a targeting (helmet to helmet contact) rule that had immediate impact on the way tackling is taught in college and high school. Players are now taught to tackle shoulder first in certain situations or go for the legs in others. Pros have a looser, inconsistently applied, personal foul rule, but we're starting to see the techniques taught at lower levels in the pros. Mind you, it's still an incredibly violent game, who knows if the new measures will make a difference, and we'll probably see shorter careers due to leg injuries.
• jl6 5y ago
  The idea that armor increases injury risk is a fascinating case study of unintended consequences. Similar “safety irony” claims I’ve heard include: * Mandatory bike helmet laws increase total risk to life because having to wear a helmet deters people from cycling so they drive instead, and thus miss out on the increased cardio health they would have got from cycling. * Trains are too safe, meaning they have to meet such stringent safety criteria that the costs are raised to the point that people drive instead, and driving is much more dangerous. And my favorite personal anecdote: a ruined castle in Portugal which had a staircase leading up to a high ledge with no barrier. It was so obviously dangerous that everyone was taking a lot of care up there…
  • fsckboy 5y ago
    as I recall, when ABS braking in cars was introduced, it did not seem to reduce accidents or injuries, and the idea was floated that people have an innate sense of risk and they'll take more risks if they feel safe. (I'm not defending this idea, just reporting what I remember)
  • ctchocula 5y ago
    Statisticians pointed out that the number of people chose to drive long distance trips rather than fly due to fear of flying in the aftermath of 9/11 and deaths caused by the increase in driving outnumbered the number of deaths caused directly by 9/11.
  • eggy 5y ago
    To expound on your bike helmet comment, growing up in the 70s skating, skateboarding, and biking, we didn't have protective gear. We quickly learned to fall and roll to prevent broken bones. I was rollerblading in NYC streets and Central Park in the dance circle in the early 90s, and watching beginners with protective wrist guards, helmets, elbow pads, and knee pads fall again and again was telling. They relied on their wrist guards and other equipment to prevent injury without learning how to fall. I have friends who take spills at high speed on skateboards, and roll and stand up without more than a few scuffs. I saw people with pads still break their thumbs and sprain their wrists. Sometimes you need a bit of both skill and protective gear, otherwise, you are an accident waiting to happen.
• deleted 5y ago
  [deleted]
• elliottkember 5y ago
  Football is an impact sport, rugby is a contact sport
• nsonha 5y ago
  > hit your head intentionally wow I know the sport is infamous for this but intentionally? How is that neccessary?
• poulsbohemian 5y ago
  > I was surprised at how much you don't hit your head intentionally like you do in American football. Maybe it's because I grew up in the Pacific Northwest, but even 25+ years ago when I was a young guy playing football, we were using what is now identified as the "Seahawks" method, which deliberately protects the head of the tackler. It's what my son is taught now playing ball as well. It still dumbfounds me that others were taught to use their head as a weapon.