9 ms·

I can't wait to get back to the office. I don't have dedicated remote work space and that really eats into my productivity. Also being home and having no exter

I can't wait to get back to the office. I don't have dedicated remote work space and that really eats into my productivity. Also being home and having no external pressure to keep working I can already see any breaks people tend to take are way longer than what they would take at the office. (Now someone is going to tell me that this just shows that people need more breaks, but I don't believe that) It also helps with my physical fitness. Now it is super hard to go to the gym in the morning just to come back home. When I commuted to work the gym was just on the way and it was easy to get out of the bed and go work out. Food is also big draw. Now I have to worry about what I eat every day and make my food. That's extra stress and cognitive pressure that is completely avoided when I get to just eat lunch from office's cafeteria. And of course other social aspects i.e. since I am already outside it is easier to do other stuff, but when I'm still in my underpants at home after work it is way harder to dress up and go do stuff.

ceilingcorner 5y ago
Just rent an office space or coworking desk. Problem solved.
- dagw 5y ago
  Using a significant chunk of my own salary each month to pay for something I used to get for free (and that my employer should provide) hardly seems like the ideal solution.
  - ceilingcorner 5y ago
    I would rather pay a few hundred dollars for a private space and have control over my time/work hours, than be forced to physically commute to an office. Time > money. In my experience, most decent employers have a stipend for co-working anyway.
    - nextlevelwizard 5y ago
      But I already have control over my work hours. I don't have to work 9-5 as long as I work 37.5 hours a week. My commute is at worst 25 minutes with car (at best 15 minutes if no traffic). I can easily get up at 6 go workout for 1-1.5h then drive to work when the morning rush is gone.
  - nucleardog 5y ago
    I can get some co-working spaces that look infinitely better than the office I was going to for $480/mo. For a dedicated desk with locking storage, etc. I'm saving at least $400/mo just on parking and gas right now. Even if my employer wouldn't reimburse anything (never asked), I'd eat the $80/mo to save myself 2-3 hours a day commuting.
  - dv_dt 5y ago
    This is perhaps why many people look at the drive to lower the salary of people working from home with some suspicion. Wfh saves employers a lot of money in terms of providing office space. And in some concrete ways increases expenses of employees at home. (If gives back some commute costs as well as other freedoms too though). I think both employers and employees will take some time to sift though how the benefits/drawbacks rebalance from the changes that come from wfh.
  - cutthegrass2 5y ago
    depending upon where you are located and your method of commute, it's likely you're spending more per month commuting than you would on a local co-working space. This is the case for a large proportion of people in the South East of the UK.
  - fnomnom 5y ago
    let your company pay for it. they dont need the big office space. thats how we do it.
  - mjbeswick 5y ago
    It's about the same cost as commuting, so no difference!?
- midrus 5y ago
  Nah, better to force everyone to go back to the office so I get free food and I can look busy all day.
  - goldenkey 5y ago
    I can also play games while on the shitter for free! Once Gaben's steam deck comes out my steaming turd breaks will be even better! And don't get me started on the free 1-ply toilet paper. What a deal!
- nextlevelwizard 5y ago
  I mean it might be a temporary solution at best, but there aren't many places that rent less than a floor around me.
peakaboo 5y ago
> I can't wait to get back to the office. > I don't have dedicated remote work space and that really eats into my productivity. Also being home and having no external pressure to keep working I can already see any breaks people tend to take are way longer than what they would take at the office. (Now someone is going to tell me that this just shows that people need more breaks, but I don't believe that) > It also helps with my physical fitness. Now it is super hard to go to the gym in the morning just to come back home. When I commuted to work the gym was just on the way and it was easy to get out of the bed and go work out. > Food is also big draw. Now I have to worry about what I eat every day and make my food. That's extra stress and cognitive pressure that is completely avoided when I get to just eat lunch from office's cafeteria. > And of course other social aspects i.e. since I am already outside it is easier to do other stuff, but when I'm still in my underpants at home after work it is way harder to dress up and go do stuff. These are the typical reasons I see for going to the office and they all boils down to you not wanting to make your own food, not having the self discipline to work out at home, and getting started in the morning. I mean, it's fine, but I think it's helpful if we realize what going to the office is just making some people like yourself more comfortable, and others less comfortable. Because to me, that commute is killing me, and getting interrupted in the office is wiping out any energy I have at all to commit to working. At home I have food I selected myself to eat and I have a nice twin monitor setup with a comfortable chair and silence to focus. My workout routine is body weight exercises right before lunch, and I have time to relax and have a shower as well since there is no pressure.
- j7ake 5y ago
  Making own food that is the same quality as the hot foods at cafeteria is easily 1 hour a day extra. Not being around colleagues affects more than just self-discipline, you lose the random encounters with colleagues that often leads to new ideas and collaborations. These differences are real. And even if productivity is not affected, the new ideas that normally sparked from random interactions are diminished.
  - wreath 5y ago
    I dont even care about random encounters that lead to ideas, i miss them because they were random and had relationship at work with people with whom i have no work overlap whatsoever,yet we bonded while making coffee and other type of office routine activities. Now, i rarely recognize people on slack
atregir 5y ago
I have the opposite problem working from home: I take almost no breaks, sometimes it happened I even had lunch from my desk and worked longer hours than in the office. This sucked at first, until I realized I couldn't do this for long and started being more conscious about my working hours. In the office I feel I take so many breaks, short coffee chats, water cooler chats etc. I think what you say that "any breaks people take are way longer than in the office" is not extremely accurate.
