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I've started thinking that at some point society will be forced to make lying a crime. Tell something untrue that is not clearly labeled as fiction or satire a

by api 5y ago

I've started thinking that at some point society will be forced to make lying a crime. Tell something untrue that is not clearly labeled as fiction or satire and be fined or even charged with a misdemeanor or felony in certain circumstances such as influencing elections. The reason is similar to why large scale wars must be effectively outlawed in the nuclear age. Before then wars were fought with weapons that while deadly to the soldiers did not present an existential threat to the rest of humanity. Today's microtargeting, viral social media, and AI-driven text generation are to lying and con artistry what the H-bomb was to warfare. It is now possible to construct deception weapons of mass destruction that have the capacity to obliterate rational discourse across entire swaths of society. I truly think that a sufficiently determined and clever attacker could at this point destroy civilization through expertly crafted propaganda augmented by big data and AI. Of course a huge number of our politicians, pundits, news anchors, and PR flaks would be in prison. Maybe that would be a good thing.

snarf21 5y ago
Who gets to decide what is a lie? Which is the lie: "Biden won" or "Trump won"? Depends on who is in charge, depends on who gets to decide what "proof" is, depends on who controls the "news" (there is no such thing as news anymore, it is all infotainment click-bait nonsense)
- api 5y ago
  "The Earth is flat" is not true. If you think the Earth is flat you are wrong. If you tell people the Earth is flat you are lying. I don't like the idea of regulating speech this way, but I am starting to wonder if there's an alternative. I hope I'm wrong, but right now it seems like the emergence of information age digital propaganda has altered the balance of power in some fundamental way. I am deeply concerned about the continued existence of societies that are both free and open. I get the sense that we will be forced to either give up a lot of freedom to restrict speech and discourse or give up all our freedom when unrestricted speech and discourse is exploited by a populist totalitarian to take power. Of course one of the things this new totalitarian regime would do immediately is shut down the systems of free and open discourse they exploited to gain power to make sure nobody else can repeat the same trick.
  - snarf21 5y ago
    So is climate change real? Depending on the administration, you will get a different answer. My point is that if you start making it illegal to tell a lie, you may find yourself having to break the law or "tell the truth". In my opinion, the bigger issue is that it is extremely profitable to amplify lies. As long as selling (faux?) outrage keeps the ads flowing, platforms are incentivized to amplify lies and push click-bait. Instead of of trying to outlaw lying, I'd prefer to tax digital advertising to try to make lying less profitable.

by api 5y ago

snarf21 5y ago

Who gets to decide what is a lie? Which is the lie: "Biden won" or "Trump won"? Depends on who is in charge, depends on who gets to decide what "proof" is, depends on who controls the "news" (there is no such thing as news anymore, it is all infotainment click-bait nonsense)

api 5y ago
"The Earth is flat" is not true. If you think the Earth is flat you are wrong. If you tell people the Earth is flat you are lying. I don't like the idea of regulating speech this way, but I am starting to wonder if there's an alternative. I hope I'm wrong, but right now it seems like the emergence of information age digital propaganda has altered the balance of power in some fundamental way. I am deeply concerned about the continued existence of societies that are both free and open. I get the sense that we will be forced to either give up a lot of freedom to restrict speech and discourse or give up all our freedom when unrestricted speech and discourse is exploited by a populist totalitarian to take power. Of course one of the things this new totalitarian regime would do immediately is shut down the systems of free and open discourse they exploited to gain power to make sure nobody else can repeat the same trick.
- snarf21 5y ago
  So is climate change real? Depending on the administration, you will get a different answer. My point is that if you start making it illegal to tell a lie, you may find yourself having to break the law or "tell the truth". In my opinion, the bigger issue is that it is extremely profitable to amplify lies. As long as selling (faux?) outrage keeps the ads flowing, platforms are incentivized to amplify lies and push click-bait. Instead of of trying to outlaw lying, I'd prefer to tax digital advertising to try to make lying less profitable.