4 ms·

When Zoom first came onto the scene, the other technologies you've listed had more friction than coarse grained sandpaper. Zoom was the very first to let people

When Zoom first came onto the scene, the other technologies you've listed had more friction than coarse grained sandpaper. Zoom was the very first to let people join meetings without a) signing up; and b) downloading anything. I don't know about all the solutions you've listed, but Google Meet for example still requires an account whereas Zoom still does not. As more and more people use Zoom, the friction of using it decreases as well, since you can more safely assume that people have used it before and are familiar with it - if not, they can still use it without making an account, and without downloading anything (though this has become a bit harder now). Furthermore, Zoom was also one of the first solutions to let you simply call in with your phone (and put that option front and center), which also does not require accounts or any downloads. There are probably many other things I'm glossing over here - UX is a holistic phenomenon after all, and requires many small things to feel right. I'm not sure whether you're arguing that Zoom did not have 10x better UX than anything out there when it launched, but if you are, I can't help but think you're being willfully ignorant.

acdha 5y ago
> Zoom was the very first to let people join meetings without a) signing up; and b) downloading anything I find your second part interesting because for years Zoom has tried to force you to download their client — you have to learn how to construct the web URL to generate links to use it in a browser since they removed the option from their web UI. > I'm not sure whether you're arguing that Zoom did not have 10x better UX than anything out there when it launched, but if you are, I can't help but think you're being willfully ignorant. I'm not sure why you're inclined to take such an uncharitable view but I'm coming at it from the perspective of someone who was relatively late to using Zoom (2020) and found it pretty similar to the competition. I used Skype, WebEx, Teams, Hangouts/Meet, and Chime professionally first and Facetime / Hangouts personally prior to that and the only one I'd say is 10x worse is Skype.
- nieve 5y ago
  Re: join via web, in my experience if you reject the download a few times it'll pop up the link. Clearly a dark pattern attempting to force you to install their insecure and frankly kind of crappy software, but apparently one they're aware of problems with. They just don't care.
- pmontra 5y ago
  I used Zoom yesterday after months and I had to download the client. I was in hurry because a customer sent me a link so I didn't investigate much. They usually make calls on Slack which works well and already has all of their conversations. WebEx used to be a nightmare with a Java client. Maybe it's better now but I didn't use it for years on a computer. I had an Android tablet with the WebEx app and I used that. Luckily no customer of mine is using WebEx anymore. I never used Chime and never heard about it until now. Skype doesn't have URLs AFAIK. I used it with a small group of friends during lockdowns because it was the intersection of what all of them had. We rejoined the same call every time. It works well once started. Cumbersome to start. Meet has the least friction: create a call, send a URL, click/tap to join. I don't remember if a Google account is required but everybody has one in this part of the world because of Android. It works well. Teams has a mandatory download AFAIK, I got a customer that uses it. It works well once started. I have no idea if I can start a call without an Office 365 account. I remember that it asks me to login to that customer's Office. FaceTime, never used because it's an Apple only