midrus 5y ago
>Food is also big draw. Now I have to worry about what I eat every day and make my food LOL
- TeMPOraL 5y ago
  That does indeed sound like a trivial problem to solve. Pick a local restaurant and treat it as your new cafeteria. Come lunch time, go there. Ideally, your employer would compensate you for the office benefit you're missing (at least when talking about pandemic-induced forced WFH), but WFH is likely already saving you more money, so you can probably afford it anyway.
  - fabioborellini 5y ago
    It's not that trivial to have a one-hour lunch break if the local restaurant is 30 minutes away, near by the closed office. In some countries the suburbs have very few services. Also, if the subsidized commute costs 3 euros a day it is also not trivial to spend 14 euros for lunch.
    - midrus 5y ago
      Do we really need this baby sitting? Are we seriously complaining of working from home, not having to commute, and cooking our own food is a problem? In the age of groceries delivery from a click on my phone. I just can't believe it. World is going to hell and were like crying babies that can't prepare a meal by themselves.
  - jusssi 5y ago
    The available selection could be a problem. Near my home, there's a sushi place, two pizzerias, a Subway, a chinese and some cafes that don't really serve anything I'd call lunch. After 1½ years I'm sick of all of them. I've been ordering from further away, but that costs 50-100% more, and many types of food lose quality in transit. Compared to the 30+ places reachable by foot within 45min lunch break at the office (and having real people to talk with while eating), WHF has really destroyed my lunch breaks.
makeitdouble 5y ago
I am all in for WFH, but deeply agree with your points. Having a dedicated working space is not trivial; and it's not just isolating the space, there is all the "office management" part, having well fitted furnitures, lighting, drinks, noise management etc. Basically what was someone else's job is now each employee's responsibility. I'm fine with it, but it should be noted. Physical fitness was already in that realm I think, though we were forced to have at least some exercise to move to the office. My hardest impact on that respect is that my calm neighborhood is less fancy than where the downtown office was, and it's less fun to just go walk for 20 ~ 30 mins and stop by nice coffee shops or museums. I could move to a more crowded place, but it's just a different tradeoff. Buying a better bike was the best investment on that front.
nick0garvey 5y ago
I also prefer working in the office but this feels a bit over the top. Is it really way harder to get dressed at the end of the day instead of the start? Is it that much cognitive pressure to feed yourself? Working in the office has its benefits, but working from home is not a crushing experience for a programmer compared to most workers.
- closeparen 5y ago
  Think about why the NEET / basement gamer stereotype attracts such disgust, derision, and pity. The only thing different about being a remote worker is that what's on your computer screen is on average less engaging than a video game.
littlecranky67 5y ago
Your reasons are mostly individual and to some extent based on a lifestyle that you got used to because working remote wasn't an option. I often hear "i don't have a workspace/desk at my home" as a pro-commute argument. But the reason you don't have that desk is because when you moved into your flat, you didn't think of this. But if more and more employers allow to work remotely, people will make different choices on their rentals / housing construction. I personally worked remote numerous times before the pandemic (self-employed contractor but very often onsite) and made arrangements that WFH is a pleasant experience. That also included getting a coworking desk for limited periods of time, because socializing with other people is an important part of your wellbeing. The benefit of a coworking desk is, that if you go out for lunch with your collegues, you don't talk about work during lunch.
- nextlevelwizard 5y ago
  I don't want to pay more for larger apartment just so I can have dedicated office room and exact same argument goes both ways. I live 20minutes away from my office, that is by choice. I was even considering moving closer (so I could ditch car to a bike or maybe even walk) here I read that every one has 2-3 hour commute, that is on YOU and YOUR poor choices.
  - littlecranky67 5y ago
    > I don't want to pay more for larger apartment And thats a perfectly valid choice that you should be allowed to make. If you want to work at an office, you would make sure during the hiring phase that your employer agrees and provides that office to you. If the employer says that you HAVE to work from home, that is a factor that you should consider when accepting the job offer.
    - nextlevelwizard 5y ago
      Yes. Exactly. Just like if remote work is no option people who need it can consider something else. I've always had option to do both, so on days where it is beneficial for me to work from home I can still do that (like if I'm expecting a delivery), but I rather be at the office as per the reasoning in previous comments. There are many companies and many employees. I don't get why so many people are angry that I liked the pre-covid situation.
idnefju 5y ago
This whole post sounds like you don’t have control of your life. Why do you need to find an excuse to do things you want to do? Commit to a workout routine, commit to getting food or learning to cook to save money, commit to some mindful exercises to have more focus
- birdyrooster 5y ago
  because the weed, it makes it hard to hold it all together Edit: okay fine the stoners just want to stay WFH and blaze up during the day
  - goldenkey 5y ago
    Plenty of folks work long and difficult jobs while on Cannabis. Before it started giving me anxiety, I programmed on it for years. It made hard tasks more exploratory and fun. OP just sounds like a lazy manlet, not drug-induced malaise.
    - deleted 5y ago
      [deleted]
    - deleted 5y ago
      [deleted]
- nextlevelwizard 5y ago
  >Commit to a workout routine, commit to getting food or learning to cook to save money, commit to some mindful exercises to have more focus You can do that. I can just go back to office.
- enriquto 5y ago
  The whole argument against people who prefer not to WFH seems to be that they are "deeply flawed individuals that do not have control over their own life". This is ridiculous, working in situ is a legitimate preference of many people, for whatever reasons, and we need not be judged about it.
null_object 5y ago
