9 ms·

Hopefully the police get a fine and licence temporarily revoked just like a civilian would have.

by umvi 5y ago

java-man 5y ago
The fine will be paid by the taxpayers and nothing will change.
anonymousiam 5y ago
I'm pretty sure that if a civilian was operating a drone in restricted airspace and a collision almost took out an aircraft, it would incur more than a fine and temporary license suspension. Just look at all of the folks being prosecuted for pointing a laser the wrong way in the sky. http://jdasolutions.aero/blog/aiming-lasers-at-aircraft/ http://jdasolutions.aero/blog/aiming-lasers-at-aircraft/
- ansible 5y ago
  > ... pointing a laser the wrong way ... I don't see how the two situations compare. If you are shining a laser light towards an aircraft, you are deliberately trying to inflict harm upon the pilot, and could easily cause an accident. The police drone pilot screwed up, badly, and was possibly criminally negligent, but wasn't intending to down a plane, though that could easily have been the result.
  - Teever 5y ago
    A lot of people who point lasers at planes don't understand how dangerous their actions are. I expect the people that we give guns/drones to for the purpose of enforcing laws to understand the laws they're enforcing and the consequences of their actions.
    - brokenmachine 5y ago
      Personally I'm unconvinced by the danger posed by handheld lasers to an aircraft. A group of people all pointing high-powered ones into the eyes of a pilot as it's landing, yes that's dangerous. But a single person, it'd be pretty difficult to keep it on target long enough to have real effect. Most of the time I'd say it's just kids pointing up into the sky and maybe hitting the underside of a plane for a split-second, it's not the end of the world. Lets not act like they're shooting heat-seeking missiles. Yes, it's not the right thing to do and shouldn't be happening, but let's not blow the risk out of all proportion. Of course I do understand why such behavior needs to be illegal, because otherwise whole neighborhoods could band together to distract pilots and bring down aircraft. But by the same token we don't need to send in the SWAT team for a teenager with a laser pointer. Cue all the keyboard warrior pilots telling me how a 747 will instantly fall out of the sky if touched for a millisecond by a handheld AA-powered laser. edit: actually just the downvotes, whatever.
      - NickNameNick 5y ago
        It's worth looking at some video of what a laser strike looks like from the cockpit. eg: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Eoj3H7LMy2k https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Eoj3H7LMy2k And because this happens at night, the pilot looses their dark adaptation - they will have difficulty seeing for a minute or longer after each flash. So, no, the airplane won't instantly roll over dive into the nearest building. But it is still quite dangerous.
        brokenmachine 5y ago
        I note that in that video, the first footage there is a plane on the runway with someone shining the laser from maybe 30m away. Not a moving plane in flight. And it doesn't speak to the quality of the reporting when it shows the alarmist message "THIS FOOTAGE SHOWS A LASER ATTACK ON A PASSENGER PLANE", combined with footage that is clearly not from a plane but a helicopter. In my younger, stupider days I've played with laser pointers with my young, stupid friends, trying to shine them into each others eyes from across a park. It's really not that bad because you can't hold it steady enough and in a moving aircraft from a large distance would be a non-event. A helicopter would be more vulnerable however, and as I said a group of people all ARMED with laser WEAPONS to ATTACK. Yes, people who shine at planes are doing the wrong thing, but it's not bad enough to warrant alarmist all-caps warning messages and pretending it's anywhere near as much threat as physical impacts with drones, drunk/sleepy pilots, crappy maintenance or plane UI (lol, I watch Air Crash Investigations TV show), or anything else.
        Teever 5y ago
        > In my younger, stupider days I've played with laser pointers with my young, stupid friends, trying to shine them into each others eyes from across a park. I'm assuming that these were 1w red laser pointers? Have you ever played with those new 5w and 10w green lasers? They're a whole other ballpark. One of the big issues is that while a red light doesn't affect your night vision a green laser will.
