3 ms·

Visual derivative is a preprocessed picture itself, and it's part of the "safety voucher". It may be grayscale and resized/normalized in other ways. Only apple

by megous 5y ago

Visual derivative is a preprocessed picture itself, and it's part of the "safety voucher". It may be grayscale and resized/normalized in other ways. Only apple knows exactly what it is. It's only a matter of time until internet trolls find a way to abuse this. The database is stored on user's devices, so someone downloading it and permuting innocuous images enough until they match the database, and then spreading them for funzies via some underhanded method (wallpaper download sites?)... is not too far fetched.

an_account_name 5y ago
If they can do a manual review at all, then there isn’t end to end encryption anymore, so I’m missing what the point of client side scanning is.
- praseodym 5y ago
  Apple doesn't currently have end-to-end encryption for iCloud Photos either: https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT202303 https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT202303
  - matwood 5y ago
    Not today. I think moving CSAM from the server where it's done today to device is in preparation for announcing e2e for iCloud photos.
    - Spooky23 5y ago
      That the insanity of all of this hand waving. Literally every public photo service does this today.
    - ric2b 5y ago
      Apple has gotten a ton of heat over this and they haven't once mentioned that e2e on iCloud is something they're working on or that this technology would make possible, so can people stop spreading this narrative that this is their goal? It's completely baseless.
- Retric 5y ago
  End to end encryption of messages is by comparison easy as the devices can handle all of that internally. However, losing your iPhone is one of the main reasons to have an iCloud backup. Require a user to come up with a private key and any user who lost it also loses all their data. Most people don’t really want end to end on consumer backup services, because of the associated risks. If however you don’t want unsecured backups you can handle this manually. Of course nobody wants the company to actually look at your data, but that’s a separate issue.
  - ric2b 5y ago
    The main selling point of Apple is how well integrated the ecosystem is, they could make it super simple to backup the private key on your different devices like watch, tablet and laptop.
madeofpalk 5y ago
Most of the time, Apple seems to think through what bad actors will do with their stuff. Their scale and (perceived) reputation basically requires this.

by megous 5y ago

an_account_name 5y ago

If they can do a manual review at all, then there isn’t end to end encryption anymore, so I’m missing what the point of client side scanning is.

praseodym 5y ago
Apple doesn't currently have end-to-end encryption for iCloud Photos either: https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT202303 https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT202303
- matwood 5y ago
  Not today. I think moving CSAM from the server where it's done today to device is in preparation for announcing e2e for iCloud photos.
  - Spooky23 5y ago
    That the insanity of all of this hand waving. Literally every public photo service does this today.
  - ric2b 5y ago
    Apple has gotten a ton of heat over this and they haven't once mentioned that e2e on iCloud is something they're working on or that this technology would make possible, so can people stop spreading this narrative that this is their goal? It's completely baseless.
Retric 5y ago
End to end encryption of messages is by comparison easy as the devices can handle all of that internally. However, losing your iPhone is one of the main reasons to have an iCloud backup. Require a user to come up with a private key and any user who lost it also loses all their data. Most people don’t really want end to end on consumer backup services, because of the associated risks. If however you don’t want unsecured backups you can handle this manually. Of course nobody wants the company to actually look at your data, but that’s a separate issue.
- ric2b 5y ago
  The main selling point of Apple is how well integrated the ecosystem is, they could make it super simple to backup the private key on your different devices like watch, tablet and laptop.

madeofpalk 5y ago

Most of the time, Apple seems to think through what bad actors will do with their stuff. Their scale and (perceived) reputation basically requires this.