> I can't wait to get back to the office. > being home and having no external pressure to keep working > it was easy to get out of the bed and go work out > I get to just eat lunch from office's cafeteria > still in my underpants at home after work it is way harder to dress up and go do stuff The paradox in this situation, is that some employers are considering cutting the pay [0] of people who have the self-discipline, drive and focus to not need the artificial crutch of going into an arbitrary office-space to find the motivation to do their work. [0]https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2021/aug/12/google-staff-could-see-pay-cut-if-they-opt-to-work-from-home https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2021/aug/12/google-st...
- rytis 5y ago
  Intuitively, I'd think, it should be the opposite - no need to pay for the office space, money saved, can give that to the employees. But no, instead - save money on the office, and then save even more on the salaries. Just wow.
  - chii 5y ago
    > then save even more on the salaries the problem is that remote is seen as a benefit (which it is), and so naturally must be priced as part of the salary. The fact that being remote requires some discipline, and this discipline makes for a better employee doesn't play into it - because a employer would already expect such discipline, whether it actually exists or not.
  - bradlys 5y ago
    > Intuitively, I'd think, it should be the opposite - no need to pay for the office space, money saved, can give that to the employees. But no, instead - save money on the office, and then save even more on the salaries. Just wow. Capitalism in a nutshell. :) Don't have to compete for your labor as aggressively because there are more candidates available for a lower wage. Until companies are fully socialist entities (I think the Starship Enterprise will come first), you're gonna keep seeing whatever saves the company the most money (or whatever goes straight to the execs pockets at least).
kartikarti 5y ago
I fully agree with the social aspects, but the gym and food argument feels like a lack of self-discipline. Don't start your work if you are still in your underpants ! > Food is also big draw. Now I have to worry about what I eat every day and make my food. That's extra stress and cognitive pressure that is completely avoided when I get to just eat lunch from office's cafeteria. Just use money saved on the commute and spend it at the local restaurant or order a catering.
- tomcooks 5y ago
  Hot take: learn to cook
angarg12 5y ago
You've tried remote and it doesn't work for you. Great, more power to you! However your comment about other people is out of place. Is other people taking longer breaks affecting your productivity? If so, have you brought this up to them? Otherwise it shouldn't matter to you. Personally I find remote a bliss, and I'm one of those. Almost every day I take 1 or 1:30 hours to cook some homemade meal and eat with my wife. When I feel extremely sleepy or tired in the early afternoon, I can take a quick nap and go back to work fresh and full of energy. I also take a break for exercising before my meetings in the late afternoon. To a casual observer it might look like I'm taking breaks and working less, but actually I end up doing overtime many days. I just found a flexible schedule that works for me. Butting into other people's schedules is not so different from micromanagement.
- nextlevelwizard 5y ago
  >but actually I end up doing overtime many days I am not american, so working overtime for no reason is not the norm. In fact most of the team are contractors who can not work overtime even if they wanted to. You shouldn't take my post as personal attack
hughrr 5y ago
Conversely I do less work but generate more ROI at home. I rather like worrying about food. I made myself jerk chicken and rice for lunch yesterday by taking ten minutes out to pop the chicken in the oven and then an hour out for lunch to do the rest. During the chicken prep time I thought through a problem and solved it in half the time while the chicken was in. This is a much better way to live than being time sliced into a corporate convenient canteen.
formerly_proven 5y ago
Frankly, this sounds like you are an actual manchild. > I can already see any breaks people tend to take are way longer than what they would take at the office Just because you don't have any self discipline or work ethics doesn't mean everyone else has the same problem. Just because you have no control in your life and need the structure of an office work day to get stuff done both at work and privately doesn't mean this is normal, or that it's a good - or even any kind - of argument to force everyone into the office.
- nextlevelwizard 5y ago
  Calling names makes you the mature one for sure
- einherjae 5y ago
  No need for being nasty about it, the comment flags clear things about cognitive load of choices, and you hand waive these away. Yet, actively choosing to not take these choices is a valid choice that may free up energy for other activities. I don’t see how the comment actively argues for forcing everyone into the office. Sure there’s a point about taking pauses, but that’s it.
- draw_down 5y ago
  Come on
iovrthoughtthis 5y ago
it's good to know what you need so you can select for environments / help create environments that support you :). i personally want local offices so i can have somewhere that isnt home to work without a commute. like a library for work. id hope i get to finally integrate into the local community a little better then too.
globular-toast 5y ago
Maybe you do benefit from going to the office then. But here's the thing, I don't mind if you go to the office. You can even take your free lunch, I don't mind. Just don't expect me to come in every day to make you feel bad about how long your breaks are.
- nextlevelwizard 5y ago
  I don't understand why everyone commenting takes my comment as some kind of personal attack. I don't give a flying fuck what you guys do. I, personally, can't wait to get back to office.
  - globular-toast 5y ago
    Because your description of "the office" includes me. Specifically, that "external pressure" you are talking about. You seem to require the office to be filled with drones who are monitoring you to make sure you are working. If you were just talking about working in a location that isn't your own home, then fair enough. But what you're actually talking about is going back to that broken culture we had before where everyone commuted to the office for no reason.
    - nextlevelwizard 5y ago
      >You seem to require the office to be filled with drones... Stopped reading here. There's no point since you are arguing imaginary things.
      - globular-toast 5y ago
        In that case please tell me where this "external pressure" is going to come from.
KronisLV 5y ago