        5y ago
  - sokoloff 5y ago
    > you are deliberately trying to inflict harm upon the pilot I suspect most people who shine lasers at aircraft are just being stupid and don’t intend to inflict harm on the pilot. I’ve been hit by a green laser in a high-wing. At 3000’, the beam is wide enough that it lights up a substantial fraction of a wing, (quite brightly at night). I suspect that looks pretty entertaining to the laser wielder on the ground. I turned off my position lights, reported their location to ATC, and hope they’re caught, but I think it’s way more likely that they were being a bored butthead (probably a group thereof) than them actually trying to hurt me.
- spywaregorilla 5y ago
  These people tend to be intentionally aiming their lasers at planes, which is quite different from "point a laser the wrong way in the sky" which implies accidental. The headline example on your page also got a year of probation from a fairly understanding judge it seems.
- garyfirestorm 5y ago
  look at the headline 'Plane damaged after being hit by York police drone at Buttonville Airport' if it were a civilian I am sure it would be 'Major disaster - as civilian drone crashes into a plane - potential suspects at large'
- djrogers 5y ago
  > Just look at all of the folks being prosecuted for pointing a laser the wrong way in the sky. That really smacks of being intentionally obtuse. If I said “look at all the people prosecuted for pointing their guns the wrong way when discharging them” you wouldn’t buy it…
JTbane 5y ago
A civilian would be criminally charged for this. The police will likely get a slap on the wrist, or a token fine.
hellbannedguy 5y ago
It's weird how my perception of cops have changed. Actually that's a lie. I lost respect for the profession in high school. That said, my immediate thought is they (cops) were fooling around with their new toy. I guess my view would change if they lightened up on Revenue Collection, and solely zoned in on real crime? And what is real crime? I guess murders, white collar crime, organized gangs. It's not drugs.
- alistairSH 5y ago
  This wasn't a toy drone like a DJI Mavic or similar. Assuming they haven't changed hardware, it cost ~$125,000, takes a team of two to operate, and weighs 2.4kg (5.2lbs).[1] This is the damage done to the airplane.[2] It will require body work and an engine tear-down (prop struck the drone). If the drone had been a bit higher, it could have done major damage to the prop or worse the windscreen and possibly pilot. 1 - https://www.toronto.com/news-story/5728426-york-regional-police-second-municipal-force-in-ontario-to-operate-aerial-drone/ https://www.toronto.com/news-story/5728426-york-regional-pol... 2 - https://s30121.pcdn.co/wp-content/uploads/2021/08/plane-hit-by-drone-aug-20.jpg https://s30121.pcdn.co/wp-content/uploads/2021/08/plane-hit-...
  - bastawhiz 5y ago
    That doesn't mean the officers operating it weren't treating it like a toy. Hopefully the investigation is exhaustive and objective.
- ashtonkem 5y ago
  It’s worth pointing out that “real crime” is a social construct. Petty crime is a prosecuted, despite being dwarfed by wage theft. Shooting someone is a crime, obviously, but purposefully starving thousands of infants to boost Nestle stock values is not. What you or I think of being the “real crime” that cops should focus on may or may not be what the laws define as real crime, which itself probably doesn’t map to what cops spend all their time doing
  - epicureanideal 5y ago
chrisseaton 5y ago
> Hopefully the police get a fine The police don't get fined - the taxpayer does.
- tailius 5y ago
  Police either need public service liability insurance rather than qualified immunity so long as that doesn't affect public safety risk-taking for life saving, or the chain-of-command needs to hold officers to exceptionally high standards of conduct and professionalism.
vanattab 5y ago
I am pretty sure if a plane is actually struck by your drone near an airfield your going to get more then a fine and license revoked your going to jail.
- tailius 5y ago
  All animals are equal but...
deleted 5y ago
[deleted]
justinclift 5y ago
... or at least pay for the plane repairs and whatever other expenses arise from it.

