4 ms·

> It's it though? Yes. Your phone is your private property, just like your house or your car. Searching your private property requires a warrant or reasonable

> It's it though? Yes. Your phone is your private property, just like your house or your car. Searching your private property requires a warrant or reasonable suspicion, otherwise it's a 4th Amendment violation. This twitter thread is worth a read. https://twitter.com/pwnallthethings/status/1424873629003702273 https://twitter.com/pwnallthethings/status/14248736290037022...

Alupis 5y ago
So, what does a person do if they do not consent to this search? Tough? You can't realistically avoid the iOS update. Apple has effectively given consent on your behalf... How will that fly?
- simondotau 5y ago
  If you do not consent to having your photos scanned for CSAM, turn off iCloud Photo Library. Same as how you opt out of CSAM scanning of your photo library on Android. If you're concerned about other forms of scanning compelled by the Government, you never consented to the search. So even if Apple complied, the search is invalid and cannot be used to prosecute you.
  - Alupis 5y ago
    It does not appear one can opt out certain folders from this scan. If you enable iCloud backups, it's scans the entire shebang. As previously mentioned, Android doesn't scan all photos on your device... Google scans content uploaded to their servers. Which is reasonable... It's their servers, they can host what they want. Your iPhone is your iPhone.
    - simondotau 5y ago
      > If you enable iCloud backups, it's scans the entire shebang. Citation?
      - Alupis 5y ago
        Do I need one? Where in iOS can you choose which folders to opt-into CSAM scanning? I only see an all-or-nothing option for iCloud photos.
        simondotau 5y ago
        Yes, you do need a citation, because I've not heard Apple (or anyone else) claim that iCloud Backups or iCloud Drive are being subject to CSAM scans. From everything I've read, from Apple and other sources, if the photo is about to be uploaded to iCloud Photo Library then it is scanned for CSAM. If it's not, it isn't.
        Alupis 5y ago
        How does one choose individual photos to not upload?
        simondotau 5y ago
        You store the photos you want to keep private in another app. I'm sure there are lots in the App Store. Still waiting on that citation.
        Alupis 5y ago
        If the default behavior is not to exclude photo rolls from this new feature, I'm not sure where the argument exists. Telling iOS users they should download some app to keep photos private is absurd.
        simondotau 5y ago
        If a photo is about to be uploaded to iCloud Photo Library then it is scanned for CSAM. If it's not, it isn't. Still waiting on that citation.
        5y ago
  - torstenvl 5y ago
    > If you're concerned about other forms of scanning, you didn't consent—so even if Apple complied, the search is invalid and cannot be used to prosecute you. This is a dangerously false understanding of the law. Stop giving legal advice. You are not a lawyer.
    - simondotau 5y ago
      Are you saying that if the US Government compelled Apple to scans millions of citizen's private property for non-CSAM images, this would not be a clear-cut violation of the Fourth Amendment? I'm curious, do you think that the Third Party Doctrine applies here?
      - Alupis 5y ago
        I think the realistic danger here is the US Government no longer needs to compel this type of activity. Reference Twitter and Facebook/Instagram voluntarily censorship per mere suggestion of the current administration/power party.
        simondotau 5y ago
        Let's be practical for a minute. What specific image would Apple voluntarily search for on behalf of the US Government? I sincerely can't think of anything.
        Alupis 5y ago
        Images, leaked government files, anti-administration phrases, unflattering memes of the president, statements that contradict the government's current stance, etc. All things current at social media companies seem willing to censor after suggestion of the administration.
        simondotau 5y ago
        You seriously think Apple would voluntarily search private devices for images which aren't illegal and don't even hint at any action which is illegal? I don't think you're being serious.
copperx 5y ago
The 4th amendment only protects you from the government searching your property. Otherwise, the Microsoft telemetry which reports back to Microsoft what software you have installed and what apps you are running would be illegal.

Alupis 5y ago

So, what does a person do if they do not consent to this search? Tough? You can't realistically avoid the iOS update. Apple has effectively given consent on your behalf... How will that fly?

simondotau 5y ago
If you do not consent to having your photos scanned for CSAM, turn off iCloud Photo Library. Same as how you opt out of CSAM scanning of your photo library on Android. If you're concerned about other forms of scanning compelled by the Government, you never consented to the search. So even if Apple complied, the search is invalid and cannot be used to prosecute you.
- Alupis 5y ago
  It does not appear one can opt out certain folders from this scan. If you enable iCloud backups, it's scans the entire shebang. As previously mentioned, Android doesn't scan all photos on your device... Google scans content uploaded to their servers. Which is reasonable... It's their servers, they can host what they want. Your iPhone is your iPhone.
  - simondotau 5y ago
    > If you enable iCloud backups, it's scans the entire shebang. Citation?
    - Alupis 5y ago
      Do I need one? Where in iOS can you choose which folders to opt-into CSAM scanning? I only see an all-or-nothing option for iCloud photos.
      - simondotau 5y ago
        Yes, you do need a citation, because I've not heard Apple (or anyone else) claim that iCloud Backups or iCloud Drive are being subject to CSAM scans. From everything I've read, from Apple and other sources, if the photo is about to be uploaded to iCloud Photo Library then it is scanned for CSAM. If it's not, it isn't.
        Alupis 5y ago
        How does one choose individual photos to not upload?
        simondotau 5y ago
        You store the photos you want to keep private in another app. I'm sure there are lots in the App Store. Still waiting on that citation.
        Alupis 5y ago
        If the default behavior is not to exclude photo rolls from this new feature, I'm not sure where the argument exists. Telling iOS users they should download some app to keep photos private is absurd.
        simondotau 5y ago
        If a photo is about to be uploaded to iCloud Photo Library then it is scanned for CSAM. If it's not, it isn't. Still waiting on that citation.
        5y ago
- torstenvl 5y ago
  > If you're concerned about other forms of scanning, you didn't consent—so even if Apple complied, the search is invalid and cannot be used to prosecute you. This is a dangerously false understanding of the law. Stop giving legal advice. You are not a lawyer.
  - simondotau 5y ago
    Are you saying that if the US Government compelled Apple to scans millions of citizen's private property for non-CSAM images, this would not be a clear-cut violation of the Fourth Amendment? I'm curious, do you think that the Third Party Doctrine applies here?
    - Alupis 5y ago
      I think the realistic danger here is the US Government no longer needs to compel this type of activity. Reference Twitter and Facebook/Instagram voluntarily censorship per mere suggestion of the current administration/power party.
      - simondotau 5y ago
        Let's be practical for a minute. What specific image would Apple voluntarily search for on behalf of the US Government? I sincerely can't think of anything.
        Alupis 5y ago
        Images, leaked government files, anti-administration phrases, unflattering memes of the president, statements that contradict the government's current stance, etc. All things current at social media companies seem willing to censor after suggestion of the administration.
        simondotau 5y ago
        You seriously think Apple would voluntarily search private devices for images which aren't illegal and don't even hint at any action which is illegal? I don't think you're being serious.

copperx 5y ago

The 4th amendment only protects you from the government searching your property. Otherwise, the Microsoft telemetry which reports back to Microsoft what software you have installed and what apps you are running would be illegal.