> I can't wait to get back to the office. That is a valid point, since different people work better in different settings. I am personally in the opposite group. > I don't have dedicated remote work space and that really eats into my productivity. Also being home and having no external pressure to keep working I can already see any breaks people tend to take are way longer than what they would take at the office. (Now someone is going to tell me that this just shows that people need more breaks, but I don't believe that) Overall, i get way more done at home, because of my 4 monitor setup, privacy, peace and the ability to take walks to clear my head and breathe some fresh air while i consider how to solve technical problems. I cannot do that at an office setting and my mental health has improved bunches. Also, no commute has done wonders for my sleep schedule and productivity. I no longer waste 10% of my life in public transportation. > It also helps with my physical fitness. Now it is super hard to go to the gym in the morning just to come back home. When I commuted to work the gym was just on the way and it was easy to get out of the bed and go work out. My physical fitness has gotten way better since i started working remotely - i've lost about 12 kg in 2 months, since now i exercise for 1-2 hours every single day in the countryside. No anxiety about how i look while working out. No shame about not living up to anyone's expectations. Just me, nature and listening to a podcast while i jog for 5 km and do sit ups, push ups, pull ups and whatever else i want. > Food is also big draw. Now I have to worry about what I eat every day and make my food. That's extra stress and cognitive pressure that is completely avoided when I get to just eat lunch from office's cafeteria. I think that people should always make their own food, since it's both economically more responsible and on average also more healthy. I now enjoy a primarily veggie based diet and communities like /r/MealPrep have been fun to explore! Plus, my cooking skills have gotten way better. > And of course other social aspects i.e. since I am already outside it is easier to do other stuff, but when I'm still in my underpants at home after work it is way harder to dress up and go do stuff. I get to chat more with my friends remotely on my down time. I no longer worry about how i look. I no longer have to worry about someone dropping by and just making me lose the mental model of the code that i have in my head. Meetings are properly scheduled ahead of time. Noone makes assumptions about me based on my gender, age, looks or anything else. Frankly, it's great. It won't be that way for extroverted people, or those that prefer in person collaboration for any reason. It also won't be that way for people who live in the city, at least sometimes. But, living in the countryside, it's absolutely great! Also, no overpriced real estate or rent to take care of.
goldenkey 5y ago
So basically, you lack the self-discipline to be satisfied with your choices, and prefer to be enlisted in some type of nanny service? Cool, I'll opt out and instead focus on bettering my defecits so I don't need to outsource my mental fortitude.
- nextlevelwizard 5y ago
  Lol, seeth more
  - goldenkey 5y ago
    I know I didn't tell you what you want to hear. Independence will help you. God forbid there is a cataclysmic event, you will have thanked me for putting the boot up your ass.
    - nextlevelwizard 5y ago
      Sure. You can keep telling that to yourself if it makes you life less miserable.
      - goldenkey 5y ago
        You got a rude awakening. Consider yourself blessed!
  - AntiWFH 5y ago
    Based.
- TheGigaChad 5y ago
  Get cancer and die.
ijidak 5y ago
>Food is also big draw. Now I have to worry about what I eat every day and make my food Haha. Not sure which country you're from, but this definitely sounds like a first world problem. Your statement tells me that you could afford to only eat food others prepared for you in the past. (Not sure if that was a free office cafeteria) For many that is expensive and could even be an unhealthy way of life. I've never really thought of going into an office because pre-prepared food is easier to get. That's a new one.
- ajuc 5y ago
  TBH if you're a programmer in a 3rd world country you probably earn 3-5 times the median wage where you live and you can afford as much services at local prices as programmers in 1st world. Possibly more when it comes to things like food.
- devoutsalsa 5y ago
  When I was up to my eyeballs in debt, I'd eat at the office because it was a way to save money. I consumed a lot of cereal, milk, bananas, snacky things, etc. Often for dinner I'd simply eat 200g of little cheeses.
- nextlevelwizard 5y ago
  Food at work caffeteria costs 6€/meal. That's 120€/month. The food is "home style", so just normal food with salads, bread, and desert. Any food I make at home is going to cost around same. I mean you can go down obviously (just buy bag of rice and can of beans), but I don't get why this would be valid argument when we are talking about tech sallaries.
PaywallBuster 5y ago
fitness: office: go to an office, sit in a chair 8h a day with barely any breaks. home: get up any time you want, walk around, lay in bed, go outside buy something, no one looking or making comments. productivity: office: too many people moving around and talking, use headphones to isolate yourself home: no one around you, play music in the background, relax food: I think it very much depends on the company you working for. Many companies don't offer lunch, and you're going outside. What's the difference from doing it from home? Agree with the low productivity and social, but that's temporary because covid. You're forced to stay home and unable to have any fun and social times.
birdyrooster 5y ago
My biggest asset as an employee is my ability to befriend and network with boomer middle managers. That is my real job. The software is just a part of the larger game. If I am remote, I will make less money as a result. The only reason I want to go into the office is to leverage my social capital because I want to bring home the most money for my family.
mjbeswick 5y ago
I've been working from home since last February, and since then I have been more productive and worked more hours than when I was in the office. Open plan office are an absolute productivity killer for me, as they are noisy and distracting and really the worst environment possible for development! Working from home there are no distractions, so I'm able to concentrate far longer. For me it's pointless to commute three hours a day just to sit in an office and not speak to anyone, when I could use that time for other things (plus saving £3,500 a year on travel). As someone who trains at the gym two hours a day most days, working from home allows me to train more and eat better. It absolutely great being able to cook and eat proper food in my own kitchen!

