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> Even if you go out and have a drink with them, they won't stop talking about it (it happened to me personally many times). Are you an lobbyist than? I can't

> Even if you go out and have a drink with them, they won't stop talking about it (it happened to me personally many times). Are you an lobbyist than? I can't imagine any other reason Breyer would talk personally to someone with our opinions while having a drink together. > > Digital privacy is demonstrably being eroded on many fronts, all over the world > This is not the case though. Quite a distorted view on reality given all the surveillance laws passed over the last few years… It feels by now as there would be new attacks on peoples freedom form the government almost on a daily base. Enjoy the a look at the tip of the iceberg: https://www.statewatch.org/observatories/ https://www.statewatch.org/observatories/

peoplefromibiza 5y ago
> Are you an lobbyist than? I can't imagine any other reason Breyer would talk personally to someone with our opinions while having a drink together. No, I lived in Bruseels for a while with my girlfriend at the time that worked for the parliament. Brussels is a small city and elected representatives are humans, just like us, they go out just like the rest of us. I was shocked too when I realized they can't stop talking about their job, not even for a second. > Quite a distorted view on reality given all the surveillance laws passed over the last few years… Specifically, which one? In Europe I mean. I'm familiar with statewatch, they are a reliable source, but they treat civil liberties as an absolute value, a parliament represent every possible political opinion that the people elected, they have different jobs and represent different interests. Democracy is not the same thing as "the perfect place where nothing we disagree with ever happens". As a term of comparison: do you think people are more surveilled in Europe or in the United States? (just mentioning the two champions of liberal democracy, even countries like Japan are worse put than these 2 in terms of state surveillance.)
- still_grokking 5y ago
  > > Are you an lobbyist than? > No, […] So why are you talking like a typical right-wing lobbyist? > > Quite a distorted view on reality given all the surveillance laws passed over the last few years… > Specifically, which one? > In Europe I mean. > I'm familiar with statewatch, they are a reliable source, but […] Anybody having a look at the statewatch website will instantly notice that your question doesn't makes any sense given that we're counting the latest surveillance laws by the dozens (maybe even by the hundreds by now), and that your claim to know the website seems dishonest therefore. Also you're trying to relativize that source by all what follows that "but"… > As a term of comparison: do you think people are more surveilled in Europe or in the United States? Why do you try to derail this conversation? I'm surely not baiting into whataboutism… https://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/tu-quoque https://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/tu-quoque The rest of that question is even loaded with a whole battalion of subtle attempts to completely derail that thread. Nice rhetoric for someone who's not professional in that field. ;-)
  - peoplefromibiza 5y ago
    I am vouching for your comment because I think you made fair criticism and I don't wanna let no stone unturned. I am a programmer, I don't work in politics, never had, never will. I have no horse in the race. Honest to the god(s) that you might or might not believe in. It's simply not what I am good at. I just attended informal meetings with people working for EU institutions, it's not uncommon in Brussels, I met many more when I was working in the music concert industry, we shared few drinks and talked about the bands that played that night, not all the people working in EU institutions lobby, but the elected representatives usually do. It's simply how things are. I also have a few with people working for the UN in Rome, where I was born and live. They enjoy a pint the same way I do, we happen to live in the same neighborhood, there's nothing fishy about it, believe me. I have no chances of becoming the next Kofi Annan.

peoplefromibiza 5y ago

> Are you an lobbyist than? I can't imagine any other reason Breyer would talk personally to someone with our opinions while having a drink together. No, I lived in Bruseels for a while with my girlfriend at the time that worked for the parliament. Brussels is a small city and elected representatives are humans, just like us, they go out just like the rest of us. I was shocked too when I realized they can't stop talking about their job, not even for a second. > Quite a distorted view on reality given all the surveillance laws passed over the last few years… Specifically, which one? In Europe I mean. I'm familiar with statewatch, they are a reliable source, but they treat civil liberties as an absolute value, a parliament represent every possible political opinion that the people elected, they have different jobs and represent different interests. Democracy is not the same thing as "the perfect place where nothing we disagree with ever happens". As a term of comparison: do you think people are more surveilled in Europe or in the United States? (just mentioning the two champions of liberal democracy, even countries like Japan are worse put than these 2 in terms of state surveillance.)

still_grokking 5y ago
> > Are you an lobbyist than? > No, […] So why are you talking like a typical right-wing lobbyist? > > Quite a distorted view on reality given all the surveillance laws passed over the last few years… > Specifically, which one? > In Europe I mean. > I'm familiar with statewatch, they are a reliable source, but […] Anybody having a look at the statewatch website will instantly notice that your question doesn't makes any sense given that we're counting the latest surveillance laws by the dozens (maybe even by the hundreds by now), and that your claim to know the website seems dishonest therefore. Also you're trying to relativize that source by all what follows that "but"… > As a term of comparison: do you think people are more surveilled in Europe or in the United States? Why do you try to derail this conversation? I'm surely not baiting into whataboutism… https://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/tu-quoque https://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/tu-quoque The rest of that question is even loaded with a whole battalion of subtle attempts to completely derail that thread. Nice rhetoric for someone who's not professional in that field. ;-)
- peoplefromibiza 5y ago
  I am vouching for your comment because I think you made fair criticism and I don't wanna let no stone unturned. I am a programmer, I don't work in politics, never had, never will. I have no horse in the race. Honest to the god(s) that you might or might not believe in. It's simply not what I am good at. I just attended informal meetings with people working for EU institutions, it's not uncommon in Brussels, I met many more when I was working in the music concert industry, we shared few drinks and talked about the bands that played that night, not all the people working in EU institutions lobby, but the elected representatives usually do. It's simply how things are. I also have a few with people working for the UN in Rome, where I was born and live. They enjoy a pint the same way I do, we happen to live in the same neighborhood, there's nothing fishy about it, believe me. I have no chances of becoming the next Kofi Annan.