Hopefully the police get a fine and licence temporarily revoked just like a civilian would have.

by umvi 5y ago

Hopefully the police get a fine and licence temporarily revoked just like a civilian would have.

java-man 5y ago

The fine will be paid by the taxpayers and nothing will change.

anonymousiam 5y ago

I'm pretty sure that if a civilian was operating a drone in restricted airspace and a collision almost took out an aircraft, it would incur more than a fine and temporary license suspension. Just look at all of the folks being prosecuted for pointing a laser the wrong way in the sky. http://jdasolutions.aero/blog/aiming-lasers-at-aircraft/ http://jdasolutions.aero/blog/aiming-lasers-at-aircraft/

ansible 5y ago
> ... pointing a laser the wrong way ... I don't see how the two situations compare. If you are shining a laser light towards an aircraft, you are deliberately trying to inflict harm upon the pilot, and could easily cause an accident. The police drone pilot screwed up, badly, and was possibly criminally negligent, but wasn't intending to down a plane, though that could easily have been the result.
- Teever 5y ago
  A lot of people who point lasers at planes don't understand how dangerous their actions are. I expect the people that we give guns/drones to for the purpose of enforcing laws to understand the laws they're enforcing and the consequences of their actions.
  - brokenmachine 5y ago
    Personally I'm unconvinced by the danger posed by handheld lasers to an aircraft. A group of people all pointing high-powered ones into the eyes of a pilot as it's landing, yes that's dangerous. But a single person, it'd be pretty difficult to keep it on target long enough to have real effect. Most of the time I'd say it's just kids pointing up into the sky and maybe hitting the underside of a plane for a split-second, it's not the end of the world. Lets not act like they're shooting heat-seeking missiles. Yes, it's not the right thing to do and shouldn't be happening, but let's not blow the risk out of all proportion. Of course I do understand why such behavior needs to be illegal, because otherwise whole neighborhoods could band together to distract pilots and bring down aircraft. But by the same token we don't need to send in the SWAT team for a teenager with a laser pointer. Cue all the keyboard warrior pilots telling me how a 747 will instantly fall out of the sky if touched for a millisecond by a handheld AA-powered laser. edit: actually just the downvotes, whatever.
    - NickNameNick 5y ago
      It's worth looking at some video of what a laser strike looks like from the cockpit. eg: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Eoj3H7LMy2k https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Eoj3H7LMy2k And because this happens at night, the pilot looses their dark adaptation - they will have difficulty seeing for a minute or longer after each flash. So, no, the airplane won't instantly roll over dive into the nearest building. But it is still quite dangerous.
      - brokenmachine 5y ago
        I note that in that video, the first footage there is a plane on the runway with someone shining the laser from maybe 30m away. Not a moving plane in flight. And it doesn't speak to the quality of the reporting when it shows the alarmist message "THIS FOOTAGE SHOWS A LASER ATTACK ON A PASSENGER PLANE", combined with footage that is clearly not from a plane but a helicopter. In my younger, stupider days I've played with laser pointers with my young, stupid friends, trying to shine them into each others eyes from across a park. It's really not that bad because you can't hold it steady enough and in a moving aircraft from a large distance would be a non-event. A helicopter would be more vulnerable however, and as I said a group of people all ARMED with laser WEAPONS to ATTACK. Yes, people who shine at planes are doing the wrong thing, but it's not bad enough to warrant alarmist all-caps warning messages and pretending it's anywhere near as much threat as physical impacts with drones, drunk/sleepy pilots, crappy maintenance or plane UI (lol, I watch Air Crash Investigations TV show), or anything else.
        Teever 5y ago
        > In my younger, stupider days I've played with laser pointers with my young, stupid friends, trying to shine them into each others eyes from across a park. I'm assuming that these were 1w red laser pointers? Have you ever played with those new 5w and 10w green lasers? They're a whole other ballpark. One of the big issues is that while a red light doesn't affect your night vision a green laser will.
        5y ago
- sokoloff 5y ago
  > you are deliberately trying to inflict harm upon the pilot I suspect most people who shine lasers at aircraft are just being stupid and don’t intend to inflict harm on the pilot. I’ve been hit by a green laser in a high-wing. At 3000’, the beam is wide enough that it lights up a substantial fraction of a wing, (quite brightly at night). I suspect that looks pretty entertaining to the laser wielder on the ground. I turned off my position lights, reported their location to ATC, and hope they’re caught, but I think it’s way more likely that they were being a bored butthead (probably a group thereof) than them actually trying to hurt me.
spywaregorilla 5y ago
These people tend to be intentionally aiming their lasers at planes, which is quite different from "point a laser the wrong way in the sky" which implies accidental. The headline example on your page also got a year of probation from a fairly understanding judge it seems.
garyfirestorm 5y ago
look at the headline 'Plane damaged after being hit by York police drone at Buttonville Airport' if it were a civilian I am sure it would be 'Major disaster - as civilian drone crashes into a plane - potential suspects at large'
djrogers 5y ago
> Just look at all of the folks being prosecuted for pointing a laser the wrong way in the sky. That really smacks of being intentionally obtuse. If I said “look at all the people prosecuted for pointing their guns the wrong way when discharging them” you wouldn’t buy it…