ceilingcorner 5y ago

Just rent an office space or coworking desk. Problem solved.

dagw 5y ago
Using a significant chunk of my own salary each month to pay for something I used to get for free (and that my employer should provide) hardly seems like the ideal solution.
- ceilingcorner 5y ago
  I would rather pay a few hundred dollars for a private space and have control over my time/work hours, than be forced to physically commute to an office. Time > money. In my experience, most decent employers have a stipend for co-working anyway.
  - nextlevelwizard 5y ago
    But I already have control over my work hours. I don't have to work 9-5 as long as I work 37.5 hours a week. My commute is at worst 25 minutes with car (at best 15 minutes if no traffic). I can easily get up at 6 go workout for 1-1.5h then drive to work when the morning rush is gone.
- nucleardog 5y ago
  I can get some co-working spaces that look infinitely better than the office I was going to for $480/mo. For a dedicated desk with locking storage, etc. I'm saving at least $400/mo just on parking and gas right now. Even if my employer wouldn't reimburse anything (never asked), I'd eat the $80/mo to save myself 2-3 hours a day commuting.
- dv_dt 5y ago
  This is perhaps why many people look at the drive to lower the salary of people working from home with some suspicion. Wfh saves employers a lot of money in terms of providing office space. And in some concrete ways increases expenses of employees at home. (If gives back some commute costs as well as other freedoms too though). I think both employers and employees will take some time to sift though how the benefits/drawbacks rebalance from the changes that come from wfh.
- cutthegrass2 5y ago
  depending upon where you are located and your method of commute, it's likely you're spending more per month commuting than you would on a local co-working space. This is the case for a large proportion of people in the South East of the UK.
- fnomnom 5y ago
  let your company pay for it. they dont need the big office space. thats how we do it.
- mjbeswick 5y ago
  It's about the same cost as commuting, so no difference!?
midrus 5y ago
Nah, better to force everyone to go back to the office so I get free food and I can look busy all day.
- goldenkey 5y ago
  I can also play games while on the shitter for free! Once Gaben's steam deck comes out my steaming turd breaks will be even better! And don't get me started on the free 1-ply toilet paper. What a deal!
nextlevelwizard 5y ago
I mean it might be a temporary solution at best, but there aren't many places that rent less than a floor around me.

peakaboo 5y ago

> I can't wait to get back to the office. > I don't have dedicated remote work space and that really eats into my productivity. Also being home and having no external pressure to keep working I can already see any breaks people tend to take are way longer than what they would take at the office. (Now someone is going to tell me that this just shows that people need more breaks, but I don't believe that) > It also helps with my physical fitness. Now it is super hard to go to the gym in the morning just to come back home. When I commuted to work the gym was just on the way and it was easy to get out of the bed and go work out. > Food is also big draw. Now I have to worry about what I eat every day and make my food. That's extra stress and cognitive pressure that is completely avoided when I get to just eat lunch from office's cafeteria. > And of course other social aspects i.e. since I am already outside it is easier to do other stuff, but when I'm still in my underpants at home after work it is way harder to dress up and go do stuff. These are the typical reasons I see for going to the office and they all boils down to you not wanting to make your own food, not having the self discipline to work out at home, and getting started in the morning. I mean, it's fine, but I think it's helpful if we realize what going to the office is just making some people like yourself more comfortable, and others less comfortable. Because to me, that commute is killing me, and getting interrupted in the office is wiping out any energy I have at all to commit to working. At home I have food I selected myself to eat and I have a nice twin monitor setup with a comfortable chair and silence to focus. My workout routine is body weight exercises right before lunch, and I have time to relax and have a shower as well since there is no pressure.

j7ake 5y ago
Making own food that is the same quality as the hot foods at cafeteria is easily 1 hour a day extra. Not being around colleagues affects more than just self-discipline, you lose the random encounters with colleagues that often leads to new ideas and collaborations. These differences are real. And even if productivity is not affected, the new ideas that normally sparked from random interactions are diminished.
- wreath 5y ago
  I dont even care about random encounters that lead to ideas, i miss them because they were random and had relationship at work with people with whom i have no work overlap whatsoever,yet we bonded while making coffee and other type of office routine activities. Now, i rarely recognize people on slack

atregir 5y ago

I have the opposite problem working from home: I take almost no breaks, sometimes it happened I even had lunch from my desk and worked longer hours than in the office. This sucked at first, until I realized I couldn't do this for long and started being more conscious about my working hours. In the office I feel I take so many breaks, short coffee chats, water cooler chats etc. I think what you say that "any breaks people take are way longer than in the office" is not extremely accurate.

midrus 5y ago

>Food is also big draw. Now I have to worry about what I eat every day and make my food LOL