thing. I don't have the hardware. Duo, I think it improved since its launch but despite being in the phones everybody uses here, everybody makes call with WhatsApp. I think Google lost the network effect battle. WhatsApp is the easiest to start a call with but no URLs, no calls on the desktop. The quality is not very good, maybe because people can have poor connections on their phones (mobile data or crowded WiFi channels.) Telegram added group calls recently but I never used them. Network effects again and at least 10 times less market penetration. One to one calls where on par with WhatsApp.
  - tentacleuno 5y ago
    > Teams has a mandatory download AFAIK, I got a customer that uses it. It works well once started. I have no idea if I can start a call without an Office 365 account. I remember that it asks me to login to that customer's Office. I've had to use Teams in an educational environment for around two years, and thankfully it's never forced me into downloading their (frankly dodgy[0]) desktop client. It's always required a login to O365 for me. They try and manipulate you into using the app with their constant "Get the app" splash screens, though.
rrdharan 5y ago
Google Meet does not require an account to join a meeting. https://support.google.com/meet/answer/9303069 https://support.google.com/meet/answer/9303069
- vitus 5y ago
  Um, it does...? Under "Personal account users": "Anyone who isn’t signed into a Google account can’t join your meetings." This is a feature, not a bug: https://workspaceupdates.googleblog.com/2020/07/anonymous-users-will-be-blocked-from.html https://workspaceupdates.googleblog.com/2020/07/anonymous-us... Although: "Note, this does not prevent users from dialing in by phone."
  - rrdharan 5y ago
    That’s specific to the education SKU and is to prevent zoom-bombing… and an admin can disable it.
ethelward 5y ago
> Zoom was the very first to let people join meetings without a) signing up; and b) downloading anything E.g. BigBlueButton and Jitsi were doing it for much longer.
- Krasnol 5y ago
  Which is irrelevant because those who knew about those are not the significant majority which is responsible for the success of zoom
  - cycomanic 5y ago
    So the point is not that zoom was better UX wise, but simply had better marketing, or not?
    - nwienert 5y ago
      Both. Honestly - there's huge, massive room for better UX that would really revolutionize online communication: - Presence indicator/avatar in your toolbar of close contacts or team - Push-to-talk to send audio to anyone from toolbar with non-disruptive indicator - Instant screen/mouse share from there with audio and floating video optional - Just so many fluidity improvements if you do a more minimal video window that can add/remove people without friction I really wish someone would build it.
      - bashinator 5y ago
        "Hey Bot, find out from Alice when I need to have those slides finished. Kind of urgent." It immediately sends an email and a slack message. An hour later, it asks if you want to send an SMS or call to Alice.
    - skinnymuch 5y ago
      Jitsi was awful. So it’s a combo. Zoom wouldn’t be where it is if it was Jitsi. I used Jitsi from 2018-2020. So many problems with it. You won’t find anywhere close to the polarizing views of the actual usability or Jitsi compared to Zoom or any other better app in any niche.
Beldin 5y ago
Pre-pandemic, I used both Bluejeans and (Blackboard.com's) Collaborate Ultra. Bluejeans already let you use your phone years before. Neither required an account for anyone but meeting organiser. Collaborate Ultra doesn't even have a native app (as far as I know), it only has a web app. I have no idea why so many folks like Zoom; I find it to be less useful than either. E.g. using external monitor with different resolution is handled very poorly.