JTbane 5y ago

A civilian would be criminally charged for this. The police will likely get a slap on the wrist, or a token fine.

hellbannedguy 5y ago

It's weird how my perception of cops have changed. Actually that's a lie. I lost respect for the profession in high school. That said, my immediate thought is they (cops) were fooling around with their new toy. I guess my view would change if they lightened up on Revenue Collection, and solely zoned in on real crime? And what is real crime? I guess murders, white collar crime, organized gangs. It's not drugs.

alistairSH 5y ago
This wasn't a toy drone like a DJI Mavic or similar. Assuming they haven't changed hardware, it cost ~$125,000, takes a team of two to operate, and weighs 2.4kg (5.2lbs).[1] This is the damage done to the airplane.[2] It will require body work and an engine tear-down (prop struck the drone). If the drone had been a bit higher, it could have done major damage to the prop or worse the windscreen and possibly pilot. 1 - https://www.toronto.com/news-story/5728426-york-regional-police-second-municipal-force-in-ontario-to-operate-aerial-drone/ https://www.toronto.com/news-story/5728426-york-regional-pol... 2 - https://s30121.pcdn.co/wp-content/uploads/2021/08/plane-hit-by-drone-aug-20.jpg https://s30121.pcdn.co/wp-content/uploads/2021/08/plane-hit-...
- bastawhiz 5y ago
  That doesn't mean the officers operating it weren't treating it like a toy. Hopefully the investigation is exhaustive and objective.
ashtonkem 5y ago
It’s worth pointing out that “real crime” is a social construct. Petty crime is a prosecuted, despite being dwarfed by wage theft. Shooting someone is a crime, obviously, but purposefully starving thousands of infants to boost Nestle stock values is not. What you or I think of being the “real crime” that cops should focus on may or may not be what the laws define as real crime, which itself probably doesn’t map to what cops spend all their time doing
- epicureanideal 5y ago

chrisseaton 5y ago

> Hopefully the police get a fine The police don't get fined - the taxpayer does.

tailius 5y ago
Police either need public service liability insurance rather than qualified immunity so long as that doesn't affect public safety risk-taking for life saving, or the chain-of-command needs to hold officers to exceptionally high standards of conduct and professionalism.

vanattab 5y ago

I am pretty sure if a plane is actually struck by your drone near an airfield your going to get more then a fine and license revoked your going to jail.

tailius 5y ago
All animals are equal but...

deleted 5y ago

[deleted]

justinclift 5y ago

... or at least pay for the plane repairs and whatever other expenses arise from it.