TeMPOraL 5y ago
That does indeed sound like a trivial problem to solve. Pick a local restaurant and treat it as your new cafeteria. Come lunch time, go there. Ideally, your employer would compensate you for the office benefit you're missing (at least when talking about pandemic-induced forced WFH), but WFH is likely already saving you more money, so you can probably afford it anyway.
- fabioborellini 5y ago
  It's not that trivial to have a one-hour lunch break if the local restaurant is 30 minutes away, near by the closed office. In some countries the suburbs have very few services. Also, if the subsidized commute costs 3 euros a day it is also not trivial to spend 14 euros for lunch.
  - midrus 5y ago
    Do we really need this baby sitting? Are we seriously complaining of working from home, not having to commute, and cooking our own food is a problem? In the age of groceries delivery from a click on my phone. I just can't believe it. World is going to hell and were like crying babies that can't prepare a meal by themselves.
- jusssi 5y ago
  The available selection could be a problem. Near my home, there's a sushi place, two pizzerias, a Subway, a chinese and some cafes that don't really serve anything I'd call lunch. After 1½ years I'm sick of all of them. I've been ordering from further away, but that costs 50-100% more, and many types of food lose quality in transit. Compared to the 30+ places reachable by foot within 45min lunch break at the office (and having real people to talk with while eating), WHF has really destroyed my lunch breaks.

makeitdouble 5y ago

I am all in for WFH, but deeply agree with your points. Having a dedicated working space is not trivial; and it's not just isolating the space, there is all the "office management" part, having well fitted furnitures, lighting, drinks, noise management etc. Basically what was someone else's job is now each employee's responsibility. I'm fine with it, but it should be noted. Physical fitness was already in that realm I think, though we were forced to have at least some exercise to move to the office. My hardest impact on that respect is that my calm neighborhood is less fancy than where the downtown office was, and it's less fun to just go walk for 20 ~ 30 mins and stop by nice coffee shops or museums. I could move to a more crowded place, but it's just a different tradeoff. Buying a better bike was the best investment on that front.

nick0garvey 5y ago

I also prefer working in the office but this feels a bit over the top. Is it really way harder to get dressed at the end of the day instead of the start? Is it that much cognitive pressure to feed yourself? Working in the office has its benefits, but working from home is not a crushing experience for a programmer compared to most workers.

closeparen 5y ago
Think about why the NEET / basement gamer stereotype attracts such disgust, derision, and pity. The only thing different about being a remote worker is that what's on your computer screen is on average less engaging than a video game.

littlecranky67 5y ago

Your reasons are mostly individual and to some extent based on a lifestyle that you got used to because working remote wasn't an option. I often hear "i don't have a workspace/desk at my home" as a pro-commute argument. But the reason you don't have that desk is because when you moved into your flat, you didn't think of this. But if more and more employers allow to work remotely, people will make different choices on their rentals / housing construction. I personally worked remote numerous times before the pandemic (self-employed contractor but very often onsite) and made arrangements that WFH is a pleasant experience. That also included getting a coworking desk for limited periods of time, because socializing with other people is an important part of your wellbeing. The benefit of a coworking desk is, that if you go out for lunch with your collegues, you don't talk about work during lunch.

nextlevelwizard 5y ago
I don't want to pay more for larger apartment just so I can have dedicated office room and exact same argument goes both ways. I live 20minutes away from my office, that is by choice. I was even considering moving closer (so I could ditch car to a bike or maybe even walk) here I read that every one has 2-3 hour commute, that is on YOU and YOUR poor choices.
- littlecranky67 5y ago
  > I don't want to pay more for larger apartment And thats a perfectly valid choice that you should be allowed to make. If you want to work at an office, you would make sure during the hiring phase that your employer agrees and provides that office to you. If the employer says that you HAVE to work from home, that is a factor that you should consider when accepting the job offer.
  - nextlevelwizard 5y ago
    Yes. Exactly. Just like if remote work is no option people who need it can consider something else. I've always had option to do both, so on days where it is beneficial for me to work from home I can still do that (like if I'm expecting a delivery), but I rather be at the office as per the reasoning in previous comments. There are many companies and many employees. I don't get why so many people are angry that I liked the pre-covid situation.

idnefju 5y ago

This whole post sounds like you don’t have control of your life. Why do you need to find an excuse to do things you want to do? Commit to a workout routine, commit to getting food or learning to cook to save money, commit to some mindful exercises to have more focus

birdyrooster 5y ago
because the weed, it makes it hard to hold it all together Edit: okay fine the stoners just want to stay WFH and blaze up during the day
- goldenkey 5y ago
  Plenty of folks work long and difficult jobs while on Cannabis. Before it started giving me anxiety, I programmed on it for years. It made hard tasks more exploratory and fun. OP just sounds like a lazy manlet, not drug-induced malaise.
  - deleted 5y ago
    [deleted]
  - deleted 5y ago
    [deleted]
nextlevelwizard 5y ago
>Commit to a workout routine, commit to getting food or learning to cook to save money, commit to some mindful exercises to have more focus You can do that. I can just go back to office.
enriquto 5y ago
The whole argument against people who prefer not to WFH seems to be that they are "deeply flawed individuals that do not have control over their own life". This is ridiculous, working in situ is a legitimate preference of many people, for whatever reasons, and we need not be judged about it.

