4 ms·

So ... how do you convince a country without money to spend a grand lot of money to clean up their CO2 emissions? Does a first-world country offer to pay them

So ... how do you convince a country without money to spend a grand lot of money to clean up their CO2 emissions? Does a first-world country offer to pay them billions...? Or perhaps a first-world country should blacklist them from global trade until they become compliant. Perhaps they can't afford it, and it would be seen as a bad act. Either way, what they dump in the atmosphere affects everyone. What they dump in the ocean, too. Also sad to see Japan on that list. I thought that they were generally more technologically advanced than the other countries on the 'blame list' which tend to be generally 2nd/3rd world. After all, they have pioneered robotics, process engineering, cutting edge trains, and electric/hydrogen/hybrid automotive for several decades now.

Dumblydorr 5y ago
China is paying countries in Africa to install fossil fuel infrastructure. So, actually the opposite of what you write is already happening.
- bakuninsbart 5y ago
  That seems counter-intuitive, why should China pay for other countries energy sectors? Do you have a source for this?
schemescape 5y ago
They could sell carbon offsets to fund the replacement.
- syockit 5y ago
  Where is the carbon offset going to come from?
  - aetherspawn 5y ago
    Carbon offset futures I guess. Still, the moment that the government says "you need to pay big for your CO2" and the company decides "OK, let's buy some carbon offset futures offshore", that distills down to "let's send a billion dollars offshore for no tangible product", in which case from a capitalist POV they've basically donated the money. What would motivate the government not to just take it as tax money instead and use it to build more energy in their own country.
  - schemescape 5y ago
    Maybe I'm misinterpreting your question, but my understanding is that funding carbon emission-reducing projects is one of the ways carbon offsets typically work. From https://science.howstuffworks.com/environmental/green-science/carbon-offset.htm https://science.howstuffworks.com/environmental/green-scienc... : > When you buy an offset, you fund projects that reduce greenhouse gas (GHG) emissions. Edit: maybe you meant "how is it reducing carbon in the atmosphere today?" whereas I meant reducing total emissions over a period of time that extends into the future. A sibling comment brought this up as well.
HillRat 5y ago
If just South Korea, Germany, and Japan cleaned up their superpolluters, it sounds like that alone would go a long way to reducing emissions.
jasonwatkinspdx 5y ago
Yeah, it's somewhat surprising but Japan also has a number of large oil fired power plants.
imtringued 5y ago
Well, you'll need CO2 tariffs.
syockit 5y ago
> they have pioneered robotics, process engineering, cutting edge trains, and electric/hydrogen/hybrid automotive A common theme among these technologies is that they make for lucrative business. Automotive business is big, robotics and process engineering make for better yield (as for trains, maybe they just have passion for trains). Not so for clean energy. Japan had a large chunk of energy generation coming from nuclear power until 2011 so there wasn't any incentive for looking for alternative solutions as what they had was already clean and cheap. It's been 10 years since the disaster but I think that is still not enough time for them to have an alternative solution running.

Dumblydorr 5y ago

China is paying countries in Africa to install fossil fuel infrastructure. So, actually the opposite of what you write is already happening.

bakuninsbart 5y ago
That seems counter-intuitive, why should China pay for other countries energy sectors? Do you have a source for this?

schemescape 5y ago

They could sell carbon offsets to fund the replacement.

syockit 5y ago
Where is the carbon offset going to come from?
- aetherspawn 5y ago
  Carbon offset futures I guess. Still, the moment that the government says "you need to pay big for your CO2" and the company decides "OK, let's buy some carbon offset futures offshore", that distills down to "let's send a billion dollars offshore for no tangible product", in which case from a capitalist POV they've basically donated the money. What would motivate the government not to just take it as tax money instead and use it to build more energy in their own country.
- schemescape 5y ago
  Maybe I'm misinterpreting your question, but my understanding is that funding carbon emission-reducing projects is one of the ways carbon offsets typically work. From https://science.howstuffworks.com/environmental/green-science/carbon-offset.htm https://science.howstuffworks.com/environmental/green-scienc... : > When you buy an offset, you fund projects that reduce greenhouse gas (GHG) emissions. Edit: maybe you meant "how is it reducing carbon in the atmosphere today?" whereas I meant reducing total emissions over a period of time that extends into the future. A sibling comment brought this up as well.

HillRat 5y ago

If just South Korea, Germany, and Japan cleaned up their superpolluters, it sounds like that alone would go a long way to reducing emissions.

jasonwatkinspdx 5y ago

Yeah, it's somewhat surprising but Japan also has a number of large oil fired power plants.

imtringued 5y ago

Well, you'll need CO2 tariffs.

syockit 5y ago

> they have pioneered robotics, process engineering, cutting edge trains, and electric/hydrogen/hybrid automotive A common theme among these technologies is that they make for lucrative business. Automotive business is big, robotics and process engineering make for better yield (as for trains, maybe they just have passion for trains). Not so for clean energy. Japan had a large chunk of energy generation coming from nuclear power until 2011 so there wasn't any incentive for looking for alternative solutions as what they had was already clean and cheap. It's been 10 years since the disaster but I think that is still not enough time for them to have an alternative solution running.