acdha 5y ago

> Zoom was the very first to let people join meetings without a) signing up; and b) downloading anything I find your second part interesting because for years Zoom has tried to force you to download their client — you have to learn how to construct the web URL to generate links to use it in a browser since they removed the option from their web UI. > I'm not sure whether you're arguing that Zoom did not have 10x better UX than anything out there when it launched, but if you are, I can't help but think you're being willfully ignorant. I'm not sure why you're inclined to take such an uncharitable view but I'm coming at it from the perspective of someone who was relatively late to using Zoom (2020) and found it pretty similar to the competition. I used Skype, WebEx, Teams, Hangouts/Meet, and Chime professionally first and Facetime / Hangouts personally prior to that and the only one I'd say is 10x worse is Skype.

nieve 5y ago
Re: join via web, in my experience if you reject the download a few times it'll pop up the link. Clearly a dark pattern attempting to force you to install their insecure and frankly kind of crappy software, but apparently one they're aware of problems with. They just don't care.
pmontra 5y ago
I used Zoom yesterday after months and I had to download the client. I was in hurry because a customer sent me a link so I didn't investigate much. They usually make calls on Slack which works well and already has all of their conversations. WebEx used to be a nightmare with a Java client. Maybe it's better now but I didn't use it for years on a computer. I had an Android tablet with the WebEx app and I used that. Luckily no customer of mine is using WebEx anymore. I never used Chime and never heard about it until now. Skype doesn't have URLs AFAIK. I used it with a small group of friends during lockdowns because it was the intersection of what all of them had. We rejoined the same call every time. It works well once started. Cumbersome to start. Meet has the least friction: create a call, send a URL, click/tap to join. I don't remember if a Google account is required but everybody has one in this part of the world because of Android. It works well. Teams has a mandatory download AFAIK, I got a customer that uses it. It works well once started. I have no idea if I can start a call without an Office 365 account. I remember that it asks me to login to that customer's Office. FaceTime, never used because it's an Apple only thing. I don't have the hardware. Duo, I think it improved since its launch but despite being in the phones everybody uses here, everybody makes call with WhatsApp. I think Google lost the network effect battle. WhatsApp is the easiest to start a call with but no URLs, no calls on the desktop. The quality is not very good, maybe because people can have poor connections on their phones (mobile data or crowded WiFi channels.) Telegram added group calls recently but I never used them. Network effects again and at least 10 times less market penetration. One to one calls where on par with WhatsApp.
- tentacleuno 5y ago
  > Teams has a mandatory download AFAIK, I got a customer that uses it. It works well once started. I have no idea if I can start a call without an Office 365 account. I remember that it asks me to login to that customer's Office. I've had to use Teams in an educational environment for around two years, and thankfully it's never forced me into downloading their (frankly dodgy[0]) desktop client. It's always required a login to O365 for me. They try and manipulate you into using the app with their constant "Get the app" splash screens, though.

rrdharan 5y ago

Google Meet does not require an account to join a meeting. https://support.google.com/meet/answer/9303069 https://support.google.com/meet/answer/9303069

vitus 5y ago
Um, it does...? Under "Personal account users": "Anyone who isn’t signed into a Google account can’t join your meetings." This is a feature, not a bug: https://workspaceupdates.googleblog.com/2020/07/anonymous-users-will-be-blocked-from.html https://workspaceupdates.googleblog.com/2020/07/anonymous-us... Although: "Note, this does not prevent users from dialing in by phone."
- rrdharan 5y ago
  That’s specific to the education SKU and is to prevent zoom-bombing… and an admin can disable it.

ethelward 5y ago

> Zoom was the very first to let people join meetings without a) signing up; and b) downloading anything E.g. BigBlueButton and Jitsi were doing it for much longer.

Krasnol 5y ago
Which is irrelevant because those who knew about those are not the significant majority which is responsible for the success of zoom
- cycomanic 5y ago
  So the point is not that zoom was better UX wise, but simply had better marketing, or not?
  - nwienert 5y ago
    Both. Honestly - there's huge, massive room for better UX that would really revolutionize online communication: - Presence indicator/avatar in your toolbar of close contacts or team - Push-to-talk to send audio to anyone from toolbar with non-disruptive indicator - Instant screen/mouse share from there with audio and floating video optional - Just so many fluidity improvements if you do a more minimal video window that can add/remove people without friction I really wish someone would build it.
    - bashinator 5y ago
      "Hey Bot, find out from Alice when I need to have those slides finished. Kind of urgent." It immediately sends an email and a slack message. An hour later, it asks if you want to send an SMS or call to Alice.
  - skinnymuch 5y ago
    Jitsi was awful. So it’s a combo. Zoom wouldn’t be where it is if it was Jitsi. I used Jitsi from 2018-2020. So many problems with it. You won’t find anywhere close to the polarizing views of the actual usability or Jitsi compared to Zoom or any other better app in any niche.

Beldin 5y ago

Pre-pandemic, I used both Bluejeans and (Blackboard.com's) Collaborate Ultra. Bluejeans already let you use your phone years before. Neither required an account for anyone but meeting organiser. Collaborate Ultra doesn't even have a native app (as far as I know), it only has a web app. I have no idea why so many folks like Zoom; I find it to be less useful than either. E.g. using external monitor with different resolution is handled very poorly.