null_object 5y ago

> I can't wait to get back to the office. > being home and having no external pressure to keep working > it was easy to get out of the bed and go work out > I get to just eat lunch from office's cafeteria > still in my underpants at home after work it is way harder to dress up and go do stuff The paradox in this situation, is that some employers are considering cutting the pay [0] of people who have the self-discipline, drive and focus to not need the artificial crutch of going into an arbitrary office-space to find the motivation to do their work. [0]https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2021/aug/12/google-staff-could-see-pay-cut-if-they-opt-to-work-from-home https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2021/aug/12/google-st...

rytis 5y ago
Intuitively, I'd think, it should be the opposite - no need to pay for the office space, money saved, can give that to the employees. But no, instead - save money on the office, and then save even more on the salaries. Just wow.
- chii 5y ago
  > then save even more on the salaries the problem is that remote is seen as a benefit (which it is), and so naturally must be priced as part of the salary. The fact that being remote requires some discipline, and this discipline makes for a better employee doesn't play into it - because a employer would already expect such discipline, whether it actually exists or not.
- bradlys 5y ago
  > Intuitively, I'd think, it should be the opposite - no need to pay for the office space, money saved, can give that to the employees. But no, instead - save money on the office, and then save even more on the salaries. Just wow. Capitalism in a nutshell. :) Don't have to compete for your labor as aggressively because there are more candidates available for a lower wage. Until companies are fully socialist entities (I think the Starship Enterprise will come first), you're gonna keep seeing whatever saves the company the most money (or whatever goes straight to the execs pockets at least).

kartikarti 5y ago

I fully agree with the social aspects, but the gym and food argument feels like a lack of self-discipline. Don't start your work if you are still in your underpants ! > Food is also big draw. Now I have to worry about what I eat every day and make my food. That's extra stress and cognitive pressure that is completely avoided when I get to just eat lunch from office's cafeteria. Just use money saved on the commute and spend it at the local restaurant or order a catering.

tomcooks 5y ago
Hot take: learn to cook

angarg12 5y ago

You've tried remote and it doesn't work for you. Great, more power to you! However your comment about other people is out of place. Is other people taking longer breaks affecting your productivity? If so, have you brought this up to them? Otherwise it shouldn't matter to you. Personally I find remote a bliss, and I'm one of those. Almost every day I take 1 or 1:30 hours to cook some homemade meal and eat with my wife. When I feel extremely sleepy or tired in the early afternoon, I can take a quick nap and go back to work fresh and full of energy. I also take a break for exercising before my meetings in the late afternoon. To a casual observer it might look like I'm taking breaks and working less, but actually I end up doing overtime many days. I just found a flexible schedule that works for me. Butting into other people's schedules is not so different from micromanagement.

nextlevelwizard 5y ago
>but actually I end up doing overtime many days I am not american, so working overtime for no reason is not the norm. In fact most of the team are contractors who can not work overtime even if they wanted to. You shouldn't take my post as personal attack

hughrr 5y ago

Conversely I do less work but generate more ROI at home. I rather like worrying about food. I made myself jerk chicken and rice for lunch yesterday by taking ten minutes out to pop the chicken in the oven and then an hour out for lunch to do the rest. During the chicken prep time I thought through a problem and solved it in half the time while the chicken was in. This is a much better way to live than being time sliced into a corporate convenient canteen.

formerly_proven 5y ago

Frankly, this sounds like you are an actual manchild. > I can already see any breaks people tend to take are way longer than what they would take at the office Just because you don't have any self discipline or work ethics doesn't mean everyone else has the same problem. Just because you have no control in your life and need the structure of an office work day to get stuff done both at work and privately doesn't mean this is normal, or that it's a good - or even any kind - of argument to force everyone into the office.

nextlevelwizard 5y ago
Calling names makes you the mature one for sure
einherjae 5y ago
No need for being nasty about it, the comment flags clear things about cognitive load of choices, and you hand waive these away. Yet, actively choosing to not take these choices is a valid choice that may free up energy for other activities. I don’t see how the comment actively argues for forcing everyone into the office. Sure there’s a point about taking pauses, but that’s it.
draw_down 5y ago
Come on

iovrthoughtthis 5y ago

it's good to know what you need so you can select for environments / help create environments that support you :). i personally want local offices so i can have somewhere that isnt home to work without a commute. like a library for work. id hope i get to finally integrate into the local community a little better then too.

globular-toast 5y ago

Maybe you do benefit from going to the office then. But here's the thing, I don't mind if you go to the office. You can even take your free lunch, I don't mind. Just don't expect me to come in every day to make you feel bad about how long your breaks are.

nextlevelwizard 5y ago
I don't understand why everyone commenting takes my comment as some kind of personal attack. I don't give a flying fuck what you guys do. I, personally, can't wait to get back to office.
- globular-toast 5y ago
  Because your description of "the office" includes me. Specifically, that "external pressure" you are talking about. You seem to require the office to be filled with drones who are monitoring you to make sure you are working. If you were just talking about working in a location that isn't your own home, then fair enough. But what you're actually talking about is going back to that broken culture we had before where everyone commuted to the office for no reason.
  - nextlevelwizard 5y ago
    >You seem to require the office to be filled with drones... Stopped reading here. There's no point since you are arguing imaginary things.
    - globular-toast 5y ago
      In that case please tell me where this "external pressure" is going to come from.

KronisLV 5y ago

> I can't wait to get back to the office. That is a valid point, since different people work better in different settings. I am personally in the opposite group. > I don't have dedicated remote work space and that really eats into my productivity. Also being home and having no external pressure to keep working I can already see any breaks people tend to take are way longer than what they would take at the office. (Now someone is going to tell me that this just shows that people need more breaks, but I don't believe that) Overall, i get way more done at home, because of my 4 monitor setup, privacy, peace and the ability to take walks to clear my head and breathe some fresh air while i consider how to solve technical problems. I cannot do that at an office setting and my mental health has improved bunches. Also, no commute has done wonders for my sleep schedule and productivity. I no longer waste 10% of my life in public transportation. > It also helps with my physical fitness. Now it is super hard to go to the gym in the morning just to come back home. When I commuted to work the gym was just on the way and it was easy to get out of the bed and go work out. My physical fitness has gotten way better since i started working remotely - i've lost about 12 kg in 2 months, since now i exercise for 1-2 hours every single day in the countryside. No anxiety about how i look while working out. No shame about not living up to anyone's expectations. Just me, nature and listening to a podcast while i jog for 5 km and do sit ups, push ups, pull ups and whatever else i want. > Food is also big draw. Now I have to worry about what I eat every day and make my food. That's extra stress and cognitive pressure that is completely avoided when I get to just eat lunch from office's cafeteria. I think that people should always make their own food, since it's both economically more responsible and on average also more healthy. I now enjoy a primarily veggie based diet and communities like /r/MealPrep have been fun to explore! Plus, my cooking skills have gotten way better. > And of course other social aspects i.e. since I am already outside it is easier to do other stuff, but when I'm still in my underpants at home after work it is way harder to dress up and go do stuff. I get to chat more with my friends remotely on my down time. I no longer worry about how i look. I no longer have to worry about someone dropping by and just making me lose the mental model of the code that i have in my head. Meetings are properly scheduled ahead of time. Noone makes assumptions about me based on my gender, age, looks or anything else. Frankly, it's great. It won't be that way for extroverted people, or those that prefer in person collaboration for any reason. It also won't be that way for people who live in the city, at least sometimes. But, living in the countryside, it's absolutely great! Also, no overpriced real estate or rent to take care of.

goldenkey 5y ago

So basically, you lack the self-discipline to be satisfied with your choices, and prefer to be enlisted in some type of nanny service? Cool, I'll opt out and instead focus on bettering my defecits so I don't need to outsource my mental fortitude.

nextlevelwizard 5y ago
Lol, seeth more
- goldenkey 5y ago
  I know I didn't tell you what you want to hear. Independence will help you. God forbid there is a cataclysmic event, you will have thanked me for putting the boot up your ass.
  - nextlevelwizard 5y ago
    Sure. You can keep telling that to yourself if it makes you life less miserable.
    - goldenkey 5y ago
      You got a rude awakening. Consider yourself blessed!
- AntiWFH 5y ago
  Based.
TheGigaChad 5y ago
Get cancer and die.

ijidak 5y ago

>Food is also big draw. Now I have to worry about what I eat every day and make my food Haha. Not sure which country you're from, but this definitely sounds like a first world problem. Your statement tells me that you could afford to only eat food others prepared for you in the past. (Not sure if that was a free office cafeteria) For many that is expensive and could even be an unhealthy way of life. I've never really thought of going into an office because pre-prepared food is easier to get. That's a new one.

ajuc 5y ago
TBH if you're a programmer in a 3rd world country you probably earn 3-5 times the median wage where you live and you can afford as much services at local prices as programmers in 1st world. Possibly more when it comes to things like food.
devoutsalsa 5y ago
When I was up to my eyeballs in debt, I'd eat at the office because it was a way to save money. I consumed a lot of cereal, milk, bananas, snacky things, etc. Often for dinner I'd simply eat 200g of little cheeses.
nextlevelwizard 5y ago
Food at work caffeteria costs 6€/meal. That's 120€/month. The food is "home style", so just normal food with salads, bread, and desert. Any food I make at home is going to cost around same. I mean you can go down obviously (just buy bag of rice and can of beans), but I don't get why this would be valid argument when we are talking about tech sallaries.

PaywallBuster 5y ago

fitness: office: go to an office, sit in a chair 8h a day with barely any breaks. home: get up any time you want, walk around, lay in bed, go outside buy something, no one looking or making comments. productivity: office: too many people moving around and talking, use headphones to isolate yourself home: no one around you, play music in the background, relax food: I think it very much depends on the company you working for. Many companies don't offer lunch, and you're going outside. What's the difference from doing it from home? Agree with the low productivity and social, but that's temporary because covid. You're forced to stay home and unable to have any fun and social times.

birdyrooster 5y ago

My biggest asset as an employee is my ability to befriend and network with boomer middle managers. That is my real job. The software is just a part of the larger game. If I am remote, I will make less money as a result. The only reason I want to go into the office is to leverage my social capital because I want to bring home the most money for my family.

mjbeswick 5y ago

I've been working from home since last February, and since then I have been more productive and worked more hours than when I was in the office. Open plan office are an absolute productivity killer for me, as they are noisy and distracting and really the worst environment possible for development! Working from home there are no distractions, so I'm able to concentrate far longer. For me it's pointless to commute three hours a day just to sit in an office and not speak to anyone, when I could use that time for other things (plus saving £3,500 a year on travel). As someone who trains at the gym two hours a day most days, working from home allows me to train more and eat better. It absolutely great being able to cook and eat proper food in my own kitchen!